Bray's One Month Mead

Williams 728
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Back to the bomm. So far ive made a 6 gal batch and started a 1 gal batch 5 days ago. They both taste horrific and smell of bannana. I know that is yeast stress. I payed attention of gravity and added nutrients when needed. Not sure whats wrong. This also might be a stupid question but ill ask anyway, once the yeast puts out that flavor can you reuse yeast later or will it always put out those off flavors? Dont want to hurt future meads u know
 
Im not 100% if the 1 gal bung was new or not. I do wash them well before and sanitize. But 6 gal was done in a bucket, sanitized before and after opening each time.
 
Good question... Any recommendations on this recipe for carbing, bottling/kegging, and back sweetening with or without sulfites/sorbates?
 
I am going to filter with a sterile filter and then keg at 18psi at 35 degrees for half the batch and the other half I will also filter but go with no carb and sulfite/sorbate for longer term storage..... At least that is the plan right now.... Maybe
 
You can filter and/or keg it just fine. I use 5 psi for dispensing only because I don't like it carbonated, but you certainly can.

Filtering is fine if you are drinking it immediately. If you are going to age it, the yeast help it to age.
 
Okay I'll try brewing it at a lower temperature the last two were done in the 68 - 72 degree range. Do you think the saved 1388 yeast will be ok because no where around me sells it and it takes a good week or so to get a new pouch
 
usmcbalzano said:
Okay I'll try brewing it at a lower temperature the last two were done in the 68 - 72 degree range. Do you think the saved 1388 yeast will be ok because no where around me sells it and it takes a good week or so to get a new pouch
Click to expand...

Note that this is not mead specific advice, just generic yeast handling advice:

In general, beer yeasts will adapt to the type of sugars they are eating -- so if you feed a strain cider (no maltose) it will adapt to be better at cider.

So don't change directly between honey / juice / malt, but keep the strains branched and stored separately for optimal performance.

For you, I'd recommend you make a large starter with honey and some of your 1388 yeast from the previous batch, and it should be fine.
 
andrewmaixner said:
Note that this is not mead specific advice, just generic yeast handling advice:

In general, beer yeasts will adapt to the type of sugars they are eating -- so if you feed a strain cider (no maltose) it will adapt to be better at cider.

So don't change directly between honey / juice / malt, but keep the strains branched and stored separately for optimal performance.

For you, I'd recommend you make a large starter with honey and some of your 1388 yeast from the previous batch, and it should be fine.
Click to expand...

does this advice mean that the yeast from a cyser is best left as a cyser and or other styles? or simply a mead is best left that way? i too was hoping to reuse the yeast cake in future batches> thanks
 
Pinchecharlie said:
does this advice mean that the yeast from a cyser is best left as a cyser and or other styles? or simply a mead is best left that way? i too was hoping to reuse the yeast cake in future batches> thanks
Click to expand...
probably, in general, pretty much :p . yeast biology is not an exact science at the homebrewing level, so these are just general principles. You could possibly also 're-breed' a yeast to a different sugar profile over a couple steps of building up starters with a different nutrient, but then you may as well just buy a new pack from the manufacturer.
 
I was wanting to save my yeast (1388) from my first bomm to reuse, but Something came up after I racked it off the yeast so it has set with about an inch of mead on it. Pitch it or try to build a starter with it?
 
actech said:
I was wanting to save my yeast (1388) from my first bomm to reuse, but Something came up after I racked it off the yeast so it has set with about an inch of mead on it. Pitch it or try to build a starter with it?
Click to expand...


You can try a starter. Has it been in the fridge?
 
loveofrose said:
Results are in for the Dry Yeast BOMM and Aromatic Mead Experiment here:
https://denardbrewing.com/blog/post/DryBOMMAromatic/

Long story short, Safbrew Abbaye Ale yeast is a dry yeast alternative to Wyeast 1388 that performs equal to or better.

Hope this helps!
Click to expand...

Good to know! I've actually switched to Fermentis/Safbrew Abbaye Ale as my belgian dubble yeast of choice, after comparing several of them consecutively (chimay, westmalle, t58).

NOTE: this is NOT the same as Danstar/Lallemand Abbaye Belgian Ale Yeast, which I have not tested. You refer to both Lallemand Abbaye and Safbrew Abbaye in your experiment. They are different yeasts. Which did you use?
yeast_abbaye_1.jpg
2215_Safbrew_Abbaye_Dry_Beer_Yeast_Back.jpg
 
loveofrose said:
Results are in for the Dry Yeast BOMM and Aromatic Mead Experiment here:
https://denardbrewing.com/blog/post/DryBOMMAromatic/

Long story short, Safbrew Abbaye Ale yeast is a dry yeast alternative to Wyeast 1388 that performs equal to or better.

Hope this helps!
Click to expand...

Apparently my career choice of farmer has gotten me far behind in my quick mead trials seeing as how you are a full trial past me Lol!

Just finished checking out your dry yeast bomm experiments and I have to say I am extremely surprised at some of the yeast choices! Mind if I ask what made you try CBC-1 and D21?

Going to update my "quick mead" trials thread as my yeasts arrive either today or tomorrow. Really need to get the thread title changed as your Bomm method certainly differs from the "quick mead" method that I've adapted. All due respect to you of course for all your testing and experimentation you have done!

First trial will include the 1388, Cote de Blanc, Belle Saison, T58, Nottingham and Abbaye. Wish me luck!
 
andrewmaixner said:
Note that this is not mead specific advice, just generic yeast handling advice:

In general, beer yeasts will adapt to the type of sugars they are eating -- so if you feed a strain cider (no maltose) it will adapt to be better at cider.

So don't change directly between honey / juice / malt, but keep the strains branched and stored separately for optimal performance.

For you, I'd recommend you make a large starter with honey and some of your 1388 yeast from the previous batch, and it should be fine.
Click to expand...


I am planning on pouring new must directly onto the yeast cake from the last batch. :ban::ban:
 
loveofrose said:
I included my reasons on my site, so feel free to let me know what you think. I especially wish you luck on saison yeast. I've only had that one waste good honey.
Click to expand...

I am surprised to hear you've had such bad experiences with saison yeast. The best cyser I've ever made, even tasted, used Belle fermented between 60-65.

Either way, I only test with 1 gallon batches and have 25 gallons of honey to experiment with so no big loss if it doesn't turn out.
 
Just noticed your website is listing tbps and this site says tsp. i am guessing you meant tsp? That is what i used in the last batch as tbsp sounds like a lot
 
Annnd I just read the top of the recipe on the website with the disclaimer for this. Damn...i guessed wrong.

Oh well, the last batch came out good and went dry with no off flavors using tsp instead of tbsp, I am in the start of a new batch now that has had first feeding in tsp. Think I will adjust and add more now
 
These days, I'm moving to Fermaid O. You have to use a lot more of it (1 TBSP per addition per gallon), but the mead is more aromatic and you don't have to worry about overdoing DAP.
 
I have some Fermaid O but it came too late for this batch. Would it be OK to switch it up for the 2/3 break?

Do you use Fermaid O by itself with no dap?

And I just want to say thank you for all of your work on this and other recipes / experiments.

The batch I have going now is actually using danstar abbaye ale yeast (your aromatic dry yeast suggestion from another thread) since it did not take off when I pitched on the previous yeast cake of wlp1388... My brew shop did not have any more of that.
 
loveofrose said:
These days, I'm moving to Fermaid O. You have to use a lot more of it (1 TBSP per addition per gallon), but the mead is more aromatic and you don't have to worry about overdoing DAP.
Click to expand...

Could you update the original post with the Fermaid-O ratio also, to benefit new people? I order a big pack of it a while ago and plan to use it in the next batch.
 
loveofrose said:
Northern Brewer sells potassium bicarbonate. It has come to my attention that calling it potassium carbonate instead of potassium bicarbonate had caused some confusion. They are the same thing.
Sorry for any confusion!
Click to expand...

I've been looking all over for K2CO3 and all I can find is KHCO3 and they are not the same thing, but you can convert the bicarbonate in to carbonate by baking it. Is that what you are doing, or are you using the Northern Brewer product (whatever it really is) just like it is?

I have some Wyeast 1762 (Belgian Abbey II, supposed to be Rochefort strain) and T-58 dry belgian yeast; have you tried either of those?

Thank you for starting this thread. I've made mead twice; the first time was the ginger mead in Charles Papazian's book, and 20 years later my dad still talks about how good it was. But it had to age for a year before it was drinkable. The second time, I made just a straight-up dry mead using clover honey and I dont know what yeast -- it kinda tasted like cardboard and ass all at the same time. I dumped it. :( A one gallon batch of something that tastes good quickly is just what I need.
 
Alchemy said:
I have some Fermaid O but it came too late for this batch. Would it be OK to switch it up for the 2/3 break?

Do you use Fermaid O by itself with no dap?

And I just want to say thank you for all of your work on this and other recipes / experiments.

The batch I have going now is actually using danstar abbaye ale yeast (your aromatic dry yeast suggestion from another thread) since it did not take off when I pitched on the previous yeast cake of wlp1388... My brew shop did not have any more of that.
Click to expand...


It's ok to switch on the 2/3 break.
Yes, Fermaid O replaces both Fermaid K and DAP.
 
z-bob said:
I've been looking all over for K2CO3 and all I can find is KHCO3 and they are not the same thing, but you can convert the bicarbonate in to carbonate by baking it. Is that what you are doing, or are you using the Northern Brewer product (whatever it really is) just like it is?



I have some Wyeast 1762 (Belgian Abbey II, supposed to be Rochefort strain) and T-58 dry belgian yeast; have you tried either of those?



Thank you for starting this thread. I've made mead twice; the first time was the ginger mead in Charles Papazian's book, and 20 years later my dad still talks about how good it was. But it had to age for a year before it was drinkable. The second time, I made just a straight-up dry mead using clover honey and I dont know what yeast -- it kinda tasted like cardboard and ass all at the same time. I dumped it. :( A one gallon batch of something that tastes good quickly is just what I need.
Click to expand...


KHCO3 works fine. Use exactly the same amount.

I've used the first yeast. It's not nearly as good as Wyeast 1388. This specific yeast is the key to a one month mead.

Recent experiments suggest Lallemand Abbaye ale performs equally well if rehydrated with GoFerm first.
 
I realized after posting a reply to an old comment that it was off topic. This post has been edited to remove the off-topic reply.

My apologies for the "ramblings of a lunatic from the fringe".

With that said...

Thanks so much for starting this thread. I have learned a good bit and will be putting in practice much of what was learned.

I was trained as a chef and later in life a Chemist. I have been after a good to excellent mead much quicker than using "traditional" wine or champagne yeasts and will follow the protocols and advice defined within this thread to get there.

In my humble opinion they were perfected using sound practices and as LOR admits are open for discussion. In fact, have been modified once the theory or new technique was proven. (Thanks for being open to that.)

Finally once i am able to make an acceptable 30 day and Very Good 90 day mead. I will try some of my own modifications and suspect some will be OK and some will be disasters. However i am convinced that with the solid foundation as described here I will eventually get to an "awesome" mead. (Awesome being subjective and may or may not be so for others, but I am OK with that!.)

Thanks again
 
Last edited:
CKuhns said:
I realized after posting a reply to an old comment that it was off topic. This post has been edited to remove the off-topic reply.

My apologies for the "ramblings of a lunatic from the fringe".

With that said...

Thanks so much for starting this thread. I have learned a good bit and will be putting in practice much of what was learned.

I was trained as a chef and later in life a Chemist. I have been after a good to excellent mead much quicker than using "traditional" wine or champagne yeasts and will follow the protocols and advice defined within this thread to get there.

In my humble opinion they were perfected using sound practices and as LOR admits are open for discussion. In fact, have been modified once the theory or new technique was proven. (Thanks for being open to that.)

Finally once i am able to make an acceptable 30 day and Very Good 90 day mead. I will try some of my own modifications and suspect some will be OK and some will be disasters. However i am convinced that with the solid foundation as described here I will eventually get to an "awesome" mead. (Awesome being subjective and may or may not be so for others, but I am OK with that!.)

Thanks again
Click to expand...

Hey I'm a chemist too. I'm fascinated with what lor has done, and I'm eager to push it even further. I've taken a break from mead due to the price of honey and have moved to higher abv beers. The differences are essentially only nutrients required...

But what I'm very interested in is still constant agitation (think 1 gallon on a stir plate) at controlled temperature. If you have the equipment and the risk of it not going as expected, I encourage you to try it.

I attempted once but I had massive temperature swings (90 f). So the experiment was not great.
 
JC Great thought.

I did use a stir plate on a very slow roll for the starter i currently have going and was impressed with how easy it is. (Basically it is doing it's own thing without any involvement from me.) After i get the 90 day perfected to where i want it. Will try the stir plate idea for primary up to the 2/3 break.

It just so happens the plate i have will hold a gallon container pretty easily. My brew area is at 64 Deg F plus or minus 1 Deg F year round and i suspect certainly would work well to keep the yeasties very happy in Primary up to the 2/3 break. I typically do 5 gallon batches but may try the 1 gallon BOMM using this technique. I will post the findings and observations once complete.

NOTE - It may be a bit before i can get to it as i will be out of carboy space with this first BOMM and will go for my personal goal of the 30 or 90 day really really good BOMM as a baseline to compare to. (Actually just started the 1st starter mentioned above two days ago.)

On a side note (AND OFF TOPIC) so please forgive me. The comment originally posted and removed was a reply to a comment you made in this thread back in 2014 around possibly being allergic to Super Kleer. I found out after a sister in law of mine had a slight reaction to my mead . I found that Super Kleer is made of 50ml Chitosan and 15ml Kieselsol. (Googled then Verified with a brew master at Northern Brewer) It appears the Chitosan iin Super Kleer s a sugar (non-fermentable) made from shellfish shells. If you have a sensitivity to shellfish you may have an issue with SuperKleer. (Just a thought)

stay tuned - More to come...
 
A couple of questions for loveofrose ( if it's not too soon for you to have these answers):

- Does Fermaid O mature slower than the Fermaid K/DAP and if so, how much slower?

- Does Lallemand Abbaye Ale dry yeast mature/develop (can't think of a better word) slower than Weast 1388 in mead and if so, how much slower?

I can't thank you enough for sharing the information you've worked so hard to gain. We owe you! Started my first mead last weekend with Lavlin 71B (blackberry mead) and sure wish I had read this thread beforehand. Unfortunately, It's behaving oddly and I'm not sure what is happening.
 

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