Bottling without sugar.

[harrie M]

Hello All,

My name is Harrie and I am from the Netherlands and I started to brew beer again after a few yearsa of rest. My first heffeweizen is now in the bottles and they taste fine. I saw a youtube video where it was told that for some beerstyles it is common to use fresh wort to add later in the fermentation. I do not like to use sugar for the CO2 addition in the bottle. Has someone experimented with adding fresh worth during bottling to get enough CO2?

 

[odie]

I think you will risk over carbonation and exploding bottles.

Using sugar to "prime" bottles is a long used practice with proven formulas and ratios to get the proper amount of carbonation without risking "bottle bombs". It provides consistent and proven results.

 

[hout17]

Or get a kegging setup and bottle from the keg.

 

[TheBluePhantom]

Priming bottles with wort vs sugar

This link above gives some discussion and a link to a better description. or you could use the DME discussed.

Basically you would have to calculate the amount of fermentable sugar in the wort and use just enough to carb.

Personally, I keg. So no experience myself.

 

[hout17]

Priming bottles with wort vs sugar

This link above gives some discussion and a link to a better description. or you could use the DME discussed.

Basically you would have to calculate the amount of fermentable sugar in the wort and use just enough to carb.

Personally, I keg. So no experience myself.

Beersmith 3 has DME in it's carbonation calculation tool for bottling so there's that.

BS3 Mobile Screenshot:

 

[Stormcrow]

I've definitely heard of people doing that, but I've found the sugar route to be near bulletproof. Getting ready to start kegging though, so I'll probably just bottle that way for the foreseeable future.

 

[OleBrewing]

Yeah that would work. But make sure it has been boiled. Not sure on the amount. Been a while since I have bottled conditioned. But any fermentables will work in the right amounts. I have used molasses in the past.

I will admit some styles of beer are meant to be bottled conditioned and some are better forced carbed by c02. But it all comes to personal preference.

 

[sibelman]

Like OP, I tend to steer away from sugar. DME, boiled briefly in some water and then cooled, was my standard priming method before I switched to kegging.

 

[TheBluePhantom]

Why the big difference in bottling and kegging with the sugar?

And I didn't expect that big a difference between DME and sugar. Does it not fully ferment out?

 

[Homebrew Harry]

Hello All,

My name is Harrie and I am from the Netherlands and I started to brew beer again after a few yearsa of rest. My first heffeweizen is now in the bottles and they taste fine. I saw a youtube video where it was told that for some beerstyles it is common to use fresh wort to add later in the fermentation. I do not like to use sugar for the CO2 addition in the bottle. Has someone experimented with adding fresh worth during bottling to get enough CO2?

Oh wow. Another Homebrew Harry ?! Cheers

 

[bwible]

Why the big difference in bottling and kegging with the sugar?

And I didn't expect that big a difference between DME and sugar. Does it not fully ferment out?

You got it. Corn sugar is 100% fermentable, DME is not.

 

[davidabcd]

As mentioned, using wort to carbonate requires a specific measurement. It appears (though maybe not) the method being referred to in the OP is an attempt to somewhat adhere to the very old beer purity laws which only allow the few ingredients when making beer and table sugar isn't one of them.
I don't think it would be too hard to figure out the amount of sugar in the wort but the, mentioned, measured DME in water is virtually the same thing and there are charts for accuracy.

 

[harrie M]

As mentioned, using wort to carbonate requires a specific measurement. It appears (though maybe not) the method being referred to in the OP is an attempt to somewhat adhere to the very old beer purity laws which only allow the few ingredients when making beer and table sugar isn't one of them.
I don't think it would be too hard to figure out the amount of sugar in the wort but the, mentioned, measured DME in water is virtually the same thing and there are charts for accuracy.

Yes, I would like to brew with the German Reinheidsgebot. And I am trying to minimise the use of sugar everywhere. I live in the land of salt and sugar. I rather eat and drink with pure foods. I will look info the software or calculate it myself with some spreadsheets. Thank you all for the reactions.

 

[hout17]

Yes, I would like to brew with the German Reinheidsgebot. And I am trying to minimise the use of sugar everywhere. I live in the land of salt and sugar. I rather eat and drink with pure foods. I will look info the software or calculate it myself with some spreadsheets. Thank you all for the reactions.

I haven't used it but brewers friend have a calculator you are looking for. Looks like a good starting place to do what you want.

Link to Brewer's Friend Calculator

 

[Gus_13]

I spiese my Hefeweizen beers when I bottle them. I keep a portion of the wort after the boil and then I mix it all in the keg and then bottle. I use this website. If you plan correctly and brew the same batches you can pull the portion from the fresh boiled and use with the already fermented beer. I tend to keep it in the fridge for when the beer is ready.

http://brewwiki.com/index.php/Speise

 

[davidabcd]

And I am trying to minimise the use of sugar everywhere.

That's cool.
The sugar in the wort needed to carbonate a batch will be equal to the priming sugar (or whatever other type of sugar). I'm not aware of any sugar being healthy, in general.

 

[harrie M]

That's cool.
The sugar in the wort needed to carbonate a batch will be equal to the priming sugar (or whatever other type of sugar). I'm not aware of any sugar being healthy, in general.

Your right, I mean refined cristalised sugar.

 

[harrie M]

I haven't used it but brewers friend have a calculator you are looking for. Looks like a good starting place to do what you want.

Link to Brewer's Friend Calculator

That is a good calculator. Thank you.

 

[hout17]

That's cool.
The sugar in the wort needed to carbonate a batch will be equal to the priming sugar (or whatever other type of sugar). I'm not aware of any sugar being healthy, in general.

I think it's a neat concept to do it the way the OP wants to but yeah you are right. It's really whether you want to use naturally bad for your health sugar or unnaturally bad for your health sugar.

OP: Let us know how this works out I think it's a cool concept.

 

[harrie M]

I think it's a neat concept to do it the way the OP wants to but yeah you are right. It's really whether you want to use naturally bad for your health sugar or unnaturally bad for your health sugar.

OP: Let us know how this works out I think it's a cool concept.

Will do. I brew now every two weeks. It is pretty stable now. The quality is great. The next batch I will try this way.

 

[davidabcd]

I think it's a neat concept to do it the way the OP wants to but yeah you are right. It's really whether you want to use naturally bad for your health sugar or unnaturally bad for your health sugar.

I think it's great--having strict rules for a product to maintain the product's integrity.
Anyway, I see a lot of "good" sugar info getting forwarded. OJ, apple juice, etc. are great examples. They each rival Coke in sugar/carbs. Can get a lot of fat kids and puzzled parents that way. Supposed to eat the whole orange or the whole apple.

 

[eric19312]

It should work just fine but just to be contrary, from a dietary/health point of view, I think refined table sugar vs wort/dme the refined table sugar might win out. Here is my thinking...wort whether made at home from grain or made by dissolving and boiling DME/LME will only partially ferment. About 80% of the sugar in the wort will get converted to alcohol and CO2, the rest will remain in the beer and be consumed as carbohydrates in your diet. Refined sugar, either table or corn, on the other hand will convert more or less entirely to alcohol and CO2, not leaving behind any extra unfermentable sugar.

And force carbing with CO2....even better...no added alcohol, no added unfermented sugar....just CO2 (and whatever impurities are in the CO2 which should be at least 99.9% pure CO2 for beverage industry).

 

[harrie M]

I am curious on what it will do with the taste.

 

[TheBluePhantom]

You got it. Corn sugar is 100% fermentable, DME is not.

Yeah, but DME is about 75% fermentable. I would think you would need 133% DME compared to sugar, why does the calculator give about 150% DME by weight compared to sugar?

 

[sibelman]

I am curious on what it will do with the taste.

In the quantity needed for priming I would not expect a discernible flavor effect from sugar or DME.

 

[Zambezi Special]

Just give it a try
I would suggest to bottle your first batch in PET bottles and keep them in a closed box, just in case you calculated wrong.
I'm interested to hear the results, but I'll stick with sugar

 

[jerrylotto]

Your right, I mean refined cristalised sugar.

Any sugar you use is going to be eaten by the yeast to produce carbon dioxide and ethanol - glucose, dextrose, sucrose all get chewed up before you drink your beer so what difference does it make? You are not ingesting the priming sugar you add.

 

[harrie M]

Any sugar you use is going to be eaten by the yeast to produce carbon dioxide and ethanol - glucose, dextrose, sucrose all get chewed up before you drink your beer so what difference does it make? You are not ingesting the priming sugar you add.

Firstly to just brew according the Reinheidsgebod. Secondly to see if anything changes in the taste. I can imagine that the fresh DME does some addition to the taste.