Boil kettle condenser - no overhead ventilation needed

[day_trippr]

I expect it can cause a nozzle sized for higher pressure to become less than effective, hence the recommendation to use the tighter nozzles if reduced flow is desired...

Cheers!

 

[Jem]

Great thread. Has anyone used this setup to lower the alcohol content?

 

[Gameface]

Great thread. Has anyone used this setup to lower the alcohol content?

That would be against everything I believe in.

 

[doug293cz]

Great thread. Has anyone used this setup to lower the alcohol content?

I don't understand the question. Why would the way you deal with steam have anything to do with the ABV?

Brew on

 

[mongoose33]

I'm guessing he's asking about boiling off the alcohol before the water, similar to how a still does it, except rather than condense the alcohol, it's simply discarded, thus lowering the ABV of the beer. Post fermentation, of course.

 

[Lax coach]

Pardon me asking, but why is bad to have an unknown pressure drop? The hose is certainly fine seeing an increase in pressure.

He means that there's not a good way to predict how much the pressure of the water coming out of the spray nozzle will be reduced when you restrict the flow. So you might not get enough atomized water to make the thing work, and even if you get it to work once, it might not be dialed in the next time.

 

[Nummisoft]

I'm not sure if this has been asked already (since we're at 23 pages so far and I don't have time to read them all at the moment), but why can't we achieve the same thing with a large coil of copper tubing, like an old immersion chiller, which is sitting on top of a box fan or some other air powered cooling source?

I think it would work only if water is running inside of the copper coil and the coil is quite long. That cooling water could be part of closed loop system consisting a pump and radiator with fan to loose the heat to surrounding air. A lot more complicated system compared to this topic's condenser.

 

[BrunDog]

He means that there's not a good way to predict how much the pressure of the water coming out of the spray nozzle will be reduced when you restrict the flow. So you might not get enough atomized water to make the thing work, and even if you get it to work once, it might not be dialed in the next time.

This ^

 

[sixhotdogneck]

Would this work on -or- does anyone use this on a stovetop setup?

 

[mongoose33]

Would this work on -or- does anyone use this on a stovetop setup?

There's no reason why it wouldn't work on a stovetop. I use an electric element inside the kettle, no difference if the heat is supplied inside the kettle or at the bottom.

 

[sixhotdogneck]

There's no reason why it wouldn't work on a stovetop. I use an electric element inside the kettle, no difference if the heat is supplied inside the kettle or at the bottom.

Thanks. Maybe I'm misunderstanding what's being said at this link, "your electric kettle must be equipped with a power controller" but on a stove you can also adjust the heat:

https://www.brewhardware.com/product_p/steamslayer.htm

Under Instructions in #6:

Adjust your boil intensity to approximately HALF of what you're used to using and plan for about half as much boil off. For a typical example, we used to run our 5500 watt element at 65% when the kettle is full of 7 gallons and the lid off. We experienced 1.5 gallons per hour of boil off. With the Steam Slayer installed, we run at 32% and experience .75 gallons of boil off per hour. In other words, to use the Steam Slayer, your electric kettle must be equipped with a power controller.

 

[ancientmariner52]

Thanks. Maybe I'm misunderstanding what's being said at this link, "your electric kettle must be equipped with a power controller" but on a stove you can also adjust the heat:

https://www.brewhardware.com/product_p/steamslayer.htm

Under Instructions in #6:

What this means is, while boiling with a lid on, your thermal efficiency is going to be approximately doubled. You'll be able to cut your heat input in half, whatever the source of heat. The heat is carried off mostly by the rising steam, so less heat loss equals less water loss as well. The principle is the same, however the heat is produced. A stove top should work just fine.

 

[mongoose33]

Thanks. Maybe I'm misunderstanding what's being said at this link, "your electric kettle must be equipped with a power controller" but on a stove you can also adjust the heat:

https://www.brewhardware.com/product_p/steamslayer.htm

Under Instructions in #6:

That's exactly right--you can adjust the power going to the burner, just as I'm adjusting the power going to my element.

 

[Gameface]

I think they specify that you're gonna need to be able to control your power level because with the lid open it will just boil harder. With the lid on it will boil over unless you can reduce the power.

 

[Gameface]

I used the steam condenser for a second time today. Love it!

But I did want to mention something. Someone a few dozen pages ago said something about the smell being even stronger and less pleasant after going to the steam condenser. Didn't really seem right.

What I did notice today, especially after running a quick errand and coming back home is that the wort smell in my house was stronger than it used to be before the steam condenser. Add to that, I could smell the canned corn smell in my house.

So before the steam condenser I used to open my garage and the side door to my garage and I'd get a good cross breeze that kept the steam down without a vent hood.

Now I keep my garage completely closed, except that I go in and out a lot and I usually let the door going from the garage to my house stay open a crack (it's a metal door that has spring hinges that make it close but if I close it softly it doesn't latch and stays open a crack).

So I don't think I'm producing more smell, I'm just not giving any of the malt smell anywhere to go besides inside my house. And the condensed liquid absolutely does have that canned corn smell to it, which isn't as nice as a clean wort smell, for sure. So I think something like that must have been going on with the other guy.

 

[mongoose33]

I used the steam condenser for a second time today. Love it!

But I did want to mention something. Someone a few dozen pages ago said something about the smell being even stronger and less pleasant after going to the steam condenser. Didn't really seem right.

What I did notice today, especially after running a quick errand and coming back home is that the wort smell in my house was stronger than it used to be before the steam condenser. Add to that, I could smell the canned corn smell in my house.

So before the steam condenser I used to open my garage and the side door to my garage and I'd get a good cross breeze that kept the steam down without a vent hood.

Now I keep my garage completely closed, except that I go in and out a lot and I usually let the door going from the garage to my house stay open a crack (it's a metal door that has spring hinges that make it close but if I close it softly it doesn't latch and stays open a crack).

So I don't think I'm producing more smell, I'm just not giving any of the malt smell anywhere to go besides inside my house. And the condensed liquid absolutely does have that canned corn smell to it, which isn't as nice as a clean wort smell, for sure. So I think something like that must have been going on with the other guy.

I've noticed the same issue with smell. It's more pungent, less...hoppy somehow. Don't know why, that water is going down the drain. My wife likes it even less than before.

 

[Zepth]

Love the idea. I'm getting something like this eventually.

Apartment brewer. -30 or -40 winters. Balcony isn't fun at that point in time, not is having the door cracked to get power there. I thought about the idea a while ago. Never came to fruition with a product even worth prototyping. Ranging from crazy coils going all over the pace (too small diameter), car intercooler bolted somewhere (somewhere...) but nothing that would be of any practical use.

I noticed in a few of the photos the top mounted TC ones with a 90 degree elbow seem to be leaning an awful lot. Where's it torquing? Connection at the lid, whole lid tilting slightly to one side from non-centred placement, optical illusion?

 

[Gameface]

I've noticed the same issue with smell. It's more pungent, less...hoppy somehow. Don't know why, that water is going down the drain. My wife likes it evendors less than before.

Even though I really like not having to open my garage, I might do it just to get a little airflow to carry the smell away.

Oh, I probably should have also mentioned that I was taking the buckets with the condensed liquid inside to dump in my kitchen sink. LOL, that probably also had something to do with it.

 

[doug293cz]

...

I noticed in a few of the photos the top mounted TC ones with a 90 degree elbow seem to be leaning an awful lot. Where's it torquing? Connection at the lid, whole lid tilting slightly to one side from non-centred placement, optical illusion?

I most cases the lid is curved, and that is where the tilt is originating. There is however significant torque due to the cantilever nature of the beast.

Brew on :mug;

 

[BrunDog]

Thanks. Maybe I'm misunderstanding what's being said at this link, "your electric kettle must be equipped with a power controller" but on a stove you can also adjust the heat:

https://www.brewhardware.com/product_p/steamslayer.htm

Under Instructions in #6:

Well, I think you will find it harder to boil on a stovetop than before. The heat input becomes much more sensitive. Think of it this way... if you don't have super fine boil control, say 5% steps of power, and boiled with 65% power, then 1 step drop is only a 8% change. However, if you now need to boil at 35%, that same 5% step is a 14% change.

Some stoves have a long ON/OFF cycle and adjust that, and some control power via triac for more linear power output. So these things need to be considered. Not saying it can't be done, but I would be careful with a blanket comparison that its identical to a brew "specific" controller and element.

 

[ancientmariner52]

Love the idea. I'm getting something like this eventually.

Apartment brewer. -30 or -40 winters. Balcony isn't fun at that point in time, not is having the door cracked to get power there. I thought about the idea a while ago. Never came to fruition with a product even worth prototyping. Ranging from crazy coils going all over the pace (too small diameter), car intercooler bolted somewhere (somewhere...) but nothing that would be of any practical use.

I noticed in a few of the photos the top mounted TC ones with a 90 degree elbow seem to be leaning an awful lot. Where's it torquing? Connection at the lid, whole lid tilting slightly to one side from non-centred placement, optical illusion?

Mine has the tilted appearance, account of the domed lid shape. I mounted it as near center as possible, to counteract any tendency to lift the lid. It turned out to be remarkably stable, in fact.

I've considered using a hydraulic press and some sort of punch and die to create a level mounting surface. I'm sure it would work, but I'm much too lazy to make it likely to happen.

 

[Bobby_M]

When I install TC ports into lids using the pull through ferrule method, I have the ability to torque the ferrule to level before soldering. Unfortunately there's nothing you can do about it with a weldless TC but it doesn't really affect the performance.

 

[Joseph G]

So the HVAC guy just left after quoting me for the ducting for my plans for a stainless exhaust hood which is already $$$ by itself and I was less than impressed with the estimate. I am now leaning toward a steam condenser myself. I have sorted through many of the pages of this thread and am looking where to source the spray nozzle assembly from. I would intend to use all 2" TC connections minus the reducer from the kettle. I have sketched up a design using a modified Spike Brewing kettle lid incorporating a center exhaust and two handles. For the domed reducer I sketched, I intend to use a concentric reducer for the nozzle benefits. Let me know if any of you that use condensers see any flaws with the design. Also, is the smell so bad that brewing inside would be out of the question?

 

[mongoose33]

I'll bet you can buy a spray nozzle from Bobby at Brewhardware.com. He doesn't list them as a part, but you can get a 6gph or a 9gph spray nozzle as part of the Steam Slayer kit.

Just out of curiousity, why not just get his Steam Slayer? It's 1.5" tubing, not 2"; any reason why you're set on 2" tubing?

 

[BeardedBrews]

So the HVAC guy just left after quoting me for the ducting for my plans for a stainless exhaust hood which is already $$$ by itself and I was less than impressed with the estimate. I am now leaning toward a steam condenser myself. I have sorted through many of the pages of this thread and am looking where to source the spray nozzle assembly from. I would intend to use all 2" TC connections minus the reducer from the kettle. I have sketched up a design using a modified Spike Brewing kettle lid incorporating a center exhaust and two handles. For the domed reducer I sketched, I intend to use a concentric reducer for the nozzle benefits. Let me know if any of you that use condensers see any flaws with the design. Also, is the smell so bad that brewing inside would be out of the question? View attachment 603220

There exists a domed lid design that is also useful for other applications. You might consider a dual purpose approach when you design the steam lid.

 

[Joseph G]

I'll bet you can buy a spray nozzle from Bobby at Brewhardware.com. He doesn't list them as a part, but you can get a 6gph or a 9gph spray nozzle as part of the Steam Slayer kit.

Just out of curiousity, why not just get his Steam Slayer? It's 1.5" tubing, not 2"; any reason why you're set on 2" tubing?

I will have to send him a message. My thought was 2" would just provide more steam flow, especially with the extra elbow, I suppose that 1.5" would work as well and I haven't ruled out using the steam slayer. I had a hard time finding a 4" to 1.5" reducer that I liked but there were many options at 4" to 2". I am really just in the planning phase right now as far as a condenser goes because of the exhaust hood cost. I am also waiting to hear back on some custom work about my ideas on the lid design. A domed lid straight to a 1.5" or 2" TC would be ideal IMO.

 

[mongoose33]

I will have to send him a message. My thought was 2" would just provide more steam flow, especially with the extra elbow, I suppose that 1.5" would work as well and I haven't ruled out using the steam slayer. I had a hard time finding a 4" to 1.5" reducer that I liked but there were many options at 4" to 2". I am really just in the planning phase right now as far as a condenser goes because of the exhaust hood cost. I am also waiting to hear back on some custom work about my ideas on the lid design. A domed lid straight to a 1.5" or 2" TC would be ideal IMO.

I see; I missed the 4" opening above.

I'm using the steam slayer on a 10-gallon kettle, and the 1.5" is plenty for that, even with having two 90-degree elbows. Once they heat up with steam, the steam just goes through to the condenser.

But I can see the issue with getting a reducer from 4" to 1.5".

 

[Joseph G]

I see; I missed the 4" opening above.

I'm using the steam slayer on a 10-gallon kettle, and the 1.5" is plenty for that, even with having two 90-degree elbows. Once they heat up with steam, the steam just goes through to the condenser.

But I can see the issue with getting a reducer from 4" to 1.5".

Can you send me a picture of that when you get a chance? Do you have it coming out of the lid? Thanks for the insights.

 

[mongoose33]

Can you send me a picture of that when you get a chance? Do you have it coming out of the lid? Thanks for the insights.

Actually, it's earlier in this thread, on page 23. Here it is, anyway. I don't have it coming out of the lid, but if I did, I'd be able to move the elbows in such as way as to get the steam slayer to work.

 

[ancientmariner52]

I wonder. If we have a condenser to control the escaping steam, wouldn't a standard, home-kitchen-sized, that is to say, affordable, range exhaust hood be able to control the odors? I realize make-up air has to enter the space from somewhere, but the volume would be very much less.