Any tips for a first time Lager brew

[Prymal]

Hey everyone,

I just got my Lagering setup complete and have a brew planned for this weekend.

BoHo Pils

11 lbs Pilsner Malt
.75 lbs Cara-Pils
60 min 1.25 oz Saaz 4.4%
30 min 0.75 oz Saaz 4.4%
10 min 1.00 oz Saaz 4.4%
0.0 min 1.0 oz Saaz 4.4%
2 packets Saflager W-34/70

Est OG: 1.059
Est FG: 1.014
IBU: 34.5

I am thinking about doing a step mash with rests at 110, 140, 150, 168?
I have RO water that comes out at 1 TDS should I add any brewing salts?
What fermentation schedule should I use with this Yeast as I have no experience with it.

 

[Darwin18]

Make sure you pitch enough yeast and pitch the yeast when your wort is at fermentation temps. Avoid pitching hot.

If you pitch enough yeast it will take off just fine.

 

[Yooper]

Straight RO water is fine for a BoPils, but some do add some calcium sulfate.

For the steps, I assume you're decocting? I normally do a different schedule, with a higher temperature protease rest (131), a mid-range saccrification rest, and then decoct to mash out, although I've had good results with a Hochkurz double decoction with pilsers as well.

I've never done an acid rest, or need a to break up beta-glucanase so I've never done a rest as low at 110. That's a bit unusual, I think. If you want to do a short protein rest (if that's the point of that rest), I'd go a bit higher.

I've never used that yeast strain so I don't know which temperatures to suggest, sorry!

 

[CidahMastah]

Are you planning on a decoction or just step mashing? Personally I would toss in the decoction to get to your step mashes if you plan on making all the effort for all those steps.

In reality I would simplify a bit. I did a BoPils and did a single infusion with a 22minute boiled mash out decoction that turned out great. I used all distilled water for my attempt.

Most people rec something like this for fermentation schedule:

1. cool wort to 45F then pitch yeast
2. raise wort up to 50-55F and ferment
3. at the end of fermentation do a diacytel rest.
Lager for 1-2 months minimum.

Check out this thread for my first pursuit and the information that lead me to my decision on how to brew this.

 

[Prymal]

Thanks for the good info. I am a BIAB guy so decoction really isn't an option.

 

[Yooper]

Thanks for the good info. I am a BIAB guy so decoction really isn't an option.

They why the steps, particularly the 110 degree one?

If you really want to step mash, and the malt is well modified, you could do a short higher temperature protein rest and then a mid-range saccrification rest. I wouldn't do such that mash schedule on a pilsner anyway, but definitely not in an infusion mash.

 

[Prymal]

I was reading up on lagering and I read I think on palmers website that that was a Pilsen step mash schedule. So what schedule would you suggest? 131, 150, 168. If I can figure out how pull a decoction I would do it only to raise for 150 to 168. I am a little worried about the ph of my mash with pure RO. I typically run about 5.7 - 5.8 on a pale ale with no adjustments, that is why i was going to do an acid rest.

 

[Rundownhouse]

Patience. Everything takes longer with lagers.

 

[CidahMastah]

Thanks for the good info. I am a BIAB guy so decoction really isn't an option.

Why would BIAB hold you back from doing a decoction? Open the bag, pull your decoction and boil and return to the mash.

If you have a stove and a decent sized pot you should be ok. Obviously an extra burner or similar works too.

 

[ajf]

Straight RO water is fine for a BoPils, but some do add some calcium sulfate.

Are you sure you mean calcium sulfate and not calcium chloride?

-a.

 

[BeerBrent]

its going to smell like farts so be ready for that.

 

[Denny]

I was reading up on lagering and I read I think on palmers website that that was a Pilsen step mash schedule. So what schedule would you suggest? 131, 150, 168. If I can figure out how pull a decoction I would do it only to raise for 150 to 168. I am a little worried about the ph of my mash with pure RO. I typically run about 5.7 - 5.8 on a pale ale with no adjustments, that is why i was going to do an acid rest.

Don't do a protein rest step mash because a recipe says so. Do a step mash if your malt requires it. I'd recommend you stay with the 15/0/168 routine.

 

[sonex]

with pils malt you will want to do a 90 min boil to drive off DMS so allow for the extra boil off volume

 

[Prymal]

Don't do a protein rest step mash because a recipe says so. Do a step mash if your malt requires it. I'd recommend you stay with the 15/0/168 routine.

I am using Rahr Premium 2-row (I have never use it before do I need to do a protein rest with this grain?)
What does 15/0/168 mean?

To everyone else I plan to do a 90 min boil.

Any suggestions for the best fermentation temperature for the W-34/70 yeast?

 

[CidahMastah]

I am using Rahr Premium 2-row (I have never use it before do I need to do a protein rest with this grain?)

how can you do a bohemian pils, without pilsner malt? I would change your base malt to pilsner, preferably of a german variety if you want to stay true to BoPils.

 

[Prymal]

how can you do a bohemian pils, without pilsner malt? I would change your base malt to pilsner, preferably of a german variety if you want to stay true to BoPils.

Sorry I am so used to typing 2-row I actually bought rahr premium pilsner malt. My LHBS does not stock any imported malts.

 

[Denny]

150/168 refers to the steps in your original mash schedule. With the malt you've got I'd definitely skip a protein rest.

 

[Prymal]

150/168 refers to the steps in your original mash schedule. With the malt you've got I'd definitely skip a protein rest.

Thanks

 

[Prymal]

Why would BIAB hold you back from doing a decoction? Open the bag, pull your decoction and boil and return to the mash.

If you have a stove and a decent sized pot you should be ok. Obviously an extra burner or similar works too.

According to http://www.franklinbrew.org/tools/decoction.html I would need to pull 15 quarts of thick mash and boil at 210 to reach my 168 mashout. My biggest pot is 10 quarts and I don't have a "spoon" long enough to reach the bottom of my Keggle to pull thick mash.

 

[Denny]

FWIW, unless you live far above sea level, you won't boil at 210F.

 

[Prymal]

FWIW, unless you live far above sea level, you won't boil at 210F.

Regardless I don't have the volume to be able to perform the decoction so I will be step mashing. I just need to figure out if I should acid rest at 110-113 based on my previous statement that my ph sits around 5.7 with unadjusted RO water or I can add 2 oz of acid malt which should bring it within range. What do you suggest.

 

[Denny]

I suggest you worry about mash pH and not water pH. If the acid malt will get your mash in range, do it. But if you're basing it solely on water pH, you should get Brunwater and plug in your water and recipe values.

 

[Prymal]

I suggest you worry about mash pH and not water pH. If the acid malt will get your mash in range, do it. But if you're basing it solely on water pH, you should get Brunwater and plug in your water and recipe values.

5.7 is my typical mash ph with a ph meter using unaltered RO water. Based on your advice I will skip the acid rest and just add 2 oz of acid malt

 

[Denny]

That's definitely the way I'd approach it given the info gave. Acually, I'd do it the easy way and use some lactic or phosphoric acid.

 

[Prymal]

That's definitely the way I'd approach it given the info gave. Acually, I'd do it the easy way and use some lactic or phosphoric acid.

Thanks for all of the help but I don't have either of those items on hand and work nights with the LHBS only open until 5 pm and a 30 minute drive away. I think I'll stick with the acid malt and see how it goes. I don't have amazingly high hopes for my first lager/pilsner we will see how this goes and adjust in the future.

Again thank you all for the advice.

 

[Denny]

Get back to us in a few months and let us know how it turned out.

 

[Prymal]

One last question? Can I carb while lagering? For example, lager in a keg for 4 weeks then add the co2 and continue to lager for another 2 weeks. Or should I wait out the whole lager period before applying the co2.

 

[Denny]

One last question? Can I carb while lagering? For example, lager in a keg for 4 weeks then add the co2 and continue to lager for another 2 weeks. Or should I wait out the whole lager period before applying the co2.

You sure can carb while lagering. I always do.

 

[Prymal]

You sure can carb while lagering. I always do.

Awesome, in will make sure to reply back with the process I chose to use and the final result.

 

[CidahMastah]

If it makes you feel any better, I will be doing a straight up single infusion for my next lager to determine if all the decoction stuff makes a big difference to me or not. Also will be doing a side by side distilled water batch vs my well water which is similar to a dublin style.

Not sure when that will be scheduled though. Good luck