Advice wanted for first cider attempt

[hausofstrauss]

I'm looking at making a last minute addition of a hard cider to a party we are holding in 6 weeks. I've never done cider before, so I'm looking for an easy/solid crowdpleaser.

Our local orchards won't have fresh cider for a few weeks and neither will my LHBS, so I'm looking at using some store bought pasteurized cider or apple juice. It will also be served kegged.

My primary path is using UpstateMike's Carmel Apple Hard Cider recipe, unless otherwise directed.

Here are the deviations from his basic recipe.

1. Juice from Sam's Club, Member's Mark. Appears to just have Vitamin C added, but I'll have to visit to see about preservatives such as sorbate or benzoate. I'll measure the SG and add enough table sugar (instead of corn sugar) to get the 5.5 gallons to around 1.064.

2. Yeast
Here are my preferences in order:
Wyeast 1335 - British Ale II (this is one of my "house" yeasts that I've got plenty of slurry to get me going)
S-04 - I've seen mention in this thread that it is becoming one of CvilleKevin's new favorites.
Nottingham (per recipe) as a last place, because I've not enjoyed it in beers I've brewed.

3. Fermentation in my basement, so at an ambient of about 68 deg and with a blow-off tube.

4. Kegging
I plan to follow the advice here to let it ferment out completely, then only add 2 cans of frozen apple juice concentrate along with the 5 Campden tablets. Then I'll immediately cold crash and keg at about 2.25 volumes (my standard for beers).

5. Lastly, since I'm not gluten free, I'm not knowledgeable enough. Will I be able to proclaim this gluten free for those people attending the party?

 

[Drewed]

Yes you can, but why table sugar and not corn sugar? It dissolves easier and you need less

 

[bleme]

Table sugar is a fraction of the price and works just as well.

Process looks solid to me. Since you are serving at an event and don't need long term storage, I think you can do without the Campden tabs. I would (and have) cold crash and rack onto the apple concentrate in your keg just long enough before the event to carbonate properly.

Also, I haven't used WY1335 but I prefer to start S-04 closer to 62F. Since you know WY1335 performs well in your basement, I would stick with that.


It is gluten free.

 

[bernardsmith]

I guess my question is why would you want to make a cider with an ABV of more than 8%? Don't folk drink cider by the pint and not the glass? A pint or two of that cider will likely knock most people on their back. A cider is typically around 5-6 % ABV... At 8 % you are approaching an apple wine...

 

[bleme]

I guess my question is why would you want to make a cider with an ABV of more than 8%? Don't folk drink cider by the pint and not the glass? A pint or two of that cider will likely knock most people on their back. A cider is typically around 5-6 % ABV... At 8 % you are approaching an apple wine...

8% would be the result if he used a wine yeast but WY1335 only has 73%-76% attenuation which will only take it down to about 1.015, so just over 6%.

 

[bernardsmith]

But cider is 100% fermentable. Attenuation makes little sense when you are dealing only with sucrose and fructose or glucose Find it hard to believe that any strain of yeast will not ferment brut dry any apple juice - but if that is what Wyeast claim then that is what they claim. Attenuation is a brewer's concept - not a wine makers. Now if this strain of yeast cannot tolerate more than 6% alcohol that is a very different story but that has nothing to do with "attenuation"

 

[Yooper]

I'm looking at making a last minute addition of a hard cider to a party we are holding in 6 weeks. I've never done cider before, so I'm looking for an easy/solid crowdpleaser.

Our local orchards won't have fresh cider for a few weeks and neither will my LHBS, so I'm looking at using some store bought pasteurized cider or apple juice. It will also be served kegged.

My primary path is using UpstateMike's Carmel Apple Hard Cider recipe, unless otherwise directed.

Here are the deviations from his basic recipe.

1. Juice from Sam's Club, Member's Mark. Appears to just have Vitamin C added, but I'll have to visit to see about preservatives such as sorbate or benzoate. I'll measure the SG and add enough table sugar (instead of corn sugar) to get the 5.5 gallons to around 1.064.

2. Yeast
Here are my preferences in order:
Wyeast 1335 - British Ale II (this is one of my "house" yeasts that I've got plenty of slurry to get me going)
S-04 - I've seen mention in this thread that it is becoming one of CvilleKevin's new favorites.
Nottingham (per recipe) as a last place, because I've not enjoyed it in beers I've brewed.

3. Fermentation in my basement, so at an ambient of about 68 deg and with a blow-off tube.

4. Kegging
I plan to follow the advice here to let it ferment out completely, then only add 2 cans of frozen apple juice concentrate along with the 5 Campden tablets. Then I'll immediately cold crash and keg at about 2.25 volumes (my standard for beers).

5. Lastly, since I'm not gluten free, I'm not knowledgeable enough. Will I be able to proclaim this gluten free for those people attending the party?

Campden is used by winemakers as an antioxidant, and doesn't kill yeast. So definitely leave that out if you're not bottling and aging!

I'd go with S04 for a yeast strain, and target an OG of 1.050 or less. Once the OG gets higher, the cider loses it's "appleness" unless cold crashed at a pretty sweet SG. It also takes longer to age.

S04 can ferment it out pretty fast, mine went to 1.004 in a few days, but it also clears fast and can be racked and sweetened and kept cold to age a bit while it carbs.

If you're going to keep it really cold, you won't need to stabilize with sorbate but if there is a chance it won't be kept ice-cold, you may want to consider stabilizing with sorbate to ensure fermentation doesn't restart. It shouldn't, if you keep it cold.

 

[MindenMan]

Rule #1 Yooper is always right. Rule #2 If you are not sure, see rule #1. Trust Yooper; she has decades of experience making fruit wines and cider, and she is always my go-to if I need help.

 

[hausofstrauss]

Table sugar is a fraction of the price and works just as well.

Process looks solid to me. Since you are serving at an event and don't need long term storage, I think you can do without the Campden tabs. I would (and have) cold crash and rack onto the apple concentrate in your keg just long enough before the event to carbonate properly.

Also, I haven't used WY1335 but I prefer to start S-04 closer to 62F. Since you know WY1335 performs well in your basement, I would stick with that.


It is gluten free.

Thanks! And yes, the table sugar is less expensive and I wasn't worried of the reported "cidery" off-flavor from using table sugar.

 

[hausofstrauss]

Campden is used by winemakers as an antioxidant, and doesn't kill yeast. So definitely leave that out if you're not bottling and aging!

I'd go with S04 for a yeast strain, and target an OG of 1.050 or less. Once the OG gets higher, the cider loses it's "appleness" unless cold crashed at a pretty sweet SG. It also takes longer to age.

S04 can ferment it out pretty fast, mine went to 1.004 in a few days, but it also clears fast and can be racked and sweetened and kept cold to age a bit while it carbs.

If you're going to keep it really cold, you won't need to stabilize with sorbate but if there is a chance it won't be kept ice-cold, you may want to consider stabilizing with sorbate to ensure fermentation doesn't restart. It shouldn't, if you keep it cold.

I'll trust that Yooper is right and go with these changes:

1. No sugar addition (as long as the 1.004 you quote is from an SG of 1.050). I definitely want to retain the apple flavor. Yes, the beers I'm serving will be around 5.5% and I don't want to go too much higher. Those numbers should give me right around 6%.

2. I'll just go with the known S04. Maybe I'll run a separate 1G batch with the 1335 and see how it attenuates the same juice.

3. The cider will be kept between 32-37 degF, so if there is a chance of some slow fermentation, I might go ahead and add the sorbate.

4. Definitely not worrying about the Campden tablets then, as it will all go at the party.

 

[hausofstrauss]

I started my cider this weekend.

I got 6 gallons of juice from Sam's Club and it measured about 1.048. I didn't bother adding any sugar.

I split into two bathes. 5.4 gallons as the primary batch with S-04 and then another 0.6 gallon batch using just over 2 oz of Wyeast 1335 slurry from my reserves. I'd like to compare the attenuation of different yeasts on the same juice.