5 Gallon Stir Plate

[mavrick1903]

Tom, I'll have mine to you in a day or so. Been traveling. Post here, or email you?

 

[thargrav]

Posting here is fine.

Thanks, Tom

 

[mavrick1903]

Sorry for the delay everyone.

I brewed two batches, a stout, and a dunkleweiss. Both had similar grain bills, OG, etc. both were made with starters. One (Dunkel) was on the stir plate. The stout was static. They sat side by side in a room that tends to be a little cool this time of year. The y were brewed the same day. And racked to secondary the same day. The stout had a higher gravity than the Dunkel. The stout was much farther along than the stout by a point and a half. The stir plate helped the fermentation overcome the temp, and ferment faster that ln the stout sitting static. The plate had the carboy (a 6.5 by the way, sitting just fine without help) spinning beautifully the whole time.

Well done Tom!

Sent from my iPhone using HB Talk

 

[thargrav]

Thanks, now that I have confirmation for what I already believed I'll start putting the Black MAXX stir plates up for sale.

They can be found for sale here:
Black MAXX Stir Plate

For wholesale customers, FOXX Equipment will start carrying inventory after the first of the year.

Thanks, Tom

 

[emjay]

I should have some results in a few days.

 

[thargrav]

Does anyone else have any feedback?

 

[Dirty]

Sorry been busy.
Just finished main fermentation on an IIPA. Yeast tore through the primary and went ahead an cold crashed. Will keg tomorrow evening or Monday and reprot back on the taste ASAP.
Quad or Imperial Stout on Deck.

Rock Chalk

Chris

 

[Yavid]

Has anyone used this stir plate to do a mead yet? I am very interested in this. Seriously considering buying one of these as a Christmas gift to myself.

Has anyone opened theirs up? What is the build quality like?

 

[GNBrews]

Has anyone used this stir plate to do a mead yet? I am very interested in this. Seriously considering buying one of these as a Christmas gift to myself.

Has anyone opened theirs up? What is the build quality like?

That would be an awesome use! Used along with staggered nutrient additions, I would bet you could ferment in 3 wks or less. Or, any wine for that matter.

I'd try with my next batch of mead, but $190 is a bit of a commitment.

 

[thargrav]

Has anyone used this stir plate to do a mead yet? I am very interested in this. Seriously considering buying one of these as a Christmas gift to myself.

Has anyone opened theirs up? What is the build quality like?

I'm the designer and I have intended to start a MEAD but we have been busy building product. I guess I need to find time to start my next MEAD this weekend.

As far as quality is concerned:

The housing is a quality box & not some food container or Radio Shack project box. It has aluminum front and back plates and is strong enough to stand on if you really wanted to.

The housing is large enough to support a 5 or 6 gallon carboy with no danger of the carboy sliding off.

You'll find that we use the same type motor everyone is using to build stir plates with one exception. Our motor is a high torque fan motor designed to cool servers. It draws 5X the power and has 5X the torque of the same size motors used in our Stir Plate 3000 products.

The controller card is commercial quality FR4 material.

The controller circuit is PWM & not a LM317 voltage regulator design. We don't use a LM317 voltage regulator in any of our stir plate designs because it does not work as well as a PWM controller. But if we attempted to use a LM317 voltage regulator we would find that unless we used a huge heatsink, the regulator would get so hot that it would shut down. Our PWM controller generates no measureable heat.

The magnets are large & very powerfull and if I stick two together I can't pull or slide them apart. They are contained in a assembly composed of a cross bar (steel plate) and top plate (Fiberglass reinforced). The top plate was necessary to prevent the magnets from flying off when the stir plate is run at full speed without a load. This actually happened in prototype and the magnets left dents in the walls. I can't tell you how we fasten the magnets to the crossbar and how we fasten the crossbar to the motor hub but we don't use any form of glue.

For taceability all of our stir plates are date coded & serialized and they always have been. I know this does not mean much to you but it's extremely imprtant for design changes, potential product recalls and warranty replacements. We are serious about quality.

Also our other stir plates, the Stir Plate 2000 and Stir Plate 3000, have had a very low warranty return rate. Out of over 1000 manufactured to date we have had less than 20 returned for replacement or repair.

Thanks, Tom
Stir-Plate.com Home

 

[thargrav]

I started my MEAD today.

My recipe is really simple. I put 5 gallons of water in a 6 gallon carboy. I pour in 15 pounds of honey, usually clover honey. Then I pour in one pack of Safale S-05 yeast and put in a sterile airlock. I do not cook my MEAD - cooking drives off too much of the honey aroma. The result is a 6 gallon carboy with about 5.75 gallons of liquid.

And BTW, S-04 is a dry Ale yeast.

In the past I would rock the carboy after adding the yeast to help pull some of the honey into suspension then I would rock the carboy once a day until there was no more honey in the bottom - about one month. The MEAD would finish in about three months, then it would settle for at least 6 more months before I would bottle. I usually rack to a new carboy every three months. The result is a slightly sweet MEAD of about 18% alcohol.

This year I'm trying my new Black MAXX Stir Plate.

I started with 5 gallons of water in my 6 gallon carboy then I put the carboy on my stir plate & dropped in a sterile stir bar and turned on the stir plate (picture attached). Then I poured in the 15 pounds of honey - the stir plate maintained a vortex (picture attached). Finally I poured in one pack of Safale S-05 yeast and put in a sterile airlock (picture attached).

From here on out time will tell. But I expect the MEAD to ferment faster. The settling time should be the same - about 6 months. That's how long I have my MEAD settle before it meets my standards.

 

[thargrav]

Any more feedback from the samples I sent out?

 

[thepirho]

Definitively waiting on more information.

 

[thargrav]

what information are you waiting for?

 

[wedge421]

Thats a huge bitch!

 

[Dirty]

Sorry its been a bit. Just tapped my first sample batch. I bottle my "Control Sample" so in a few more days i know if there are any flavor difference but so far the spun sample is great.

One thing i did do was i fermented in a bucket with the lid on but i didnt fill the airlock. Just sanitized and covered with foil. I figured this would allow it to breath just as you would with a started.

There are no apparent oxidation and the batch fermented down to terminal gravity in 6 days. Cold crashed for 2 and was kegged Sunday after Thanksgiving.

Double IPA up next.

Nice piece of equipment.

Rock Chalk

Chris

 

[thepirho]

what information are you waiting for?

How well it worked with the mead. Pretty interesting concept, accelerated mead fermenting, still age just as long?

 

[thargrav]

How well it worked with the mead. Pretty interesting concept, accelerated mead fermenting, still age just as long?

Accelerated mead fermenting. It''s been almost 8 days and my mead is already down to a bubble every 8 seconds. My mead starts with 15 pounds of honey and 5 gallons of water and a regular batch would be more active even now.

For those of you who only brew low gravity beer, one of my meads usually takes 3 months to completely ferment because of the high gravity. And even at the end of the third month I would have a bubble every minute or so.

Once the activity completely stops I'll sample and will know the outcome.

Settling will take about 6 months to produce a mead with no "floaties" in the bottle.

 

[bessieflames]

Right. Any pinhole will expose the beer to oxygen. Air is 21% oxygen and atmospheric pressure is 14.7PSI. Since there is no oxygen inside the carboy, atmospheric oxygen is now attempting to diffuse, with .21 X 14.7 = ~3PSI of pressure, on all of the outer surfaces of the sealed container. The airlock is keeping that oxygen out. While it's true that CO2 is heavier than air, if you have a leak, that ~3PSI of oxygen will rush in and become part of the gas mixture inside

While CO2 is technically toxic to yeast, having some in solution actually creates a cleaner tasting beer by inhibiting some yeast metabolism. It will definitely be interesting to hear what stir plate fermentations taste like.

There's a thread over in the "General Techniques" section about pressurized fermentation if you want to read more. Also, here's an article from Applied Microbiology and Biotechnology, titled "Effects of CO2 on the formation of flavour volatiles during fermentation with immobilized brewer’s yeast".

There is the same 14 psi pressure inside the carboy, so a leak wouldn't cause air to "rush" in. If anything, there is more pressure in the carboy because of positive pressure from the CO2 being released from solution.

 

[jusware]

I'm very interested to hear the results of the mead. It's very impressive that you can get a high gravity mead to ferment faster with the stirplate. I've thought about doing this with a 5L flask and a 1 gallon batch. 1 packed of un-rehydrated dry yeast however, is extremely underpitching. If you made a normal size starter I doubt it would take more than 3 weeks for full fermentation without the stir plate.

 

[thargrav]

How well it worked with the mead. Pretty interesting concept, accelerated mead fermenting, still age just as long?

The 3 months is not for aging, it's to lets the yeast completely settle out for a crystal clear mead. During the settling process I transfer the mead off the trube at least 3 times.

Mead making is more of a extreme hoppy for me. I will make a barch of beer at least once a month but I make one batch if mead a year just for the challenge.

But I guess I gat a little anal about lagers too, making sure they ferment & lager at just the right temperatures and not botting a lager until I fee that its ready.

 

[thargrav]

I'm very interested to hear the results of the mead. It's very impressive that you can get a high gravity mead to ferment faster with the stirplate. I've thought about doing this with a 5L flask and a 1 gallon batch. 1 packed of un-rehydrated dry yeast however, is extremely underpitching. If you made a normal size starter I doubt it would take more than 3 weeks for full fermentation without the stir plate.

I understand what you are saying but I've tried 2 packs of the same yeast with the same results.

 

[GNBrews]

There is the same 14 psi pressure inside the carboy, so a leak wouldn't cause air to "rush" in. If anything, there is more pressure in the carboy because of positive pressure from the CO2 being released from solution.

There's a physics principle called "Partial pressure of gases" that plays into effect (the math in my post). If there's oxygen outside the closed system (in the air outside the carboy), but the headspace contains little or none because of being used up by initial yeast metabolism, the oxygen molecules push on the outside of the container to try to come back into balance.

One of the reasons why beverage companies use PET plastics is that they have fairly low oxygen permeability. That 3PSI of pressure is actually a big deal at the molecular level.

 

[bessieflames]

There's a physics principle called "Partial pressure of gases" that plays into effect (the math in my post). If there's oxygen outside the closed system (in the air outside the carboy), but the headspace contains little or none because of being used up by initial yeast metabolism, the oxygen molecules push on the outside of the container to try to come back into balance.

One of the reasons why beverage companies use PET plastics is that they have fairly low oxygen permeability. That 3PSI of pressure is actually a big deal at the molecular level.

My bad--I didn't read your post thoroughly. I thought you were saying that there would be 14psi (atmospheric) pressure pushing in on the carboy and that a small pinhole would cause oxidation. I know about partial pressures (I'm an engineer). There would be the same partial pressure differential regardless of whether there is a stir plate or not. As soon as the CO2 clears the headspace of oxygen, you have that differential. That is why I like to use glass carboys. I think the main difference with a stir plate vs. without is that the gas in the headspace is being mixed, thus causing a greater chance of oxidation if O2 does get into the carboy. I think that with a glass carboy and a decent stopper you would be fine.

 

[thargrav]

My mead has finally stopped fermenting. I've checked the airlock 3 days in a row and no bubbles.

12/2/2011 to 1/7/2012 makes my mead fermentation just over one month long. That's not bad considering a typical fermentation for one of my meads is 3 months.

And the mead smells great - I'll sample it when I rack to the secondary for more settling.

 

[thargrav]

I just found this short article about high gravity beer.

http://www.northernbrewer.com/connect/2011/12/as-real-as-it-gets-19-beer/

 

[Skraor]

Buyers beware when purchasing anything directly from Tom Hargrave.

I'm sure you built a bad-ass stir-plate, but I wouldn't know because you didn't ship it to me after I paid you $175. Now after 5 emails, two voice mails, and 3 weeks later I've received no response from you and have filed a dispute with PayPal to receive a refund. I even contacted your distributor, Fox Equipment. Their response, "We heard he received parts to build more, hopefully he got all the parts!" I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt that you're not malicious, just a crappy business man.

To everyone else, if you want to buy the Black Maxx I suggest finding a retailer that can confirm it in stock. But unfortunately, I don't trust Tom's ability to honor/fill and warranty related orders. If you want more feedback just google "Thomas Hargrave Better Business Bureau."

BTW, I'm obviously rubbed wrong, but have no ill will. Just want my fellow brewers to know before spending their money.

 

[midfielder5]

Buyers beware when purchasing anything directly from Tom Hargrave.

Sorry to hear he found a new victim. Hopefully you get your money back.
I believe his companies are kegkits.com and stir-plate.com
There are threads on here asserting the same problems you encountered.
He has also replied giving his "side" of the story (see eg, late 2011, his business excuses make for some hilarious reading IMO).

anyways, just my opinion from being on HBT a while now. I believe his hbt user name was also banned last year too, (edit: or at least he stopped posting.)

 

[Skraor]

Wow. I had no clue Thomas Hargrave was such an arrogant, yet cowardly thief. He even has a local news investigation! .

Funny thing is all my stir-plate research was just using the "BlackMaxx" keyword. Consequently, I only came across this thread, a few others, and a couple youtube demos. Search "kegkits.com," and all the skeletons start rolling out. So yeah, his sites are www.stir-plate.com, www.kegkits.com, and www.towercooler.com. And his thargrave ID has was last used earlier this year...so he still lurks.

BTW, couldn't agree more, his back pedaling is pretty hilarious. I especially like: "I hurt a lot of people but no one more than me."

I'm in corporate finance, and I assure you that ANY retailer would take a 3 week float from collections to shipment in a heart beat. If he has legitimate business problems as he claims, and isn't just stealing, then he's a straight retard when it comes to pluses and minuses.

Thank god for PayPal and credit card insurance. I retract my statement about "not having ill will" towards Tom.

Thanks for the insight.

 

[emjay]

Weird. I got a FREE BlackMaxx as a test unit (the only difference from retail being that it only came with a single stir bar rather than two) before they actually started selling. As did about half a dozen other guys here.

The fact that he went to the trouble and expense of distributing these units (especially when he even incurred much higher shipping costs by sending one to me in Canada rather than to another of the many American applicants), for both beta testing *AND* research purposes leads me to believe that he's not so much malicious as he is, apparently, grossly incompetent.

It's actually a very nice product (and certainly beats the hell out of any DIY and even many retail stir plates), but that doesn't matter at all if people aren't getting it when they pay for it, which is unfortunate. The fact that he (even *ADMITTEDLY*) places his business' continued success, and his own personal income, above compensating customers who were previously ripped off when his first business went under is alarming enough for me to not trust him with any of my money, even despite the fact he has some interesting and unique products.

I'm apparently one of the few guys who actually came out ahead with him - for over $200 worth when you consider the free BlackMaxx plus shipping to Canada, all paid out of his pocket - and even I can't in good conscience recommend the guy. Like I said, he actually does have some great and unique products, and I don't think he's maliciously trying to rip people off, but his businesses seem to keep bombing so hard at the expense of his "customers" that, at the very least, it is obvious he has no business running a, well, business. And the fact I'm actually impressed with some of his stuff makes it all the more unfortunate; it's clear that he should NEVER have tried to operate retail businesses but rather have stuck to equipment development, and supplying actual, competent retailers. Now, his reputation might be too damaged even to manage that.