Yeast Washing Illustrated

[Bdogg]

I have done this twice now, here are my results:

For each of these shown I have 2 others (ie, harvested 3 jars from each cake). I have not used any yet.

I guess my question is, is a starter even required if you have this much? I was reading that yeast pitching rate calculator and it seems like I have enough in each jar that it might not be necessary. Of course there is the issue of viability, and it's not as if making a starter is difficult... whaddya think?

 

[nicadrick]

Bdogg,

Of the yeast you see visible in the jars, you cannot know which are still viable. Creating a starter a couple of days before brew day accomplishes 2 things for you. 1) It will let the dormant and health cell that you wash from previous brews MULTIPLY, this will create lots of hungry yeast for your upcoming brew. If nothing happens in 24-36 hours you will also know that your "washed" yeast is not too happy and you should buys some fresh. 2)If the cell are happy and multiply, you will eliminate a day of lag time on you ferment.

I just did this for a brew yesterday. Starter from washed yeast on Friday evening, stir plate for a couple of days, by pitching time on Sunday, the starter was full of fresh healthy, hungry yeasties.

4-6 hours after pitching, my brew wash bubbling away in a vigorous ferment. I will definitely continue to do starters!

 

[user 44002]

I'm sure this has been answered a million times in this thread, but even with search i just can't find it.

When I'm going to pitch a pint sized mason jar of washed yeast, I pour off all the wort-type stuff on top, and then mix up the trub and yeast and use that?

Also, can someone give me instructions for a starter if I do this?

 

[Pappers_]

Hi Ship. Here's a link that tells you all the basics about starters, including how to do one: http://www.mrmalty.com/starter_faq.htm

After you wash the yeast and store it in your fridge, you'll see some amber colored water on top - pour off most of that, and then mix up the yeast in the remaining little bit of water and pour it into a starter.

FYI, there is no/little trub, that is the point of the washing. You've "cleaned" the yeast of the trub.

 

[jdspaceman]

Just getting into the home brewing. ?. do you have to use the washed yeast for the same type of beer the next time around? (aside from the type of strain it is) or can you use it for different recipes?

 

[scottlindner]

Just getting into the home brewing. ?. do you have to use the washed yeast for the same type of beer the next time around? (aside from the type of strain it is) or can you use it for different recipes?

Totally different recipes. Consider it a fresh vial of the original that you bought from the LHBS.

Scott

 

[jdspaceman]

So I could use it for a different recipe, as long as that recipe calls for that strain of yeast? the other "recipe" has been washed off.

At that point, is there a strain of yeast that is more widely used? just curious

 

[scottlindner]

So I could use it for a different recipe, as long as that recipe calls for that strain of yeast? the other "recipe" has been washed off.

At that point, is there a strain of yeast that is more widely used? just curious

Yes, you understand correctly. However, the viability of the yeast you wash may not be as high as the original vial you purchased. Most suggest using a starter to get the yeasties partying again and to multiply to a number that is appropriate to your brew. I'm sure if you haven't stored it too long that you could pitch it straight into your next brew without a starter and you'd have a fine brew, but don't take that as advice from me. I haven't washed yeast or made starters. I use another similar (lazier?) technique.

As for the most common strains, that really depends on what you like. I personally am a huge fan of WLP001/Wyeast 1056.

Cheers,
Scott

 

[StarCityBrewMaster]

Simple question here: I have made starters from scratch and I seem to understand the yeast washing process and want to try it asap.

What is the process of making a starter from the washed yeast? Thanks!

 

[hopvine]

Simple question here: I have made starters from scratch and I seem to understand the yeast washing process and want to try it asap.

What is the process of making a starter from the washed yeast? Thanks!

You simply pour off most of the liquid resting on top of the yeast, shake it up to get the yeast unstuck, and then pour that into your starter as you would a White Labs vial or Wyeast smack pack.

 

[Spaceball1]

I read the first 35 pages of this but didn't see anything regarding a couple of questions I had..

First off.. Just to be clear, I pour the sterilized & cooled water directly on to my trub/cake at the bottom of my primary, right? Using a pic from the OP..

Pour the water from the jars into the carboy

So immediately prior to this picture, I've racked my beer over into my bottling container and at the bottom of the carboy in this picture, there would be a good 1.5"-2" cake of yeast/trub, right?

Next question..

I use a bucket (not a carboy) as my primary, so I won't be able to see the initial separation prior to the first pour. So I take it that I just wait 20 minutes or so and then just pour to the large glass container. Without being able to see the initial bottom layer of crap, I'm guessing that it would be ok if I just stopped short of pouring the whole thing? Maybe stop at roughly 1/2" short? And then maybe I could settle out the remaining stuff twice (in a 2nd large glass container) to compensate?

 

[Schnitzengiggle]

I read the first 35 pages of this but didn't see anything regarding a couple of questions I had..

First off.. Just to be clear, I pour the sterilized & cooled water directly on to my trub/cake at the bottom of my primary, right? Using a pic from the OP..

Yes.

So immediately prior to this picture, I've racked my beer over into my bottling container and at the bottom of the carboy in this picture, there would be a good 1.5"-2" cake of yeast/trub, right?

Yes.

I use a bucket (not a carboy) as my primary, so I won't be able to see the initial separation prior to the first pour. So I take it that I just wait 20 minutes or so and then just pour to the large glass container. Without being able to see the initial bottom layer of crap, I'm guessing that it would be ok if I just stopped short of pouring the whole thing? Maybe stop at roughly 1/2" short? And then maybe I could settle out the remaining stuff twice (in a 2nd large glass container) to compensate?

Yes, I use buckets for the time being as well, and I just wait 20-30 minutes to allow separation, when you are pouring into your containers, you'll be able to see the trub you don't want going in there towards the end.

I allow it to separate in a large quart jar, then pour into my pint jars, after the second separation, it has worked very well for me.

FWIW, if you are using English Yeast strain, be sure to shake the bejeezus out of it after pouring to break up the clumps of yeast, it will make for a better separation.

 

[400d]

I have a question here. How do I measure the amount of yeast for the next batch? How do I know if I over pitch or under pitch when I use washed yeast?

 

[Rick500]

From what I've read, the cell density in the slurry should be roughly equivalent to what you'd get in a Wyeast or White Labs tube/packet.

 

[dp69_2001]

Well, the first thing you do is drink a beer... then you look at your washed yeast.. If it's only a little bit, use a starter. If it's a lot, toss it in your batch and get ready for a really fast fermentation. Finally, don't really worry about over pitching for the most part, just as long as you have enough healthy yeast to start a good fermentation you'll be fine.

 

[brew hoperator]

I have two questions that I want to get some clairification on:

One of my batches that I wanted to do wash the yeast has the "band aid taste to it. If I washed the yeast of this batch would the band aid taste carry over to the next batches?

Also, this might have been discussed earlier but I just washed some yeast for the first time yesterday and I noticed a VERY small layer of material that is darker than the washed yeast. Is this normal?

Thanks in advance

 

[dp69_2001]

I have two questions that I want to get some clairification on:

One of my batches that I wanted to do wash the yeast has the "band aid taste to it. If I washed the yeast of this batch would the band aid taste carry over to the next batches?

Hmm... you might not want to wash the yeast from that batch. I'm not sure if it would carry over or not.

I noticed a VERY small layer of material that is darker than the washed yeast. Is this normal?

Yes, that's just trub (hops, tired yeast, and other protiens from your batch)

 

[digphish]

I preface this by saying I have read all 65 pages of this thread, and felt confident after reading everything that my first yeast wash would go smooth. Well...it didn't. I bottled my Kolsch, and then poured the sanitized and cooled water from the quart and 4 pint jars into the trub and shook it up a bit. Waited 20 minutes, and poured it into the big jar. Then waited another 20 min and poured the big jar into the 4 pint jars and put them in the fridge. As of this afternoon (about 18 hours from when I did the wash), there is only a very tiny layer of yeast at the bottom, and clear "beer" above. What did i do wrong? I am wondering if I only needed to wait 10 minutes in the fermenter to pour. Will the tiny bit of yeast be usable?

Thank for any help...

 

[ascha]

Is there any benefit from removing the air in the headspace? Just picked up one of these for storing grain and wondered if this would be a benefit at all?

 

[tincob]

I washed (3) 1/2 pint jars from a hefeweizen batch back in 11/22/09. I found differing opinions on the viability of hefe yeasts on the internet. This is my experience with my washed yeasts. YMMV.

I brewed two batches with the three 1/2 pint jars

First jar was used ~2 months later to brew another hefeweizen batch. 1 L starter which roused up quickly within 24 hours.
No problem with the resulting hefeweizen beer. It tasted fine.

The second and third jars were used to make a 2 L starter for a dunkelweizen a week ago (4/2). My reasoning for using both remaining jars was that the yeast viability was probably pretty low at this point. The starter took about 48 hours before I saw a krausen in the starter. I brewed on the third day and pitched the starter 72 hours after putting it on the stir plate.

I also pitched the magnetic stir bar but that's another story.

There was very little lag and I was getting co2 bubbles the next morning. I haven't tasted the batch yet but the smell is the typical clove and banana hefe yeast odor. Nothing off.

I will wash three jars of yeast from this dunkelweizen batch.

So here's a data point that 4 month is a viable time period for washed WLP300 hefeweizen yeast.

 

[tamoore]

Here's the result of my first yeast washing.. it went pretty well.

I'm planning on brewing this weekend, and I'll need to make a yeast starter. Using the Mr. Malty calculator, I have to make a 1.47L starter for 1 smack pack....

How do I convert one of these jars to 'smack packs' to avoid over pitching?

Thanks!

 

[jalgayer]

good question. how do I know (or approximate) just how much yeast there is in one of the washed yeast mason jars? Is there a volume formula of some sort?

 

[Beavdowg]

For some reason I'm not getting near as much yeast as you in the bottom of my jars as you guys are. I'm getting maybe a 5-10mm high pile of yeast in the bottom. I wonder if I'm being TOO careful in not including any trub when I pour it out and not capturing all the yeast.

 

[scottlindner]

For some reason I'm not getting near as much yeast as you in the bottom of my jars as you guys are. I'm getting maybe a 5-10mm high pile of yeast in the bottom. I wonder if I'm being TOO careful in not including any trub when I pour it out and not capturing all the yeast.

Hehe.. my first attempt (I was quick about it and didn't care if it was a success) was just the opposite of yours. I got just as much, if not more, but you can see color layers... so the washing didn't work so well.

I figure that a little trub isn't going to hurt me if I pitch reasonably soon. If not, I'll just dump it all or see if my dog wants to eat it.

Scott

 

[Grizzlybrew]

How do I convert one of these jars to 'smack packs' to avoid over pitching?

Thanks![/quote]

[quote="jalgayer, post: 2016880"]good question. how do I know (or approximate) just how much yeast there is in one of the washed yeast mason jars? Is there a volume formula of some sort?[/quote]

I've got the same question!

[quote="Beavdowg, post: 2017688"]For some reason I'm not getting near as much yeast as you in the bottom of my jars as you guys are. I'm getting maybe a 5-10mm high pile of yeast in the bottom. I wonder if I'm being TOO careful in not including any trub when I pour it out and not capturing all the yeast.[/quote]

How long are you letting it rest for each stage before decanting? You may have too much settling out.

 

[400d]

good question. how do I know (or approximate) just how much yeast there is in one of the washed yeast mason jars? Is there a volume formula of some sort?

This is the same question that I have!

I also wanted to ask is it safe to keep washed yeast in plastic tight sealed jars?

 

[Grizzlybrew]

I also wanted to ask is it safe to keep washed yeast in plastic tight sealed jars?

I would make sure the plastic provides an oxygen barrier (to help keep the yeast dormant). Otherwise, I would use glass containers.

 

[Grizzlybrew]

Well, it seemed at least a few of us recently had this question and I'm sure plenty more had, have or will have the question: how many cells are in the harvest?

If the post in this link is reliable (which I think it is for the most part), then the following is true:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f163/why-not-pitch-your-yeast-cake-166221/

You can expect around 1 billion active cells in a ml of harvested slurry, depending on how much trub and break material makes it into the fermenter. My counts ranged from 0.5 billion to 2 billion, depending on style brewed and brewery practice. 1 billion is a solid average across a dozen different breweries, professional and amateur.

Thus, 228 ml of freshly-harvested slurry is the correct pitch for 5 gallons of 1.048 wort. Conveniently, that's only a few ml less than that found in one cup (8 fluid ounces).

So, it would appear that each 8 oz. (or half-pint) jar of harvested yeast contains approximately enough yeast for a 5-gallon batch or 1.048 beer. If you couple that with the fact that viability decreases with stored slurry, then one 8 oz jar of slurry pitched into a small starter should be appropriate for your (my) average 1.054 beer.

Read the post - there's a lot of good info in there. And... Denny was the first off the bat to comment on it!

 

[BBKing]

Awesome!

Before seeing this the whole "yeast farming" thing seemed a mystery to me.

The PacMan will live on!!!

 

[Grizzlybrew]

The PacMan will live on!!!

This was my thought exactly. I'm not going to wait another three years...

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f163/yeast-pickles-174556/

 

[Robsbrew]

So let me get this strait. Im a noob too. I have an American ale I brewed on tue in my primary now. Im racking into a secondary on tue. Can I just go ahead and brew another batch and pour directly onto the cakes substance on the bottom (Im assuming that is the yeast and hops)? If I did happen to do this, would I even need to pitch more yeast? Or should I wash the yest like at the begining of the thread and make a starter and pitch from there?

 

[Grizzlybrew]

So let me get this strait. Im a noob too. I have an American ale I brewed on tue in my primary now. Im racking into a secondary on tue. Can I just go ahead and brew another batch and pour directly onto the cakes substance on the bottom (Im assuming that is the yeast and hops)? If I did happen to do this, would I even need to pitch more yeast? Or should I wash the yest like at the begining of the thread and make a starter and pitch from there?

There is another post on here explaining why you should never just repitch onto a cake. That being said, it's been done forever and probably will continue to be done forever I'm sure. The basic premise is that you are over-pitching the quantity of yeast that you need. Over pitching can do funny things to the way yeast acts just as under pitching-can.

So, if you are going to simply dump on top of a used yeast cake, realize that any grain, hop and protein matter from the previous batch(es) will still be in there contributing some flavors - think vegetal after a while. I wouldn't reuse a cake this way more than once or twice (and most people will say to brew stronger, darker, more flavorful, etc beers sunsequently if using this method).

The yeast washing (or rinsing, more appropriately) method illustrated in this post is super simple and so effective. Give it a shot and you won't be disappointed. Each 1/2 pint jar is almost perfect (yeast count) for your average beer although you should probably do a small starter to account for yeasties that go dormant permanently.

Hope that helps.

 

[jalgayer]

When you say each 1/2 pint jar... are you implying that the 1/2 pint is ALL yeast? Ot yeast at bottom with beer on top? Because I havent seen anyone harvest and get a full 1/2 pint of yeast. Thanks for clearing me up.

 

[DanPoch]

When you say each 1/2 pint jar... are you implying that the 1/2 pint is ALL yeast? Ot yeast at bottom with beer on top? Because I havent seen anyone harvest and get a full 1/2 pint of yeast. Thanks for clearing me up.

Yeast at the bottom of the jar, and liquid on top.

Ideally with washed yeast it would be clear boiled and cooled water on top.

 

[brew hoperator]

I have fairly hard water and after I boil the mason jars, lids, and tongs I noticed that there is some small granular white material. The material is not not there before I boil and I thoroughly wash and rinse everything before I boil.

Does anyone know what this is? And is it still okay to use for washing?

 

[Phunhog]

I believe that it is calcium that has precipitated out. I get the same thing when I wash my yeast. I don't think it will hurt anything.

 

[cravej]

My first attempt. I filled (8) 8oz. jars and got very different results between all of the jars. Should I just dump the ones that are mostly trub?

 

[oldschool]

If you use washed yeast, how would you ever know how large of a starter to make if you don't know how much yeast you start with? This seems like a cheap way but inconsistant.

 

[Palefire]

My first attempt. I filled (8) 8oz. jars and got very different results between all of the jars. Should I just dump the ones that are mostly trub?

I wouldn't - you can wash those jars again. Wait for things to settle, pour out the liquid on top, add more boiled (and cooled) water, shake and decant. You might want to combine the yeast from the jars that have the trub in them - together they'd give you one nice jar of yeast.

 

[BigB]

I just used some yeast I washed back in early January...It was my first attempt. I had a good starter and a fantastic fermentation going this morning.