Under Modified Malts

[XXXBrewDude]

Are there any more under modified malts availible? Id like to try a decoction mash but seams pointless without the malt. Does anyone have any average performance maltster spec sheets with SNR info? I can go down the list of maltsters, contacting, and ask the question but I bet someone has already.
Thanks

 

[Black Island Brewer]

A quick search turned this up, but I can't say I've used it. http://www.northernbrewer.com/shop/...rmann-floor-malted-bohemian-pilsner-malt.html

 

[XXXBrewDude]

Yes, this one I found as well. But without northern stating slightly under modified I wouldn't have known. I wonder if all Weyermann floor malts made in the traditional fashion are under modified ? I began my search on Weyermann web site and they also don't state SNR . I've purchased bags of Weyermann b- pils and also Munich and no specs on or in the bag. Just a PDF reference for lot info but not sure where to find. Maybe under modified is not desirable to most breweries so they don't publish.


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[Black Island Brewer]

I looked up the general specs on another site (http://bsghandcraft.com/resources/weyermann_specs), and you're right: the ratio is 37-42 on the bo pils, so undermodified would not be the way I'd describe it.

I heard that Coors uses undermodified malt, and that they do their own malting, but I can't confirm it. The only reason I mention it is because I also heard that sometimes their malt becomes available on the open market.

Sorry I couldn't be more help. I'll be interested to see what you find. Doing a decoction mash is on my bucket list.

 

[tootal]

I have heard the Moravian Pils is still under modified but that may not be true anymore. If you want to decoct you don't need under modifed malt. Under modifed malt can benefit from decoction, but you can decoct any malt. The difference would we the length of rest and the temperature. If doing a tripel decoction I would start out at 100 degrees F. Decoct to 131 for 20 minutes max. Decoct to 144 for a 15-30 minute rest depending on the style. Decoct to 158 until conversion is complete.

Another way is to start at 131, to 144, to 158 and then mash out with a third decoction.

And another way is to do a single decoction from 131 to anywhere between 148 to 158 depending on the style.

Melanoidans are goood!

 

[XXXBrewDude]

I looked up the general specs on another site (http://bsghandcraft.com/resources/weyermann_specs), and you're right: the ratio is 37-42 on the bo pils, so undermodified would not be the way I'd describe it.

I heard that Coors uses undermodified malt, and that they do their own malting, but I can't confirm it. The only reason I mention it is because I also heard that sometimes their malt becomes available on the open market.

Sorry I couldn't be more help. I'll be interested to see what you find. Doing a decoction mash is on my bucket list.

I believe that's the standard b-pils not the floor malt. I don't see the floor malt on the list. I'm going to get a bag of the wheat floor malt and give it a shot. Sounds gooood

 

[VladOfTrub]

Crisp Euro Pils, SNR 34-37. The malt is produced expressly for decoction and step. Weyermann recommends using the bar code off the bag to get the grain spec.. Malt specs vary by season, location and variety. Their Boh Pils is under modified to slightly modified. The last 10 bags of Boh Pils I went through was Kolbach 37. SNR is different than Kolbach. The difference is due to testing lab and the formula used; IOB, ECG or ASBC. Weyermann at the Ghent Symposium had their floor malt spec sheet, Kolbach was 37, under modified. Tri-decoction was used for the beer being produced. Kolbach 37 would be 36 SNR, under modified. Many malsters consider a number below 38 Kolbach as under modified. As one brewer mentioned, modern malt can work with a protein rest. Back in 1977 a Ph.D tried to get his name in lights, advocating that a protein rest wasn't needed with high mod malt. He was right. By choice, it doesn't have to be performed. Gambrinus disagreed with the broad statement the guy made and put the matter to bed doing lab experiments using a protein rest with high modified. The summary: High modified, employing a protein rest produced a more stable, higher quality beer, than a beer produced without the rest. The Ph.D wandered away into obscurity. However, what he wrote, is still around and by some, considered gospel. Protein rest temp is determined by Kolbach or the SNR number.

From Murphy Malting:

The Total soluble nitrogen content is now regarded as giving the clearest indication of the modification of the malt.

Total soluble N x 100
Total N = Kolbach Index of Modification


A value of 38 - 40 is taken as satisfactory, lower values being an indication of under-modification and higher values of over-modification.

 

[XXXBrewDude]

""The last 10 bags of Boh Pils I went through was Kolbach 37.""

Vlat, was this the floor malt? Or does it even matter if its the standard B-Pils or the floor malt?

Thanx for the specifics on these malts:rockin:

 

[ArcaneXor]

The floor-malted BoPils has a Kolbach index ranging from 38 to 44, which is about the same as the regular BoPils and higher than their regular Pils malt.

 

[Denny]

nm

 

[VladOfTrub]

Boh Pils light floor malt, spec sheet was by bar code, 37 Kolbach, 36 SNR. It depends on the variety of malt and climate it grows in. Use the bar code off the sack to get the exact data. Weyermann can trace the grain back to the farm it was grown at. English malsters will produce over modified as high as 45. Above 45, malt becomes less useful in brewing, unless a beer without head and body are desired. Generally, high and over modified are soaked for two days and malted at high temp for two days. Then, high temp kilned for two days, crystalizing, converting and inverting the starch. Production costs are lower. High and over modified can go from the field to the sack in five to seven days. I think Briess and Cargill are six days. Marris may be produced using a longer malting process. Its L is 50-60. It takes five days of low temp malting and five days of low temp kilning to produce enzymatically rich malt. The term "modern malt" came about when the guy that placed a patent on black malt in the early part of the 19th century, developed a cylindrical roaster with water infusion to speed up the production process. The term can be found in IOB journals as far back as 1915.

 

[cjgenever]

There is a brew strong labeled malt analysis or decoction brewing. In there Palmer mentions a bries(?) Malt that is purposely designed for decoctions. they under modify the malt on purpose.

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[cjgenever]

I would listen to the brew strong episode on decoctions before bothering.

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[Steven Sinclair]

I would highly recommend the malt from Mecca Grade in Madras, Oregon...especially their Gateway malt. Perfect for decoction/step mash.

 

[dmtaylor]

Unfortunately(?), undermodified malts are not sold by any of the big maltsters, never have been and probably never will. Floor malted is still very well modified. Anyone who says otherwise is mistaken.

If Mecca is purposely making some, that would be news and would be a new adventure for many of us.

 

[Vale71]

The only way to get your hands on undermodified malt is to make your own. The Urquell brewery in Plzen has its own malthouse just for this very reason. Their traditional triple-decoction process just wouldn't work as well with modern, well-modified malt so they have to make their own.