To potassium sorbate or not to potassium sorbate..

[Drinksahoy]

That is my question.

So I was trying to do some research on the proper fermentation halting method using potassium sorbate and campden tablets.
For every 1 post in favor I find 5 against it.

Why is this?

I have been making mead and cider for a few months now and everything comes out so dry that my friends and family don't like it.
I don't mind it but then again I made it.

I want to either halt fermentation at my desired FG or ferment to dry and then halt it and back sweeten.

But I keep reading people suggesting alternative and much more expensive methods!

 

[Maylar]

It depends on your equipment and capabilities. Folks who can "cold crash" and filter ($$) have options that the rest of us don't. The practical thing for the average cider maker to do is let the cider finish dry, clear, then stabilize with sorbate and sulfite. Then you can sweeten without worries.

 

[Drewed]

It is easier to stop a woman's tears than to halt a ferment exactally where you want it. You could do some fancy math and up the OG and use a yeast that will crap out at a specific ABV and end up with a sweeter cider.
They have mead calculators on line, I wonder if they have a cider one....
There is nothing wrong with using K-sorb and campden, unless you are trying to bottle carbonate, then you can't. You could also backsweeten with non-fermentable sugars, or artificial sweeteners - but the last batch I did with that kind of tastes like Tab. I can tell the artificial sweetness, although I haven't tried all of them.
You could also backsweeten, bottle and then pasteurize when you have the amount of carbonation you want.

 

[Drinksahoy]

Okay so go to dry and clear rather than try to stop where I want. And k sorbate + campden is okay and won't compromise the flavor?

 

[Yooper]

Okay so go to dry and clear rather than try to stop where I want. And k sorbate + campden is okay and won't compromise the flavor?

Yes, as a rule. If you use the proper amount, the sorbate should not have a flavor or at least not much of one.

If I don't sweeten a wine or cider (my preference is dry), I don't use sorbate. To sweeten, sorbate has to be used to prevent fermentation from restarting unless you sterile filter.

 

[Drinksahoy]

Do I need to cold crash before adding the potassiums?

 

[Maylar]

No. But you do want the ferment to be done, and not dropping any more lees. Gotta leave the yeast behind before stabilizing. Cold crashing will accelerate that, but time works too.

 

[Scrumpy!]

A French monk in the champagne region solved this problem in the nineteenth century. When his wine was nearly done fermenting, he put it in strong bottles to carbonate and complete fermentation. When the pressure was sufficient, he inverted the bottles for a few months twisting them every day to let gravity drive the lees to the neck of the bottle. He froze the neck, popped the top, and let the pressure blow out the remaining yeast in an ice plug. He added a sugar syrup to sweeten it a little, added a little more wine to top up the bottles, corked them, waited a while to make sure they didn't start to ferment, popped the corks and found that a carbonated white wine goes right to the head.

Cider is even easier than champagne. I only invert and twist for a week or so. The process of blasting out the lees is great fun and a good excuse to get popped yourself during the process. A little sulfite is all it takes to suppress the minute amount of yeast that might or might not remain and there is no sorbate, or unfermentable/indigestible sweeteners to interfere with the taste or stimulate your bowels. Mine have kept for nearly a year and probably could go longer but how would I know since I will drink them all by the time this year's batch is ready. It is a nice pour all the way to the bottom since there are no lees if you do this process correctly.

Cheers

 

[bembel]

I can second Scrumpy's advice and attest to the tasty results. Disgorging is a....blast [emoji12]

 

[kitchenboy]

I know how they do this at the champagne houses, but how do you do it at home. Need Details Please: Brine? How do you chill it? What is the salt concentration? Etc.

 

[bembel]

There is some excellent discussion on the Google Cider Group you can reference, but in a nut shell:

Turn your bottles upside down in a case for about a week, spin them a few times if you wish to help all the yeast settle in the neck on the cap.

Use a 25-30% solution by weight of calcium chloride and water, I use a plastic 12 bottle Fast Rack drying rack and tray, which I cut an additional 1/4 inch off the legs, to hold the bottles upside down so that the solution ( in the tray) goes up about 1/3 of an inch over the top of the upside down bottles - you can adjust the level as needed, this whole set up I put in my freezer till the solution is about -15 C or close to 0 F, even better if you can get it colder - FYI DONT SPILL - highly corrosive - when the solution gets as cold as possible- you can use a thermometer to check - (Thermoworks sells a ton of inexpensive options) or just turn your freezer on the lowest temp setting, then put the bottles in until a plug of ice forms at the cap - 10-15 min, then pop the top off as you turn the bottle right side up- ice plug flies out along with some cider so do this in the shower or outside - you need to top off the lost volume with an already open bottle and re-cap.

 

[Scrumpy!]

Check my post to this thread for more information. https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=592419

If you need more details, repost to this thread and I will respond.