Starting gravity limitation

[RoatanBill]

I'm researching equipment of all kinds and came across a limitation for the Braumeister as follows: Because of size constraints of the mash tub the largest starting gravity beer you can brew is between 1.060 to 1.065.

What is this trying to tell ignorant me? I suspect it has something to do with final alcohol content, but I have no idea how alcohol content relates to beer styles or if it relates at all.
How can I relate this range to beer styles, commercial beer brands or something I'm familiar with as a beer drinker having absolutely no brewing experience?

FYI - I drink "Guinness Foreign Extra" and would rather drink water than anyone's light beer. I want flavor and could care less about alcohol content but I suspect they are correlated.

 

[flars]

The constraint is the maximum pounds of grain the mash tun will hold. Pounds of grain is roughly correlated to specific gravity.

 

[jurgenph]

it's probably a number calculated by the max volume of malt you can add to the mash tun, expected efficiency and the batch size of the boil kettle, all maxxed out

i'm sure you can make higher SG wort if you change one or of those factors.

either way, you're not going to brew a "light" beer with a SG of 1.060 or more

J.

 

[Calder]

1.060 will get you about a 6.0% beer. That will cover most 'normal' beers, but you can forget about Imperials, big IPAs, most Belgians, and other strong beers.

You could make these, but you would need to add extract and/or sugar to the fermenter to increase the OG.

 

[RoatanBill]

I just checked the Guinness I drink and it's 7.5% . I googled "stout abv" and found alcohol numbers all over the place.

How serious a limitation is this starting gravity number without resorting to DME (I'm learning) or other extra ordinary techniques to get a particular beer formula accomplished? Asked another way, what percentage of all the beer formulas out there would be eliminated by this restriction assuming no sneaky tricks to try to over come it?

I'm just trying to determine how much of a niche product this really is.

Thank You

 

[CA_Mouse]

There are many styles of beer and even more Starting Gravities/Final Gravities in each style. There are many ways to compete with limitations as well. You can use less water and produce a higher starting gravity and smaller batch, you can boil a standard sized batch longer to reduce the volume and increase the starting gravity. Partial Mash is another, this is where you mash part of your recipe and then add extract near the end of the boil. Best things to suggest is find something that you like and work on that with your system until you need to upgrade to work on other styles.

Your example of Stouts is one of my favorite ones to use. I've done Sweet Stouts at 5.5% ABV and Bourbon Barrel Aged Foreign Extra Stouts weighing in at 9.2% ABV. There is a big push for Session Beers as well, which are actually a lot harder to produce without having them seem thin or not having a malty taste. These are a real challenge because they are typically below 4% ABV.

 

[RM-MN]

I'm researching equipment of all kinds and came across a limitation for the Braumeister as follows: Because of size constraints of the mash tub the largest starting gravity beer you can brew is between 1.060 to 1.065.

What is this trying to tell ignorant me? I suspect it has something to do with final alcohol content, but I have no idea how alcohol content relates to beer styles or if it relates at all.
How can I relate this range to beer styles, commercial beer brands or something I'm familiar with as a beer drinker having absolutely no brewing experience?

FYI - I drink "Guinness Foreign Extra" and would rather drink water than anyone's light beer. I want flavor and could care less about alcohol content but I suspect they are correlated.

What this it telling you is that at the typical brewhouse efficiency and the amount of starting water you will need the container will only then allow enough grain to get this amount of fermentable sugars. It's a marketing thing. My brewhouse efficiency is through the roof so I could probably get an OG of over 1.080 with that but another brewer with real low efficiency might not get to 1.050.

There can be little correlation between alcohol content and flavor. As a brewer you have control over both. I can make a stout with lots of flavor and little alcohol or can go the other way and make on with little flavor and lots of alcohol or can make on with lots of flavor and high alcohol. As you learn about brewing you will begin to understand the relationship between these. Here's a good place to start learning about the brewing process. www.howtobrew.com

 

[RoatanBill]

Thanks to everyone.

After doing more research I'm going to forget about this single pot method. I inherently don't like purchasing something with known limitations when I have no idea if I may fall victim to those limitations.

The price of their device isn't cheap, so I'm back at again leaning towards 3 pots (all electric) , some pumps and initially manually monitoring a brew day just to get the feel of what that's like. Later, once I better understand what's involved, I'll think about automation.

 

[NSMikeD]

Thanks to everyone.

After doing more research I'm going to forget about this single pot method. I inherently don't like purchasing something with known limitations when I have no idea if I may fall victim to those limitations.

The price of their device isn't cheap, so I'm back at again leaning towards 3 pots (all electric) , some pumps and initially manually monitoring a brew day just to get the feel of what that's like. Later, once I better understand what's involved, I'll think about automation.

I presume you drink Guinness Foreign Extra Stout. What you drink goes through some big steps - it's an extract beer (the hopped extract shipped form Ireland) that is added to a locally brewed pale ale. I don't know if that is what you had in mind for you home-brew.

7.5% ABV is a big beer. From experience, if you enjoy crafted beer, you'll enjoy your home brew and high ABV beers can be a problem when it comes to enjoying a number of your own pints. Don't confuse ABV for flavor.

You can brew extremely big flavor beers without the high alcohol level (probably a good thing in hot weather climates).

Most of my beers are what would be considered "session" beers in their ABV but holy smokes they can have great flavor. I purposely brew BIAB for the simplicity. On the occasion I want to brew a 'big' beer that the grain bill exceeds my pot size, I simply add water after pulling the grains (sometime "sparging: by pouring the water through the grains first) to bring it to brew size or I add some extract to the boil. These are simple steps that take when you have to be attending to other brew anyway.

I'm not saying that the 3 kettle is not better for you than the grainfather. It may very well be.

What I am saying is the limitation isn't what you might think it is. You might very well end up brewing 90% of your beers with recipes that will fit in the grainfather and you would be surprised how easy it is to brew higher ABVs in a grainfather by adding additional water after the mash or adding some extract to the boil. The stuff that will add the flavors you seek will not be affected by the grandfathers limitations.

BTW, there there is a third scenario to consider. You may not want to brew 5 gallon batches of high ABV beers. You can easily brew and keg a 3 gallon batch and do a full volume mash of a high grain bill recipe.

Good luck, but in either case, you really can't go wrong. Both systems will brew great beer. It's hard for you to translate what you like into what equipment will suit you best, until you start actually brewing.

 

[RoatanBill]

Hello NSMikeD from Long Island. I grew up in Ridgewood, Queens.

What you drink goes through some big steps - it's an extract beer (the hopped extract shipped form Ireland) that is added to a locally brewed pale ale.

I always wondered how that was done. There's no indication on the bottle where that Extra Stout came from. I was in New York recently and got a case of Negra Modelo and it was awful. I drank that regularly in Texas but the NY version was swamp water. Now I think I know why.

... if you enjoy crafted beer ...

I've never had a craft beer. I have no idea what I'm missing. I'm simply assuming I can find some recipes that I'll like.

The most "exotic" beers I ever had was the liter of Australian stout at Outback Steak House and some Belgian brew I had sitting under an umbrella in the Texas Hill Country in mid July heat. That liter of Belgian was memorable. I paid the bill, got up to leave and sat back down again; handed the keys to my wife and told her she's driving. That stuff packed a wallop. Very sneaky brew.

I'm after flavor and texture. I'd experiment on anything that promises to supply both regardless of ABV.

It's hard for you to translate what you like into what equipment will suit you best, until you start actually brewing.

Truer words were never spoken. It's a Catch-22. I'm going to have to take a leap of faith at some point and just spend some bucks. As the saying on here goes, I'd like to spend once and cry once so I'll do the research till I feel confidant enough to make a decision.

 

[NSMikeD]

Negro Modelo is a dunkel (dark) german lager style beer. I wouldn't classify this as a novice beer. The grain bill and mash techniques are not that simple and lagers require cold maturation (but then again, in your climate, you probably will need a fermentation refrigerator for your ales to keep them in the 63-68° range). Modelo is 5.4% ABV. It has a malty taste and the complexity comes from a diversified grain bill.

Most new brewers start with a simple pale ale. 90% of the grain bill being 2-row pale ale malt and 10% of a specialty grain, like a crystal malt that will add caramel-like un-fermentable sugars to the beer, adding depth of flavors and head retention. These can be lightly or dark roasted imparting flavors much like light or dark roasting affect coffee. You'll find most recipes will use 80-90% base malt with 10-20% specialty grains to give each beer it's unique characteristics.

Hops are added at different points in the boil to add bitterness, flavor, and aroma to the beer. Americans are hop heads so our beers tend to use a lot of hops all along the spectrum. British ales tend to focus on bettering end.

The combinations are endless and for every rule there are exceptions.

You might what to look at starting with small batch stove top BIAB. The equipment is nothing more than a pot, a bag and a fermenting vessel (plus siphoning tubes, thermometers, hydrometers, bottle/kegging equipment). With the low cost to start and simplicity, you can gain valuable brewing experience and find recipes you like. Then you can upgrade to a system that is best for your needs and you can always use the small batch pot and fermentor to experiment with recipes without having to commit to a full sized batch.


PS: both sides of my family are from queens - LI City, Astoria, Sunnyside and Forest Hills. After college, I bought a coop near St Johns making the daily commute to Manhattan.

 

[RoatanBill]

NSMikeD:

I've checked prices on the basic pots and they seemed quite reasonable; taking Spike as an example. I TIG weld and know food grade Stainless Steel is expensive so their pot prices aren't out of line with thicker metal than most and welded fittings.

Then I checked the price on one of their turn key systems and wondered where a gold brick figured into brewing as there had to be one in there somewhere. I guess the nickles and dimes add up fast.

I'm going to figure up a parts list for a HERMS style system just to see where the money goes. I'm just curious. I'm no where near purchasing anything yet.