How much did you pitch? What was your OG? I have 600ml of 2206 that was harvested 7/15 which I am planning to pitch into a munich helles tomorrow, but I'm getting cold feet. I'm so used to having a starter these days. Thinking I might still be able to make a starter out of 200 ml to make sure I have the right amount of healthy yeast when its time to pitch. Someone hit me with the RDWHAHB!
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How much did you pitch? What was your OG? I have 600ml of 2206 that was harvested 7/15 which I am planning to pitch into a munich helles tomorrow, but I'm getting cold feet. I'm so used to having a starter these days. Thinking I might still be able to make a starter out of 200 ml to make sure I have the right amount of healthy yeast when its time to pitch. Someone hit me with the RDWHAHB!
christyle
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I forget what the amount was, I don't really measure it. I fill one or two small mason jars (Maybe the pint size?) with yeast/trub when I want to harvest it, then decant and pitch. Probably about 400mL of junk. I've made starters for one or two, and i've direct pitched. I like to make a starter just to be sure, but enough people talked of direct pitching I just went for it. My OG was 1.08 on this one.
Your high gravity is probably a factor in the long lag time with this one. Sometimes it just takes a while too. My direct pitches usually take off in 6-18 hours but I had one that took a little over 24.
christyle
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With all the talk of people not needing very much yeast, using part of their mason jars, etc, I figured I might be overpitching. Interesting. I put into the calculator on mrmalty for slurry (First time i've used it) and it said I needed about 1300mL of slurry? That seems like a ton, but the viability listed really drops off after a few weeks.
I figure this batch had enough issues, why not get some mutant Notty/London ale mixture in the batch as well
I figure this batch had enough issues, why not get some mutant Notty/London ale mixture in the batch as well
I've been using Woodland's 1.5B cells/ml as a base point for calculating slurry amount. Going by this you'd only need about 250 ml in 5.5 gal, or 300 if you played safe and said 1B cells/ml. It works well for me, but I keep to 1.040-55 starting gravity. Maybe someone else can report on their experience pitching slurry into bigger beers.
...what was the gravity of the beer you harvest that slurry from, and how old was the slurry?
...what was the gravity of the beer you harvest that slurry from, and how old was the slurry?
I took the plunge and harvested my yeast. I won't be able to freeze it. I was wondering how long it will last at cold fridge temps.
christyle
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It's a 1.06 milk stout I harvested back in June or so. Either way, the hybrid mix of yeasts is chewing away now.
I recently used yeast cake I had kept in my fridge for 6 months. Made a starter, then stepped it up twice. It was slow at first, but became much faster with each step.
MannyEdwards
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So is it OK to have hop debris in the yeast slurry and pitch it?
christyle
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It's not the best, but not the end of the world. It will probably impart some flavor in lighter beers, how much, i'm not sure.
Mine had hops in it. Haven't tasted the result yet.... I'm guessing not that big of difference.
This is why I took to overbuilding my starters by 100B cells and saving it (Brulosopher Style). This way I never have to wash it, worry about how clean it is, or worry about it being stressed.
You're missing the entire point of this thread. Having hop and trub is not that of a big deal if your repitch the yeast within a few weeks. Another starter (assumed from your 100 billing cells) I'd not needed as in your scenario. This is a no frills easy method.
And no, hop sludge doesn't make a huge difference from my experience
No, I get the point of the thread. I'm lucky if I get to brew once a month. So I was just pointing out that if he is concerned with it, there are alternate methods. It doesn't get much easier than splitting your starter in half before pitching.
hi all, I took my slurry from my attempt at Ed Wort's Bee Cave Brewery Hefe, and I put it into 250ml jars...when the first post says "pint" jars, he meant 500ml jars right? did I mess up? or would just using two jars to make a starter or pitch into another batch work?
thanks for the help...this was my first attempt at yeast reusing
thanks for the help...this was my first attempt at yeast reusing
christyle
Well-Known Member
There's a lot of people in here discussing proper pitch rates, and that's great and all, but if you were to re-use that yeast in the next few weeks and direct pitched, it would probably be fine. If it's longer, a starter would help it take off quicker.
hi all, I took my slurry from my attempt at Ed Wort's Bee Cave Brewery Hefe, and I put it into 250ml jars...when the first post says "pint" jars, he meant 500ml jars right? did I mess up? or would just using two jars to make a starter or pitch into another batch work?
thanks for the help...this was my first attempt at yeast reusing
You're fine with the smaller 250ml (half pint) jars. Guessing you'll have maybe 150ish ml of yeast in each, which is enough for direct repitching in many cases. If you end up brewing a bigger beer or storing it for a long time, just use multiple jars or one jar with a starter if you prefer.
thank you both for your help and info...I am very excited to be saving a bit of money. liquid yeast is a bit costly up here in Canada, if I can get two-four brews from one vial...I am a happy happy camper!
christyle
Well-Known Member
thank you both for your help and info...I am very excited to be saving a bit of money. liquid yeast is a bit costly up here in Canada, if I can get two-four brews from one vial...I am a happy happy camper!
If you get another jar or two, you could get 3-4 uses out of 1 vial, and that's just the first generation, it can multiply every time. I haven't bought liquid yeast in awhile now...
yeah, that's what I am hoping for...and there is no shortage of jars from the buy & sell sites....I was just too lazy to type all that last night.
:rockin:
liquid yeast is a bit costly up here in Canada, if I can get two-four brews from one vial...I am a happy happy camper!
I hear you on that. I pay $11 for a Wyeast pack from the LHBS and $6 for dry yeast like US05.
Note to self, start yeast smuggling to Canada :rockin:
fo show!!!
I pay more, as I live in a small small town, and the shipping is double the price of dry yeast most times...and no lhbs...although, I love OBK Patrick saves me money all the time
fo show!!!
I pay more, as I live in a small small town, and the shipping is double the price of dry yeast most times...and no lhbs...although, I love OBK Patrick saves me money all the time
OBK prices are great. I get nailed on shipping from Ontario to Alberta though. Wish there was a comparable online supplier out west. Hmmm, might be a good opportunity there for someone...
HomeDrewBrew
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Am I doing this correct? I have the following mason jar of slurry. I use the dump everything to the fermenter approach but use hop bags during the boil. View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1442159825.768381.jpg
I'm guessing this is half a jar of slurry so approximately 237.5 ml. If I assume 1.25B/ml I get just under 300B cells.
Using mr Maltys calculation and my predicted OG of 1.07 (batch size of 5.25G) I think I'd use (0.75 million cells/ml of wort)X(20,000ml of wort)X(17.5 degrees Plato) = 262,500B cells or 215ml of slurry. Now I've had this slurry stored for 2 months so I have to assume 17%/month loss of viability so multiply 262,500 X 34% = 351,750B cells or 280ml of slurry.
Does that all seem correct?
Thanks.
I'm guessing this is half a jar of slurry so approximately 237.5 ml. If I assume 1.25B/ml I get just under 300B cells.
Using mr Maltys calculation and my predicted OG of 1.07 (batch size of 5.25G) I think I'd use (0.75 million cells/ml of wort)X(20,000ml of wort)X(17.5 degrees Plato) = 262,500B cells or 215ml of slurry. Now I've had this slurry stored for 2 months so I have to assume 17%/month loss of viability so multiply 262,500 X 34% = 351,750B cells or 280ml of slurry.
Does that all seem correct?
Thanks.
You're in the ballpark there with a slight underpitch, by my rough estimates. If you're in a rush you could go ahead and pitch (you'll be fine), or if you have a day or so make a small starter to refresh the yeast and build a few more cells. I'd be inclined to do the starter in this case, only because you're working with both an underpitch and older yeast. If you do go ahead and just direct pitch, there might be 1 to 2 day lag.
I wouldn't bother stealing from that 2nd jar.
WoodlandBrew (OP) has a blog that you should check out.
Some points from his research:
1) 1.5billion cells per mL is a safe bet for most clean slurry.
2) The decrease in viability is not as significant as once thought, so 17% may be incorrect.
3) A 50% underpitch would most likely have no negative effects.
Worth taking a look at what he has researched and found for sure.
brewfarmDan
Well-Known Member
I have gotten my yeast harvesting proceedure down and thought I would share. I make 10 gallon batches in a SS Conical. 12 to 24 hours after pitch I dump trub thru the bottom valve. 7 to 10 days after pitch I boil 4 mason pint jars and 1 quart jar. My 2000ml flask won't fit in my microwave upright so I set it side ways in a bowl with about 600ml water and boil the water in the MW for several minutes. I cover/lid everything immediately with jars full of boiling water and let cool to room temp. I dump yeast/trub out the bottom valve till it looks like clean yeast, dump all but about 200ml preboiled water from the flask, then dump yeast till I see beer or the flask is full. Give the fask a good swirl then let rest till the trub settles, then dump most of the water from the quart and transfer leaving as much trub behind as possible. Then repeat transfering to the 4 pints about 1/4 full steps.
stever1000
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I haven't had a chance to click through all the pages but I'm a bit confused about using the slurry with a starter...
if i have 400ml of slurry with a bit of beer on top, how do I make a 1.5L starter? Do i add the slurry to 1100ml of starter wort or how do I compensate?
Thanks!
if i have 400ml of slurry with a bit of beer on top, how do I make a 1.5L starter? Do i add the slurry to 1100ml of starter wort or how do I compensate?
Thanks!
You have at least 400 billion cells there already(200B needed for a 5 gal 1.050 beer). Whats the gravity and volume of your beer?
Agreed.
And that is a conservative estimate
Depending on how clean the yeast is, you could have 1.5 to 2 times that number.
I would split that in half and just build a small starter if you are making normal beers.
Double post
stever1000
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The slurry has been in the fridge since february so I was thinking I could pitch more slurry to compensate for yeast that has died since then.
What size of starter should I use instead?
thanks!
What size of starter should I use instead?
thanks!
I've never stored slurry that long, but others on here have and just direct pitched it. Probably wise to do a starter though. As a wild ass guess maybe its 15-25% viable after 7 months. Could be way higher or lower. Couple suggestions: (1) you could just pitch all of it without a starter in the name of science and see what happens (then tell us), or (2) add some of it to a starter to proof it and build new cells. Perhaps pitch 200ml into a 1.5 L starter (i.e.: 1.5L water + 150g DME).
Exactly what I was thinking.
Woodland Brews blog suggests that viability decay is less than we once thought it to be. I cannot remember the exact number though.
So I concur with the same 2 options above.
I am inclined to lean towards the latter though.
Split it in half and treat each as though they were a single smack pack and then make a 1.5L starter.
(If you are making a normal 1.050-ish beer.)
If it works well then you have a second freebie.
If it does not work then you can still experiment and build the 2nd one up even larger next time.
The downside to pitching the whole 400mL in a single batch is that it may be an overpitch and then you possibly make a bad beer in addition to wasting a perfectly good second opportunity to pitch the 2nd half.
Just my thoughts
christyle
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To me, the downsides of overpitching are minimal and not to be afraid of. I would dump the whole deal into a 2L starter to see what happens, if viable, decant and pitch, then harvest the new, viable yeast for next time rather than continuing to save a partial jar of 7 month old yeast.
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