Simple Yeast Storage Procedure

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If I make a larger than needed yeast starter and want to save some of the yeast for a future batch. What is a good estimation for the yeast cell count/density for the yeast slurry (after decanting most of the liquid off)?
 
David_Trucks said:
It was 20 hours when I first posted (I said that) and about 27 hours when I decided to just pitch the yeast. My biggest concern was more that I had wort sitting there with a bigger likelihood of infection happening.
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christyle said:
My mistake, it sounded like you had just brewed and were expecting your starter to have activity in 2-3 hours. I usually give my starters at least 24, and even then it doesn't seem like there's much activity. My last one was about a month or two old sample and it seemed like there was nothing, pitched it and it took off in a couple hours in the wort. Sounds like yours is fine.
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I've actually seen this kind of thing before depending on the yeast and the size and gravity of the starter, I have put it on stir plate and it is done and crashed in under 24 hours.
 
tagz said:
1.5 B per ml
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Yup.. this is a fine starting estimate.
I would actually personally skew more towards 2B per mL only because there is no trub involved and the yeast is clean to start with.
Now if I use a slurry, I tend to stay at the 1.5 only because it is a safety net for me.
Woodland mentioned in his blog that a 50% over/under pitch would barely be noticeable anyway.
 
Any comments of adding .9% salt to make the storage medium isotonic?
(Most of this saline would be decanted before pitching so would not "salt" the wort)
 
Tegra said:
Any comments of adding .9% salt to make the storage medium isotonic?
(Most of this saline would be decanted before pitching so would not "salt" the wort)
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Biologically speaking, the process is spot on.
Normal saline (0.9% concentration) is used in the health care field simply for that reason. It matches the normal isotonic characteristics of the blood, so it hydrates without causing problems.
 
Could someone help. This is my first time attempting to save yeast for repitching and I'm not exactly sure what I have here. How much yeast am I looking at, and how much would I need of it for a 5 gal batch without a starter? these are qt containers i believe. According to Mrmalty i need about 80 ml, but i am not sure if the amount of yeast is sufficient by looking at it.

View attachment 1435525616394.jpg
 
1 quart = 946.353mL

I would estimate 600mL and 650mL of yeast slurry in those jars.

Between 1 and 1.5 billion yeast cells per mL

So 80mL of that slurry would yield 80-120 billion cells which is not enough to pitch in a normal gravity <1.055 ale.

80mL of that slurry WOULD make an excellent starter though.

Very clean looking slurry btw, great job!!:tank:
 
brewkinger said:
1 quart = 946.353mL



I would estimate 600mL and 650mL of yeast slurry in those jars.



Between 1 and 1.5 billion yeast cells per mL



So 80mL of that slurry would yield 80-120 billion cells which is not enough to pitch in a normal gravity <1.055 ale.



80mL of that slurry WOULD make an excellent starter though.



Very clean looking slurry btw, great job!!:tank:
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Brewkinger? I have the same issue as him on a regular basis. Let's say I don't get around to making the slurry and just want to pitch what I have on hand from my last batch (usually about a week or two old), which is very similar looking to that. I also use the mr.malty app and it usually calls for around a quarter cup of slurry.

My question is, can I just stick a (sanitized of course) 1/4 cup ladle down into my jar (I use wide mouth jars) and scoop it out and put it into my conical? Also, since that doesn't seem to be enough from what you and others say, would it hurt to double it? Triple it? I don't want to do too much, but don't get around to making starters sometimes as I just brew on a spur of the moments notice usually since I have two young boys running around.
 
brewkinger said:
1 quart = 946.353mL

I would estimate 600mL and 650mL of yeast slurry in those jars.

Between 1 and 1.5 billion yeast cells per mL

So 80mL of that slurry would yield 80-120 billion cells which is not enough to pitch in a normal gravity <1.055 ale.

80mL of that slurry WOULD make an excellent starter though.

Very clean looking slurry btw, great job!!:tank:
Click to expand...

Thanks. it came off of a saison i just bottled. saisonsteins monster was the yeast. it went from OG 1.052 to FG 1.004 in less than i week. I figured it deserved a reuse.
I plugged the figures into mrmalty again, this time with a 1.3b per ml count with a 10% non yeast and i get 205 ml (7 ounces) for a 1.060 og.

I appreciate the reply.
 
Artifishal said:
I also use the mr.malty app and it usually calls for around a quarter cup of slurry.

My question is, can I just stick a (sanitized of course) 1/4 cup ladle down into my jar (I use wide mouth jars) and scoop it out and put it into my conical? Also, since that doesn't seem to be enough from what you and others say, would it hurt to double it? Triple it? I don't want to do too much, but don't get around to making starters sometimes as I just brew on a spur of the moments notice usually since I have two young boys running around.
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Short answer: Yes
When I harvest, I usually split a quart jar into 2 pint jars for storage.
By my calculations, I usually get 250 to 300mL in each pint. These become pitchable amounts for individual batches of most 1060ish beers that I make.
Not having to dip a sanitized object into my yeast is safer to me and I have not had bad results yet.


jaydlaw said:
I plugged the figures into mrmalty again, this time with a 1.3b per ml count with a 10% non yeast and i get 205 ml (7 ounces) for a 1.060 og.

I appreciate the reply.
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Just like above, my pitchable amount of 200 to 300mL in a pint jar is my go to amount of slurry repitch. Those numbers sound good to me.
 
jaydlaw said:
Thanks. it came off of a saison i just bottled. saisonsteins monster was the yeast. it went from OG 1.052 to FG 1.004 in less than i week. I figured it deserved a reuse.
I plugged the figures into mrmalty again, this time with a 1.3b per ml count with a 10% non yeast and i get 205 ml (7 ounces) for a 1.060 og.

I appreciate the reply.
Click to expand...

Off topic, but I'd love to hear how that saisonstein yeast works out.
 
tgmartin000 said:
Off topic, but I'd love to hear how that saisonstein yeast works out.
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So far so good. As I mentioned, the attenuation was incredible 1.052 to 1.004 is appx 92%. It is also clean in terms of beer clarity and it was easy to clean up afterward. Activity didn't appear to be all that rigorous and I seen dry yeast produce alot more krausen but the numbers don't lie. I plan on repitching sometime this week.
 
So if i am making a starter with these mason jars, how much do i use for a 2 liter starter? Do i pour off the beer on the top and just use the slurry or use all of it and add my DME?
 
So I've done this method twice now to great success. Just reused a 1/3 pint or so of WLP001 on a new IPA. Yeast had been in the fridge for a few weeks and still had krausen pop up overnight.

I have a pint of Brett that's a couple months old already, and I won't be brewing more of it for awhile. Is it worth just leaving it in the fridge and doing a good starter for it when using, or should I maybe step it up now to make sure it doesn't die?
 
shortyz said:
So if i am making a starter with these mason jars, how much do i use for a 2 liter starter? Do i pour off the beer on the top and just use the slurry or use all of it and add my DME?
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How old is the yeast in the jars? Was it stored in the fridge all the time?

If less than 2 months old, stored in the fridge, you wouldn't even have to make a starter, you can pitch straight from the jar after decanting the beer on top. Or if there's a lot of slurry, scoop some out. How much to use in a 5 gallon batch? About 100-200ml of that slurry, depending on how much trub is mixed in. 100ml if pure yeast, 200ml if 50/50 yeast/trub mixture. See Mr. Malty--pitching from slurry--tab.
 
IslandLizard said:
How old is the yeast in the jars? Was it stored in the fridge all the time?



If less than 2 months old, stored in the fridge, you wouldn't even have to make a starter, you can pitch straight from the jar after decanting the beer on top. Or if there's a lot of slurry, scoop some out. How much to use in a 5 gallon batch? About 100-200ml of that slurry, depending on how much trub is mixed in. 100ml if pure yeast, 200ml if 50/50 yeast/trub mixture. See Mr. Malty--pitching from slurry--tab.
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I just used slurry that was 4 months old. No starter. Took off after only a couple hours and went crazy overnight. Very surprised and pleased with these results.
 
I've been using this approach for a couple years now but until recently I've always tried to reuse the slurry within 1 week or so. A few weeks ago I pitched two pint jars of Wyeast 2308 Munich Lager that was about a month old and it took right off. It actually did better than the original pitch built up from a 2L starter. I should not that my repitches beyond the 3rd or 4th generation have been doing much better since I've started using yeast nutrient, for whatever that's worth.

I'm still a little chicken to push much further than a month or so, but it's nice to hear others having success going longer.

I can't imagine ever going back to the old yeast washing/rinsing method. Kind of like the thought of doing a secondary again. Barf.
 
David_Trucks said:
I just used slurry that was 4 months old. No starter. Took off after only a couple hours and went crazy overnight. Very surprised and pleased with these results.
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rhys333 said:
^ I think this is worthy of note. Using procedure outlined in this article, starters really aren't needed.
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Sure, no problem pitching cold stored yeast that's older, as long as you compensate your pitch's volume for the yeast's age. Mr. Malty is very helpful for your estimates. Even if you'd overpitch at 200% you'll still get good beer. Push it to 400% overpitch and your beer may start to suffer lacking body and flavor.

Now estimating accurate pitching and (slight) underpitching to increase a yeast's character without hampering your beer is more of an art form.
 
I'm Currently reading "Yeast" and obviously it stresses the importance of yeast health/pitching rates. So I was surprised that I pitched about 450 ml of harvested, unwashed yeast, about 2 months old, and I did a 18 hr, extremely small and over saturated starter, and it hit FG 1.007 in 2.5 days!
 
Hello everyone,

I would really appreciate advice/help because i just do not know what or if i am doing anything wrong.

This is how my "yeast" looks after 3 weeks.

IMG_1944.jpg


I have 4 jars like this one and it is same situation everywhere. Can i use this or should i dump it?

Thanks in advance!

Cheers,
Minja
 
rinasek said:
Hello everyone,

I would really appreciate advice/help because i just do not know what or if i am doing anything wrong.

This is how my "yeast" looks after 3 weeks.

I have 4 jars like this one and it is same situation everywhere. Can i use this or should i dump it?

Thanks in advance!

Cheers,
Minja
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I would not pitch THAT into my beer :drunk:
 
I presumed that, just wanted to check... Not sure what happened, beer will be awesome (at least was after two weeks in bottles).
 
Sorry if this has already been visited on this thread and/or another...

When attempting to harvest from a 5 gallon batch, it seems 1 cup of slurry is ideal. Will all the hops thrown in during the process (of 1st batch of beer) affect the next batch from the reused yeast? More or less questioning the flavors for the 2nd batch with the reused yeast.

It seems if you want the "cleanest" reused yeast, you would want to originally make a large enough starter for your 1st 5 gallon batch, and then save some of the yeast cake (1cup of slurry) to make the 2nd generation of yeast... am I thinking clearly on this?

I do apologize, jetlag to Italy is taking its toll.
 
wmubronco said:
Sorry if this has already been visited on this thread and/or another...

When attempting to harvest from a 5 gallon batch, it seems 1 cup of slurry is ideal. Will all the hops thrown in during the process (of 1st batch of beer) affect the next batch from the reused yeast? More or less questioning the flavors for the 2nd batch with the reused yeast.

It seems if you want the "cleanest" reused yeast, you would want to originally make a large enough starter for your 1st 5 gallon batch, and then save some of the yeast cake (1cup of slurry) to make the 2nd generation of yeast... am I thinking clearly on this?

I do apologize, jetlag to Italy is taking its toll.
Click to expand...

Pretty sure I just answered my own concern by looking at first page and a member posted about a "real hoppy" beer slurry. Didn't read much after that since I feel the "read the posts" comments coming.
 
wmubronco said:
Sorry if this has already been visited on this thread and/or another...

When attempting to harvest from a 5 gallon batch, it seems 1 cup of slurry is ideal. Will all the hops thrown in during the process (of 1st batch of beer) affect the next batch from the reused yeast? More or less questioning the flavors for the 2nd batch with the reused yeast.

It seems if you want the "cleanest" reused yeast, you would want to originally make a large enough starter for your 1st 5 gallon batch, and then save some of the yeast cake (1cup of slurry) to make the 2nd generation of yeast... am I thinking clearly on this?

I do apologize, jetlag to Italy is taking its toll.
Click to expand...

Yes, old hops will give some flavor to the beer, unsure how much.

Many people over build a starter it seems, to harvest good, clean yeast.
 
rinasek said:
Not sour and no pressure. I will dump this and try again...
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Something i like to do to prevent in-storage contamination is boil the glass jars for 15 minutes, then seal em up (with the water) and leave to cool. You can of course just santize instead, but the boil method ensures the jars are absolutely sterile for your yeast. I like that i can get them ready hours or days ahead if i want to.
 
I second boiling the jars and lids. I let mine cool while open and used sanitizer though. Not much just sprayed it in and around.
 
Boiling them right now and gonna leave them to sit until Thursday.

I hope it works this time.
 
I just harvested for the first time and wanted to confirm what I have read in this thread. I have 700ml of 2206 split into two mason jars and stored at about 38F. Since I dumped everything into the fermenter, I would assume 1B of yeast per ml of slurry. If I were to make another 1.052 lager today, I would be safe pitching 450ml of that slurry with no starter. If I wait two months to use this yeast again, do I account for viability as outlined in the first post or just go ahead and pitch the same amount of slurry that I would today? I guess the safe answer is deduct about 20% viability each month, estimate # of viable cells, do a yeast starter. However, if i will have enough slurry to pitch and by pass a starter, I would be all for it.

Thanks
 
oujens said:
I just harvested for the first time and wanted to confirm what I have read in this thread. I have 700ml of 2206 split into two mason jars and stored at about 38F. Since I dumped everything into the fermenter, I would assume 1B of yeast per ml of slurry. If I were to make another 1.052 lager today, I would be safe pitching 450ml of that slurry with no starter. If I wait two months to use this yeast again, do I account for viability as outlined in the first post or just go ahead and pitch the same amount of slurry that I would today? I guess the safe answer is deduct about 20% viability each month, estimate # of viable cells, do a yeast starter. However, if i will have enough slurry to pitch and by pass a starter, I would be all for it.

Thanks
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I am not able to calculate the amount of slurry needed at the moment but I can later if you need me to.

In his blog (and somewhere in this thread) Woodland references not paying much attention to the decrease in viability as a serious thing.

The 1B per mL is a SAFE estimate but it all depends on how clean the yeast is and what type of brew (AG, extract, etc... ) that it came from.
If there is a lot of hop and protein debris then the # can be that low.

I safely estimate 1.5B as a conservative estimate for my process, but that is just me.
 
brewkinger said:
I am not able to calculate the amount of slurry needed at the moment but I can later if you need me to.



In his blog (and somewhere in this thread) Woodland references not paying much attention to the decrease in viability as a serious thing.



The 1B per mL is a SAFE estimate but it all depends on how clean the yeast is and what type of brew (AG, extract, etc... ) that it came from.

If there is a lot of hop and protein debris then the # can be that low.



I safely estimate 1.5B as a conservative estimate for my process, but that is just me.
Click to expand...


Thanks for the response. I guess my concern is more around viability. Mr. Malty shows the viability dropping off quick. Others suggest it doesn't happen that quick. The formula provided in this thread I believe would say I have 67% viable yeast at two months. I guess I would like to know what the consensus is on viability. My thought is since I have a sanitized environment at 38F where the yeast is stored, I should assume my viability should not drop that quick, but perhaps I do not understand yeast that well.
 

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