Sanitizing help! Is this process ok?

[ToddPacker69]

Part 1: So I am going to bottle tomorrow night! I have 50 dirty bottles. If I am run them in my dish washer, on the sanitize setting (its a nice dishwasher) , and then tomorrow buy some starsan or iodine and use that to sanitize right before I bottle. Does this sound good? Do I need to let the bottles dry or can I go right ahead and bottle? What about sanitizzing the bottling bucket? Won't that take a lot of starsan or iodine?

Part 2: What about caps? I heard boiling can ruin them. Will starsan be enough?

Part 3: Should I just boil priming sugar?

LAST PART: What temperature should I keep these bottles at and for how long? It is a california common brew buy the way, steam beer.

 

[Doom5oh]

Dishwashers won't get up past the neck of the bottles..it'll help them look pretty but don't count on results. Let them all soak for a short while in some oxyclean or mild odor free detergent. Use a bottle brush on them and rinse THOROUGHLY.

As for sanitation, I hope your using a vinator that will keep ur caps sterile and will force sanitizer up your bottles before bottling.

Good luck

 

[JonK331]

1. If the bottles are very dirty with sticky beer and dried crap on the bottom I'm not sure the dishwasher would be enough. I've never tried it because I wouldn't trust that the dishwasher could reach the inside of the bottles. The best thing to do would be to soak them in PBW or scent free Oxyclean with hot water overnight. Then rinse them and sanitize in starsan.

You don't have to completely fill the bottling bucket. take apart the plastic valve and soak that along with your bottling wand separately. For the bucket itself, just make sure it is clean and then swish star san around in it, or you can soak a paper towel in star san and just light rub all surface areas that will touch the beer. I'd do this a couple times to be safe.

It is okay if the bottles are a bit damp. If you continue to bottle and brew, a bottle tree is very helpful.

2. Starsan will work great for the bottle caps

3. Yes, boil the priming sugar and let cool a bit. Then pour it into the bottom of the empty bottling bucket and rack the beer on top. Stir very gently to ensure that it gets mixed in but do not introduce air.

 

[duboman]

You can take the bottles and soak them in a bucket or sink of hot water and oxy and go at them with a bottle brush.

Then, if you want you can place them in the dishwasher and use the Sani-cycle and you're done. The high heat on that cycle will kill anything. Be aware that cycle may run for 2+ hours

Or as mentioned you can then soak the bottles in star San mixture, drain and bottle

In the future make sure you give each bottle a good rinse as you use them and the future cleaning process will be much easier

 

[amandabab]

if the bottles are dirty, scrub them with a brush. the dishwasher won't do it.

 

[ACbrewer]

Part 1: So I am going to bottle tomorrow night! I have 50 dirty bottles. If I am run them in my dish washer, on the sanitize setting (its a nice dishwasher) , and then tomorrow buy some starsan or iodine and use that to sanitize right before I bottle. Does this sound good? Do I need to let the bottles dry or can I go right ahead and bottle? What about sanitizzing the bottling bucket? Won't that take a lot of starsan or iodine?.

are they 'dirty' or unsanitary? Dishwashers are great, but if there is crud in the bottles, I'd get a home depot bucket and soak the bottles in some water witha bit of oxyclean and then rinse + possible bottle brush. Other wise, dishwasher and StarSan or Iodophor (collectivly NoRinse -NR) is great. Although the Dishwasher might be overkill as the inside of the bottles might not get reached.

Just put some NR in the bottle make sure it all gets around (a good shake) and pour that into the next bottle - you can reuse the NR's for quite a while.

You don't need to let the bottles dry (although with Iodophor it is recommended, I just ignore them and assume I could use some iodine any how given how little is in the drops).

to do my bucket, I use a spray bottle filled with NR that I spray all over the sides. Optionally you can make your solution - usually about 1 gallon, esp if you have a container to put the gallon of sanatizer in when you are done. With the gallon in the bucket, put a lid on and shake it about like you would a bottle, caution it will leak at the lid.

Part 2: What about caps? I heard boiling can ruin them. Will starsan be enough?.

Use a NR on them. I get a bowl, put some Iodophor solution (my NR) and put the caps in them.

Part 3: Should I just boil priming sugar?

LAST PART: What temperature should I keep these bottles at and for how long? It is a california common brew by the way, steam beer.

Boil the sugar with about 2 cups of water - helps it disolve better. Let it cool and put it into the bottling bucket - generally the bottom, but I've put it in the middle or top if I got forgetful.

Usually carb the bottles at about 70F for 3 weeks before opening and expecting proper carb levels. I've gotten away with some as early as 1 week, but nobody here wants to hear you ask 'why isn't this carbed' until 3 weeks have passed at at around 70F.

NR's can be kept for atleast 1 month if stored propperly meaning sealed container and preferably in a dark space. Iodophor you check the color (amber) to keep using and StarSan should be checked for ph level, but someone here who has used it will probably tell you exactly how to check without ph strips. Some have save one or the other for many months, so a large bottle of concentrate should easily last years since you can keep reusing what is made up.

 

[ToddPacker69]

I am going to use star san, and I am trying not to use anything with too many chemicals, like oxyclean or bleach. So staying on the more natural or organic side, with starsan being ok, and also iodine, what should be my sanitation process?

I was going to go dishwasher, then use starsan. But if the dishwasher wont reach the neck, should I rinse with soapy water? Then Starsan?

What about letting them dry?



(If your going to just suggest some toxic like bleach or something with a bunch of chemicals, just don't comment. I am trying to go for a more natural beer, I don't need to be preached on chemicals. I DO know that the sanitation process is HUGE in brewing, So I want to make the best decision, without using anything to toxic. Thats why I hear starsan is good. Just not sure if I should do something before starsan...)

What about my bucket?

 

[al0311]

I have star san can't I just fill me 1st fermentor bucket with water and put some star san in and soak the bottles over night and scrub them in the morning or evening after work? or do you guys recommend using oxy clean and how much ?
also with the star san how do you measure ph level?

 

[duboman]

You can use the dishwasher as I sated above but you need to clean the bottles first., also as I mentioned, this would be the most natural as you are not introducing any chemicals

Star San is a no rinse food safe sanitizer and only requires a minute of contact and just drip dry.

Yes the bucket, siphon, tubing and spigot need to be sanitized as well along with filler and caps- do not boil caps, just soak in star San

 

[wowbeeryum]

I have no idea if this is good, but here has been the process I've used.

Sometime prior to bottle day, from a few weeks to the day before, I soak all my bottles in the bath tub filled with hot water and oxyclean free. Make sure to hold the bottles semi upright underneath the water to get them completely filled with the cleaning solution. After a few hours I drain the water, pull all the labels out of the tub (they will easily separate from the bottles after a few hours of soaking, it doesn't take all day or night), then rinse out each bottle, letting them air dry on the floor of the bathroom for a while. After rinsing the bottles are put away until bottling day.

On bottling day I measure out my priming sugar and get that boiling. Then I put 1/2 oz of StarSan in my bottling bucket and fill with about 2.5 gallons with warm water. With the foaming action of StarSan this coats the entire bucket. I place the auto-siphon, tubing, and bottle filler briefly in bottling bucket to get them covered in StarSan. Then I siphon about half of the StarSan from the bucket into my clean sink with the the drain plug in. Next, I let the remaining StarSan drain out the spigot of the bucket into the sink. This gives you 2.5 G of StarSan in the sink. I keep the bottle filler in the sink of StarSan, making sure to get it inside the filler, until I'm ready to bottle. I take small bowl and scoop some of the StarSan from the sink and dump my caps in the bowl. I just grab the caps out of the bowl as I bottle.

Add the priming sugar water to the bottling bucket, then siphon the beer into the bucket. Place bottles in the sink of StarSan, usually in batches of 12, making sure each fills 1/4 to 1/2 of the way. Pull out one by one or in groups of two, shake solution inside, pour out, fill bottle wet. Cap. Repeat. I keep a spray bottle of StarSan around as well.

 

[kh54s10]

Drink a craft brew. Rinse the bottle and soak overnight in Oxyclean to remove the labels.

Reusing the bottles.

Drink the homebrew.
Rinse the bottle thoroughly, and store somewhere clean until bottling day.
Optionally: run the bottles through the sanitize cycle of your dishwasher.
And/or rinse the bottles with Starsan. DO NOT let the Starsan dry.
Put some caps in Starsan.
Boil your priming sugar solution and let it cool some.
Add the priming solution to the bottom of your bottling bucket and siphon in the beer making a whirlpool. This will mix the solution.
I usually give a bit of an extra stir because I have gotten uneven carbonation.
Fill the bottles and cap them.

Store at 70 degrees for at least 2 preferably 3 weeks then cool one and give it a try. If it is not fully carbed wait another week and try again. A high gravity beer may take months to fully carb.

 

[ResumeMan]

If your bottles are dirty, StarSan won't do any good. And as has been stated before, the dishwasher won't do it. And the cleaning process is just as important in brewing as the sanitizing process.

You will need to use some sort of cleanser (and StarSan is not a cleanser) to get the crud out of the bottles. You could use a soap or a detergent if you really want to, but make sure you rinse them VERY thoroughly or your beer will taste like soap.

Note that Oxyclean is really no more "chemically" than detergent. IIRC it's just sodium percarbonate (basically an oxygen-containing salt) and baking soda. Use what you want, obviously but it's pretty innocuous stuff. I wouldn't be surprised if it's less harsh on the environment or the body than regular dish detergent.

So I would recommend your process to be:

1. Soak the bottles in a cleanser solution. As I noted above, Oxi is my suggestion but another cleanser would do.

2. Rinse the bottles out thoroughly. It doesn't matter if you let them dry after this or not.

3. Either soak or just rinse out the bottles with StarSan. Dump it all out but don't let it dry, leave the insides wet and foamy.

4. Plop the caps into some StarSan.

5. Boil the priming sugar and dump it into the beer.

You will also need to make sure the bucket, siphon, and anything else to touch the beer is clean and has been sanitized before you start. You could just wash it out with the same stuff you use for the bottles, then wet it with StarSan.

Good luck with the bottling.

 

[Proboscidea]

OxiClean is non-toxic. It's sodium percarbonate, which is used in many eco-friendly cleaners.

 

[kh54s10]

I have no idea if this is good, but here has been the process I've used.

Sometime prior to bottle day, from a few weeks to the day before, I soak all my bottles in the bath tub filled with hot water and oxyclean free.

EEEuuuuWWWWWWW!!!

Use clean buckets. I can't imagine the bath tub being clean enough that I would want to drink anything that was soaked in there!

 

[JonK331]

Dude, you asked for our help, there's no need to get angry when we make suggestions that are common practice. No one said to use bleach. Both Star San and PBW are specifically formulated for brewing and are biodegradable. Iodine is not, and is not good to pour down the sink. If you want to be more environmentally friendly, don't use iodine at all. The reason the combination of PBW and Star San are so great is that they don't leave any chemical residues in your beer. They are made by the same company and are meant to be used together (one at a time of course, do not mix http://www.fivestarchemicals.com/breweries/homebrewing/products/). I was a bit afraid of the chemicals at first too but after further research I am very comfortable with them now. Make sure you use them in the proper dilutions though, that is the key in keeping them safe, don't ever eyeball the quantities. Here are some podcasts that will help you:

http://thebrewingnetwork.com/shows/Brew-Strong/Brew-Strong-11-10-08-Cleaning
http://thebrewingnetwork.com/shows/469

 

[wowbeeryum]

EEEuuuuWWWWWWW!!!

Use clean buckets. I can't imagine the bath tub being clean enough that I would want to drink anything that was soaked in there!

What makes a bath tub filled with soap different than a bucket filled with soap different from a washing machine filled with soap?

 

[DHUKILL]

I am going to use star san, and I am trying not to use anything with too many chemicals, like oxyclean or bleach. So staying on the more natural or organic side, with starsan being ok, and also iodine, what should be my sanitation process?

I was going to go dishwasher, then use starsan. But if the dishwasher wont reach the neck, should I rinse with soapy water? Then Starsan?

What about letting them dry?

(If your going to just suggest some toxic like bleach or something with a bunch of chemicals, just don't comment. I am trying to go for a more natural beer, I don't need to be preached on chemicals. I DO know that the sanitation process is HUGE in brewing, So I want to make the best decision, without using anything to toxic. Thats why I hear starsan is good. Just not sure if I should do something before starsan...)

What about my bucket?

There are two processes, cleaning and sanitizing.

Dishwashers are only for sanitizing.
Cleaning? How "dirty"are the bottles? Only you know that. If they are "dirty" then soak with a unscented dw soap and or use a bottle brush on a cordless drill to clean them. Rinse well because soap can deter good head retention in your beer.

Put Star San in a spray bottle and spray each bottle 4-5 times while rotating to get good coverage. Caps can go in a small Tupperware dish before bottling.
Bucket- spray the inside thoroughly with Star San and then pour a couple of quarts in the bucket and Run some through the hose and bottling wand. you can recycle the Star San when done.

Tip: I mix up Star San 3-4 gallons at a time and keep in gallon water bottles.

 

[ToddPacker69]

ok so my bottles aren't that dirty. I drank them then gave a little rinse and then put away. But that was months ago. I don't want to use an oxiclean or detergent, both are gross. Starsan is even an push for me but I will take it.

I read over all comments, and this seems to be the best process


1. Rinse in dishwasher on sanitize OR leave in tub of cleanser over night.

2. Is it ok if I clean tonight, and then sanitize in two days right before I bottle? I want to clean tonight but not bottling till Friday.

3. Buy starsan or iodine and use that right before I mix priming sugar in bottling bucket. I am going to go with star san I think.

Any problems with this?

 

[wowbeeryum]

Sanitize (bottles, bucket, caps, and tools) just prior to using, not hours or days before.

 

[quick5pnt0]

What makes a bath tub filled with soap different than a bucket filled with soap different from a washing machine filled with soap?

You don't scrub your dead skin and hair off in a bottling bucket. There is a reason why you are required to wear flip flops in gym showers.

 

[kh54s10]

What makes a bath tub filled with soap different than a bucket filled with soap different from a washing machine filled with soap?

I don't put nasty things like dirty human bodies in my buckets!
I don't drink out of anything that was in my washing machine either.

 

[wowbeeryum]

You don't scrub your dead skin and hair off in a bottling bucket. There is a reason why you are required to wear flip flops in gym showers.

While I understand what you are saying, I don't buy that using the tub makes the bottles come out less clean. You are basically saying the soap doesn't provide cleaning power (because if it does then it also cleans the tub). You are using soap then rinsing. It's glass bottles. Maybe if you weren't rinsing, but that isn't the case. And obviously I'm not going into this with a horribly dirty tub either.

 

[wowbeeryum]

I don't put nasty things like dirty human bodies in my buckets!
I don't drink out of anything that was in my washing machine either.

Do your dirty clothes continually come out of the washer clean? Or is it too dirty to use after a single use?

 

[CidCitrus]

if my bottles are clean to the eye i just give them a good rinse with a jet bottle washer and hot water, then sanitize. A vinator is really helpful, saves time and sanitizer. Thanks to Revvy's bottling tips thread I've gotten my bottling time down to an hour or so, you might want to check it out.

 

[JonK331]

ok so my bottles aren't that dirty. I drank them then gave a little rinse and then put away. But that was months ago. I don't want to use an oxiclean or detergent, both are gross. Starsan is even an push for me but I will take it.

I read over all comments, and this seems to be the best process


1. Rinse in dishwasher on sanitize OR leave in tub of cleanser over night.

2. Is it ok if I clean tonight, and then sanitize in two days right before I bottle? I want to clean tonight but not bottling till Friday.

3. Buy starsan or iodine and use that right before I mix priming sugar in bottling bucket. I am going to go with star san I think.

Any problems with this?

Sorry dude but saying oxyclean/PBW is gross is just pure ignorance. Iodine is worse than either one. I'm done with this thread. For some reason your ignorance pisses me off.

 

[duboman]

Wow, this thread really degenerated quickly, good luck with your bottling adventure, hope you actually get to enjoy your first beer.....

 

[Draken]

ok so my bottles aren't that dirty. I drank them then gave a little rinse and then put away. But that was months ago. I don't want to use an oxiclean or detergent, both are gross. Starsan is even an push for me but I will take it.

I read over all comments, and this seems to be the best process

1. Rinse in dishwasher on sanitize OR leave in tub of cleanser over night.

2. Is it ok if I clean tonight, and then sanitize in two days right before I bottle? I want to clean tonight but not bottling till Friday.

3. Buy starsan or iodine and use that right before I mix priming sugar in bottling bucket. I am going to go with star san I think.

Any problems with this?

No gross is having your beer explode in your bottling closet and send shards of glass into the walls, ceiling and whatever else is in there. It's what will happen if you do not properly clean and sanitize your bottles. An infected bottle is almost a guaranteed bottle bomb. So keep that in mind. So let's review
Dishwater on sanitize will not clean gunk or debris out of a bottle beyond the neck.
Any gunk or debris can hide bacteria and essentially protect it from Starsan or other sanitizers
Bacteria in your bottles = bottle bomb.

 

[ToddPacker69]

Ok ok I got it.

I will check for any gunk, if there isn't any, which I think there isn't, then I will rinse with hot water and then use starsan, and right after bottle?

In the mean time sanitize my equipment and bucket...

How does this sound?


But thanks for the tips guys. Let me know if theres anything I should change.

Dishwasher tonight (just because I can and might as well make it a little cleaner)
Friday when I bottle, rinse with hot water-
THen use Starsan THEN bottle right after when still wet.

 

[ToddPacker69]

And I don't drink any commercial beers bud. Only local, small breweries. Fresh, local ingredients, so you actually get something good out of your beer : )

We are all heading back to the primal days..

 

[Draken]

And I don't drink any commercial beers bud. Only local, small breweries. Fresh, local ingredients, so you actually get something good out of your beer : )

We are all heading back to the primal days..

Local ingredients doesn't mean crap, your still getting a bunch of empty carbs and maybe some vitamin b

 

[ToddPacker69]

local ingredients meaning more fresh ingredients... not mass produced..

trust me- the hops from the kit are no where near the quality of the hops that my neighbor grows, which are are organically grown. The more fresh, the better tasting in my opinion. And its usually the more local, the more fresh...

 

[Pie_Man]

Personally, I rinse and clean the bottles using a bottle brush to ensure that any soils are removed from the bottle. I'm probably overly cautious, but I don't want to screw things up after all my hard work. If you want to avoid chemicals, you can try cleaning with baking soda, or maybe even 7th generation dish soap. Most people might disagree, but if you rinse extremely well, it should be fine. Then, you can sanitize using the dishwasher and avoid the StarSan. It's not the process I use, but it should work and meet your goal.

FYI, the sanitize setting takes forever with my machine and works better if the incoming water is nice and hot. I usually turn up the temp on my hot water heater before using the sanitize setting. Good luck, let us know your end process and results.

 

[ToddPacker69]

Thanks Pie MAn!!

What about, dish soap with the bottle brush in all the bottles, then rinse well, then use starsan? Just because I won't have dishwasher when I am bottling, only now.

 

[Pie_Man]

Sounds like a plan.

 

[zachattack]

It looks like this has been beaten to death, but I wouldn't use dish soap, it's really hard to remove all the residue and most dish soaps are scented.

If you rinsed the bottles really well immediately after drinking, all you need to do is rinse them to remove any dust, dunk them in Star San, drain, and you're good to go. No need to soak or use a bottle brush. Just hold each bottle up to the light and look in it to make sure there's nothing inside but water, and give each one a good sniff. If you can smell any beer/yeast, you didn't rinse them out well enough and you'll want to bring out the bottle brush.

I fill my bottling bucket 1/2 full with Star San, dunk all the bottles, spray down the top (empty) rack of my dishwasher, and put the bottles there to drain while I prime and siphon the beer, etc.

 

[Pie_Man]

It looks like this has been beaten to death, but I wouldn't use dish soap, it's really hard to remove all the residue and most dish soaps are scented.

If you rinsed the bottles really well immediately after drinking, all you need to do is rinse them to remove any dust, dunk them in Star San, drain, and you're good to go. No need to soak or use a bottle brush. Just hold each bottle up to the light and look in it to make sure there's nothing inside but water, and give each one a good sniff. If you can smell any beer/yeast, you didn't rinse them out well enough and you'll want to bring out the bottle brush.

I fill my bottling bucket 1/2 full with Star San, dunk all the bottles, spray down the top (empty) rack of my dishwasher, and put the bottles there to drain while I prime and siphon the beer, etc.

Yeah, this is probably a better idea. Use the brush if needed and then re-starsan.

 

[ludomonster]

A jet bottle washer will blast away anything in a bottle. I don't use any cleaner when I use it. You can also use it to clean your carboys.

 

[ToddPacker69]

Thanks ZachAttack. I am going to rinse with hot water and use the bottle scrubber IF any of my bottles have residue or smell like beer/yeast.

After that, I will dunk in starsan, pour out, and then bottle right away. Any one have a problem with this just shout out.

And JonK, its ok. Relax.
________________________________________________________________________
yekcoh duts 1 of 10, bankleygreg, dogdaisy. Shout out!

 

[Bob]

But it's not "okay". You're being obdurate, disbelieving true information because you think something different. You are mistaken. You are refusing to acknowledge the correct answer to the question posed in your original post because you don't agree with it; since you're demonstrably wrong your stance is merely petulant.

I get your intent. Living fresh, locally, primally. I'm in the same place. I brew with organic ingredients whenever I can. I get my meats and eggs from locals, and participate in local CSA. It's a better, more sustainable lifestyle than the Big Store supply chain.

But JonK and I are pointing out - after YOU asked! - that you are NOT doing yourself or your beer any favors by skipping steps because you think it doesn't fit with your lifestyle or because you think it's "gross". If you persist in this line of activity you are setting yourself up for failure.

If I see a thread posted by you in a month whining about nasty or exploding bottles, I promise I will post only a picture of the kid from the Simpsons pointing and laughing.

In future, if you're going to ask a question, listen to the answers. If you must argue, at least argue from an informed position of some authority. Otherwise you're just going to piss people off. And that's not cool.

Cordially,

Bob

 

[atom]

i never realized cleaning/sanitizing a glass container was such a complicated idea...