I've edited the original post to break dry hop into it's own section to remove any confusion.
American Pale Ale Russian River Row 2 Hill 56 Clone
- Thread starter Jukas
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I've edited the original post to break dry hop into it's own section to remove any confusion.
I made this today and hit 1.057 OG. I gave it a 90 sec shot of O2 and a 1.5L starter of WL090 (because that's what I had). I'll use your recommended dry hop schedule in a secondary before crashing and kegging. Sample color was same as your picture. Can't wait! Thanks again for the help.
I made this last week and was bummed because I relied on Brewmasterswarehouse crush...normally I crush my own, but accidentally left the 'crush' option on my order. oh well...I won't do that again. My efficiency sucked. So I came up short on my OG and added 1.5lbs of light DME to get my OG to 1.053. I'm figuring that may mess up my FG, but we'll see. I pitched 1 packet of rehydrated US05 and did 30 seconds of pure O2 (even though I know you don't need to with dry yeast). Do you think the 1.5lbs of DME will mess this up? I know it will still be good beer, but the whole pilsners/MO balance?
I don't do much with extract, so assuming my napkin math is correct, you raised it 11 gravity points from 1.042 to 1.053? I think you may end up a bit darker on the SRM scale and the flavor profile will be a bit different but it will definitely still be beer and tasty beer at that.
GrowlerMonkey
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Do you use any phosphoric or lactic acid in the mash? I'm getting a pretty high PH on the bru'n water spreadsheet (around 5.6 at room temp) unless I add some acid. Just trying to get in the ballpark before I dump everything in, I know I can always adjust after the fact.
kosmokramer
Well-Known Member
I tried this in a flight with the younger and elder about six months ago and it was my favorite. Can't wait to give this recipe a try
I don't add any lactic acid or acid malt when I brew this. I have the same source water as Russian River, so the only additions I make are gypsum and campden tablets to deal with the chloramine.
It's one of my favorites too, and invariably what I order first when I'm at the brewpub.
Has anyone tried this exact recipe with Mosaic? I have a bunch of mosaic around and understand it is similar in some respects to Simcoe. Will probably brew it next week, but just wanted some feedback.
Xpertskir
Well-Known Member
Depending on your input water this recipe should not require any acid additions, there is a relatively high percentage of crystal to bring it down.
5.5-5.6 room temp PH is what I typically shoot for, as it will drop down to the 5.3-5.4 range at mash temps.
That is the only thing I dislike about that spreadsheet that 5.3-5.4 room temp PH is "green". Somewhat misleading IMO
Xpertskir
Well-Known Member
This malt bill has become my single hop maltbill. Its' simple, and really lets the hop shine through, but there is still some body and maltiness in the finish.
Im sure it would be great with mosaic.
So far Ive done it with Simcoe, Centennial, and Kohatu is dry hopping now.
I anticipate many more single hop versions of this as well.
Thanks for the legwork with this recipe OP.
mrcastellino
Well-Known Member
I brewed this recipe with each hop addition equally split between Simcoe and Mosaic. The beer turned out fantastic (i'll try and post a picture soon) which is saying a lot as the bar has been set so high for me when it comes to hop-forward beers. I'm relatively new to Mosaic but know Simcoe very well so even though it was not a single hop beer, it was a great way to see Mosaic's influence. The use of these two hops together seemed to have a synergistic effect. I was blown away by the aroma of this beer. Signature Simcoe nose but with an intense pink grapefruit aroma. Seriously the aroma has rivaled that of my IPAs which baffles me considering I only used the recipe's 2oz. of dry hop (typically use upwards of 3-4oz for IPAs). Mosaic seems to be a potent hop...im certainly a fan
I agree you would be hard pressed to find a better grain bill for a hop forward beer. I plan to continue to use this for both single and combination hop beers. The recipe is very similar to Vinnie's 'Hop - 2 It' grain bill which he used/uses for single hopped beers:
74% 2-Row
13% Maris Otter
10% Crystal 20L
3% Acidulated Malt
Cheers again to the OP for getting this recipe on the map!
Glad you like it. I too have started using this as my go to maltbill for a single hop beer.
I brewed this recipe with each hop addition equally split between Simcoe and Mosaic. The beer turned out fantastic (i'll try and post a picture soon) which is saying a lot as the bar has been set so high for me when it comes to hop-forward beers. I'm relatively new to Mosaic but know Simcoe very well so even though it was not a single hop beer, it was a great way to see Mosaic's influence. The use of these two hops together seemed to have a synergistic effect. I was blown away by the aroma of this beer. Signature Simcoe nose but with an intense pink grapefruit aroma. Seriously the aroma has rivaled that of my IPAs which baffles me considering I only used the recipe's 2oz. of dry hop (typically use upwards of 3-4oz for IPAs). Mosaic seems to be a potent hop...im certainly a fan
I agree you would be hard pressed to find a better grain bill for a hop forward beer. I plan to continue to use this for both single and combination hop beers. The recipe is very similar to Vinnie's 'Hop - 2 It' grain bill which he used/uses for single hopped beers:
74% 2-Row
13% Maris Otter
10% Crystal 20L
3% Acidulated Malt
Cheers again to the OP for getting this recipe on the map!
I have a lb of 2012 Mosaic that I was going to use for an IPA but never got around to. Maybe next time I brew this I'll split additions as well and see what I think. I'm such a fan of Simcoe though, it's a bit hard to convince myself to let another hop share the spotlight in this beer
Glad you like it!
GrowlerMonkey
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Couldn't be happier with the way this turned out! It was my first all grain batch and from what I can remember from the RH56 I had at the brewery several months ago, it is dead on! Awesome work Jukas (alright, and Vinnie) Nice citrus, pine, cat piss 
in the aroma and flavor. The Malt background is nice and clean/light, with the maris otter coming through just enough to know it's there. I love this beer!
The problem is, it also prompted me to pre order 12 lbs of this years hops to start my single hop series (education) as I loved the light malt bill so much. I ordered some mosaic, amarillo, Citra, falconers flight, Nelson Sauvin, Galaxy (and 2 lbs of Simcoe of course) to name a few. I plan to use either the R2H56 malt bill or the Hop2it one you mentioned above.
If you had to pick, would you prefer either of those malt bills over the other for single hop beers? I know it's all personal prefference so I will probably try both regardless, but what do you think the difference in flavor might be? I see the R2H56 uses a larger % of MO which I absolutely love. I guess I'm just wondering why vinnie chose the other for his hop2it series.
Anyway, thanks for sharing this Jukas. It's got me pretty fired up about brewing at the moment.
in the aroma and flavor. The Malt background is nice and clean/light, with the maris otter coming through just enough to know it's there. I love this beer!The problem is, it also prompted me to pre order 12 lbs of this years hops to start my single hop series (education) as I loved the light malt bill so much. I ordered some mosaic, amarillo, Citra, falconers flight, Nelson Sauvin, Galaxy (and 2 lbs of Simcoe of course) to name a few. I plan to use either the R2H56 malt bill or the Hop2it one you mentioned above.
If you had to pick, would you prefer either of those malt bills over the other for single hop beers? I know it's all personal prefference so I will probably try both regardless, but what do you think the difference in flavor might be? I see the R2H56 uses a larger % of MO which I absolutely love. I guess I'm just wondering why vinnie chose the other for his hop2it series.
Anyway, thanks for sharing this Jukas. It's got me pretty fired up about brewing at the moment.
crusader1612
Well-Known Member
After quaffing large quantities of Russian River R2H56 at the brewery I set out to make a homebrew clone. Vinnie Cilurzo was a huge help and is incredibly generous with information!
This is an awesome APA, bright yellow/gold in color with firm hop bitterness, white head and lacing and massive signature Simcoe aroma - Citrus, grapefruit, pine, resin and cat piss.
After 5 revisions, I've finally settled on what I believe is the closest clone I'm going to get. In side by side tastings
Batch Information:
Batch Size (fermenter): 6.00 gal
Bottling Volume: 5.50 gal
Estimated OG: 1.055 SG
Estimated Color: 5.1 SRM
Estimated IBU: 40.4 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %
Boil Time: 90 Minutes
Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
7 lbs 4.3 oz Pilsner (2 Row) Bel (1.5 SRM) Grain 1 60.5 %
3 lbs 14.4 oz Pale Malt, Maris Otter (2.5 SRM) Grain 2 32.4 %
13.6 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 20L (20.0 SRM) Grain 3 7.1 %
0.55 oz Simcoe [12.20 %] - Boil 90.0 min Hop 4 23.5 IBUs
0.55 oz Simcoe [12.20 %] - Boil 30.0 min Hop 5 16.9 IBUs
1.00 Items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 mins) Fining 6 -
1.0 oz Simcoe [12.20 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 7 0.0 IBUs
1.0 pkg California Ale (White Labs #WLP001) [35. Yeast 8 -
2.00 oz Simcoe [12.20 %] - Dry Hop 10.0 Days Hop 9 0.0 IBUs
Mash:
60 min at 154F
Fermentation:
10 days at 68F. I've hit FG in as little as 4 days, but seem to average 6. I like to do a gravity check at 7 days and again at 10 and assuming I'm at 1.010 on both I keg.
Dry Hop:
I dry hop in the keg and have tried dry hop additions between 1.25oz - 3oz. For my personal tastes 1.75 - 2oz is the sweet spot and seemed closest to the draft R2H56 when it was hitting it's stride. For scaling the batch size up or down, note that the dry hop ratio is 0.3 - 0.5oz per gallon.
If dry hopping in primary/secondary, I'd dry hop for no longer than 7-10 days. I personally would bump the amount of dry hops by 15% and cut it down to 5 days dry hopping to try and avoid the vegetal flavor you can get when doing longer dry hop at warmer temps.
Notes:
The above recipe is designed to exactly hit the numbers Russian River delivers and what I use in my batches.
This should finish at 2.5 Plato (1.010) so I tend to use a 1.25L (if using a fresh vial) starter to overpitch just slightly as I find if I pitch the appropriate # of cells or underpitch I tend to under attenuate and only get to about 1.012. I try and pitch approximately 240-250B cells, with required being 230B (figures taken from Yeastcalc). You can also mash slight lower if you are having problems reaching FG.
When scaling volumes base malts are split 70% Pils 30% MO. Crystal 20 should makeup 8% of less of total grain bill.
I keg to 2.3 - 2.5 vol and let the beer condition for 14 days at 40F before pouring my first pint.
Here's a pint I was enjoying today (1/19/13) from my sixth batch kegged on 12/23/12. It's coming up on four weeks and the keg is at least half gone
this sounds really tasty, might have to be my Summer Xmas brew...
mrcastellino
Well-Known Member
here is a pic of my brew as per this recipe:
Pilori
New Member
I can't get easily get Pilsner/2-row malt where I am in Ireland, do you think it would hurt to use all Maris Otter as the base malt?
I think it would be a totally different beer if you used 92% MO and 8% C20, at that point it would be a much more English style pale which stylistically pairs with noble hops. I think this would also be too highly hopped for a English style pale ale, as most of those are in the low - mid 30's IBU range.
Pilori
New Member
Is there a suitable substitute for 2-row in this beer then?
All of that said, if brewing to style isn't your primary goal, and merely brewing a delicious beer is, I'd say it'd be delicious. I started winning gold medals with my barleywine recipe last year when switched it up from 2-row to M.O. Now I use MO (though not exclusively) as a base grain for nearly all my ales.
How about pilsner extract, and just mash the MO and crystal?
brew2enjoy
Well-Known Member
Brewing this one now. First time using Pilsner malt.
brew2enjoy
Well-Known Member
Had a sample while I kegged today. My goodness! This is delicious!! Something tells me I'll be brewing a 10 gallon batch very soon.
Glad you liked the sample. I bet you'll like it even more once it's carbed and at serving temp
crusader1612
Well-Known Member
Brewed this up on the weekend but subbed the pils out for standard pale malt. And used carahell for crystal. I also had 1pz of mosaic so threw it in at 10 mins.
Tasted this over the weekend. Did the recipe in the original post but subbed with Mosaic. Pretty tasty beverage! Mosaic is rife with cat piss aroma, but not necessarily offensive. Mine has a hint more bitterness than R2H56, but definitely not terribly over the top.
Great beer! Will definitely use this recipe again as my single hop recipe.
HopheadNJ
Well-Known Member
Put this into the fermentation fridge earlier this evening - gravity came out a little higher than original recipe. 5.5 gallons of 1.058 - pitched a healthy starter of wlp001. Looking forward to tasting this one.
crusader1612
Well-Known Member
Must be time for a new thermometer check just now. It's at 1.014 instead of the expected 1012. 10 days in the barrel. Nevermind tastes awesome and dry hopped tonight
Give it a few days and check again. I've had it drag on especially if temps are cooler than normal. I've hit FG in as few as 4 days before, and been within a few points after only 3 days, but these days if I keep temp at 68 and pitch appropriate I'm usually at FG by 6-7 days. By the 14 day mark I'd expect it's as low as it's going to get.
I'm also not familiar with Carahell. Do you know the fermentability vs crystal/caramel malts as that may account for some or all of your 2 point differential.
crusader1612
Well-Known Member
Yeah its promoted as a crystal 15 sub., but promotes head stability also. I guess its possible its added an additional point or 2 to the final beer, the beer has been fermented as follows, and my last beer, finished lower. with a similar grain bill, but 2% less crystal.
I'm going to pick up a new thermometer on the weekend just in case, and i'll check again soon, although I've racked over to secondary and dryhopped now, so no turning back now.
i pitched at 17C- ramped to 18 after 24 hours, and 19 after 2 more days, then 21 after 6 days, krausen has dropped completely and looks completed,
This might have had something to do with it.
17C = 62.6F
18C = 64.4F
19C = 66.2F
21C = 69.8F
That means for the first five days you were fermenting at a lower temp than the recipe calls for and lower than the optimum temp range per white labs . Likely it wasn't finished fermenting when you racked it to secondary but I bet it'll still be tasty.
HopheadNJ
Well-Known Member
As with most of my ales, I'm fermenting this at 64*F. I know WLP001 is pretty clean, even at higher temps. Typically I like to let the hops shine without too much yeast character in my pales. I've never had this brew before - is it pretty clean or does the yeast contribute?
I don't expect any issues and I'm sure it will be a great beer but has the OP experimented with ferm temps on this? Maybe 68 is the sweet spot for this beer or is it just because it's the recommended temp for the strain?
I don't expect any issues and I'm sure it will be a great beer but has the OP experimented with ferm temps on this? Maybe 68 is the sweet spot for this beer or is it just because it's the recommended temp for the strain?
I've never done below 65F with this beer. First few batches while trying to nail down the recipe were done between 65-67F. I ended up settling on 68F based on Vinnie's feedback that it's what they ferment at and I was trying to nail a clone I wanted to replicate as many of the variables as I could.
Now yeast character variances in WLP001 between a 4* differential is likely to be somewhat subjective. I don't recall any difference in yeastiness between the batches done a few degrees under and at 68F. However there are likely many who's palates are much more yeast sensitive than mine and they may notice it.
One of the added benefits of fermenting it at 68F for me is that it finishes faster, which means I can clear my conical faster for the next batch.
crusader1612
Well-Known Member
I used 05 which is capable of down to 15degC. I used the same ferm schedule as the last one which finished dead on 1012. It's not a ferm temp issue. It's possibly the carahell either way it's time for a new thermometer. She's had a hard old life.Jukas said:
This was my first All-Grain attempt, and the bottles just finished carbonating last night so I could try one. I followed the recipe exactly, though I think my mash cooled off faster than it should have, I was around 145 by the time I started sparging, so it's probably thinner than it should be. It's still some good stuff though. I was a little concerned because I'd used Simcoe for the first time on my previous batch and decided I didn't like the flavor, but by that time this was already in the fermenter, so I just kept with it. I don't know if it's the difference in the grain bill, or the hops schedule, but this doesn't have the strong banana notes that my previous Simcoe ale did, or at least it's more balanced. I suppose I'll have to rethink my lifetime ban on Simcoe hops.
Thanks for the recipe!
Thanks for the recipe!
GlassForest
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Should have taken photo.
Beer was a carbon copy of the real deal. I went to the Russian River brew pub and brought a growler of r2h56 home and we all had a tasting. The color, and aroma were indistinctible from each other. And it came to the consensus the the clone had a better taste. Hope others have as good luck with this one as I did, cheers!
Ps. First post on HBT
Beer was a carbon copy of the real deal. I went to the Russian River brew pub and brought a growler of r2h56 home and we all had a tasting. The color, and aroma were indistinctible from each other. And it came to the consensus the the clone had a better taste. Hope others have as good luck with this one as I did, cheers!
Ps. First post on HBT
midfielder5
Well-Known Member
NobleRock said:
The banana notes are not due to grains or Simcoe hops, that is a clear issue with yeast management-- you either fermented it too hot, or underpitched, or had old unhealthy yeast (or a combo). Look at your fermentation temps and yeast health to get rid of the banana.
Simcoe hops are all pine and cat piss aroma.
cheers.
crusader1612
Well-Known Member
#belgian Yeast. Hahamidfielder5 said:
That was the best part of dialing in this clone recipe.. having to go down to RR to fill a growler
I'm glad you enjoyed the clone, to be fair through if you can get R2H56 at the brewer right when it's hitting it's stride it can't be beat.
brew2enjoy
Well-Known Member
Mine turned out great as well. The hops are starting to fade though. I might throw a fresh ounce of simcoe in the keg today.
Used this as a base for a pale I made. Edited the hope. Nugget to bitter, the citra, cascade and Amarillo in the boil. Dry hoped it yesterday with more citra. Was worried about the color, but compared with yours it looks about right. Samples are good, and I will probably base all of my American pales around this, just editing the hops. Good work.
