Questions about first cider

[thrashandburn]

Hi guys, I'm considering making my first cider. I've looked around these forums as well as some other sources but a few things I'm a bit confused about. I have a bunch of questions and I apologize for the long post.

The only ciders that I've tasted are commercial examples like Strongbow, Woodchuck, and Crispin, all of which I believe advertise as being dry. I like these products, so therefore, I think I'd like having a dry character to my cider, but these ciders are also pretty sweet. So, to emulate this style cider, I would have to ferment until dry, then backsweeten correct? Or are these merely sweet ciders that have some dryness?

If I have to backsweeten, I'd like to refrain from using artificial sweetener if at all possible, but I would like to minimize my chances of having bottles exploding, so what are my options?

Can I add more cider, apple juice concentrate, or another sugar like corn sugar after fermentation to add sweetness, then add priming solution, bottle, and then just test the bottles every couple of days until I'm happy with the carbonation, then heat pasteurize via the method described by Pappers? Would this work or is it a must to stop the fermentation before sweetening and priming via cold crash or chemical means?

Or would it just be best to bottle when I think it tastes good and let the residual sugar and yeast carb the bottles? Or would I still need to prime them? Thank you to anyone who posts, I appreciate it much.

 

[sashurlow]

You have a very common question. The hardest part about it is that the best solution to having sweet cider is to keg it. Not too many people have kegging equipment.
First off, Woodchuck is NOT a dry cider. Strongbow is mostly dry and I have only had one Crispin so I am choosing not to have an opinion about it. Don't try to replicate a commercial cider. There are way too many factors affecting taste with cider to make it work, mostly being the apples themselves.
My suggestion would be to make a dry cider for your first try. Learn from it, then mess around with the recipe.
Pappers idea is nice BUT... you need to have a cider with no pectin left. So either use store bought "juice" or pectic enzyme. I did Pappers idea and ended up with jelly in every bottle. With that said... you got the idea down. Either use sweetners or Pappers idea, or just ferment it dry. Regardless, it will taste incredible.

 

[thrashandburn]

Thanks very much for the response. So then to avoid any complication that can arise from Pappers' method, like jelly as mentioned, could I just cold crash the bottles to kill the yeast and get the same effect? I would probably have to use ale yeast to ensure the low temps will kill it off completely, correct?

I'm still a bit unclear on some things, mainly, the bottling process. If I ferment it dry, then I know I have to prime the bottles to make it sparkle, but what if I back sweeten it with more juice concentrate or more cider? Would I still need to prime it or would the sugar residing in the added juice be enough to fully carb the bottles and still sweeten it?

When you say store bought "juice", are you referring to using store bought pasteurized apple cider, or do you mean store bought apple juice, like Mott's and whatnot, or do you mean frozen juice concentrate?

 

[MarkKF]

Try it dry, fermented out and unsweetened first. You might like it. My uncle, a beer guy, thought mine was still too sweet.

 

[thrashandburn]

well since everyone is so insistent on my trying it dry I will heed to the wisdom of the more experienced. But for future reference, and also the fact that I might try to do 2 small batches in wine jugs, one sweetened and one dry to compare, can someone please answer my question about priming and cold crashing the bottles?

 

[phaem]

Cold crashing will not kill the yeast. Ale yeast more easily go dormant when chilled whereas some yeast can continue to slowly ferment in the refrigerator. Perhaps you are hoping to bottle carbonate then stabilize by keeping the bottles cold?

If you have a sweet cider then additional priming sugar is unnecessary for carbonation. Very little sugar is required to carbonate, so a cider that tastes sweet will contain plenty of sugar to explode bottles if yeast is not controlled or removed.

 

[LeBreton]

Not sure why people are pushing you toward a dry cider when you're looking to make something similar to the mass produced brands. Woodchuck and Strongbow are NOT dry ciders, if I remember correctly they each have around 21g of sugar per bottle putting it well into the realm of sweet cider. The term you are looking for is not dry but crisp, you want a crisp cider.

Since most commercial juice is made from sweet apples you're gonna have a hard time doing this without adding some of your own juice from 'sharp' apples like Granny Smith, Northern Spy, etc. Alternatively, but probably not as good, you could add some malic acid (available at most LHBS or online) to your batch to dry and bring out some crisp character.

 

[thrashandburn]

thanks guys that's some really good info, thanks for answering my questions rather than telling me to try something different.