Mulberries...lots of em

[TerapinChef]

I currently know of at least 3 mulberry trees that are available for me to harvest from. I may have a line on two or three more. I'm thinking this will give me enough berries to make at LEAST 25 gallons of wine. I'm trying to mentally (and equipmentally) prepare myself for this adventure. I have plenty of freezer space to store the berries until I am ready to process the wine, have no problem getting ahold of various size fermenting containers, have a large amount of carboys of various sizes at my disposal, and a lot of patience. My thought is to try to shoot for a full barrel (55G that is) to give me a bulk container to do the camdenizing/initial mixing in. Get the primary fermentation out of the way, then split the fermented wine into seperate carboys/demijohns for aging, was my thought process.

I wouldn't mind doing a few (2-3) different flavors out of this base batch. I was thinking I could just backsweeten individual carboys differently, using these wonderful fruit purees using these wonderful fruit purees , honey, brandy, or any number of things!

So any advice, comments, or guidance from people who have harvested a LOT of mulberries in the past would be greatly appreciated!

 

[CandleWineProject]

Terry Garey's book has a recipe called Mulberry's Revenge. Apparently the neighbor's tree annoyingly dropped mulberries into her yard, so she made wine out of it.

 

[Emerald]

I have all kinds of mulberry trees in my yard and in the big field out back- the owner of the field has given me permission to pick them to my heart's content and I plan on making wine also, and if I get enuf, some mead.
Now there is a funny story on the mulberries around here- while the berries are white/black/pink(on any given tree and these are the ripe colors) the whole species of mulberry around here is called Chinese white.. There is an American type called RED mulberry and another called Black mulberry.
How confusing is that?
The white berries are much more flavorful than the plain black ones around here and there are about 5 of those trees compared to probably what seems like hundreds of the black ones. There is one pink colored berry on a smaller bush, they are not as good as the white berries tho. I am lazy and just use my old sheets that I use for frost damage control in my garden and lay them on the ground and shake each branch.
Now with the black colored berries, I found that if I leave the almost ripe/but not quite there berries in with the black ones the flavor is a bit nicer-- have a bit more acid or something in there- but for jam I usually have to add a bit of lemon or lime when make it...it just balances the flavor out..
I will be watching these threads like a hawk so when my trees are bursting with the berries I will be ready for the Wine making to begin!! lol
And we all know when they start getting ripe right? When all the little bird ploops on the car are purple!!

 

[TerapinChef]

I've heard that the white ones are far more flavorful, but lacking in the acids and such to make a well balanced wine. Given the quantity that I'm looking to make, I'd like to avoid using as many additives as possible. I have a feeling the nutrients I'll need alone may be a bit costly.

That being said, I think that I've discovered my first speedbump. My original plan was to ferment this in a foodsafe 55G drum. Now that I'm thinking about the actual process, I've realized that I will have no way to control the temperature of said drum...and while my basement does stay relatively cool in the summer, this fermentation is going to kick off quite a bit of heat I would imagine...any thoughts on this?

 

[Emerald]

If it is in your basement it should stay much cooler than the upper floors, but it is really hard to say what this spring/summer is gonna be like here in MI- last year it was great weather and kinda cool and we had bumper crops of mulberries, but of course I didn't know how to make wine then So this summers crop will probably be small (knock on wood).
The temps- if they are too warm will make the must ferment faster, but will take longer to age (if all the reading and researching I have done is right) and can sometimes give off flavors, but I have had some ferment in warm and now in cold and all of my wine really needs to age more before I drink it.

 

[gratus fermentatio]

I think that I've discovered my first speedbump. My original plan was to ferment this in a foodsafe 55G drum. Now that I'm thinking about the actual process, I've realized that I will have no way to control the temperature of said drum...and while my basement does stay relatively cool in the summer, this fermentation is going to kick off quite a bit of heat I would imagine...any thoughts on this?

You could always freeze those mulberries & wait till autumn or winter to start the primary. Or just ferment in several smaller primaries. Regards, GF.

 

[pkeeler]

The white berries from the chinese trees are tasteless. The chinese trees grow like weeds and interbreed with the American trees, dulling their flavor. Finding non-contaminated American trees is very hard. I would not make wine from any mulberry tree without tasting the berries first.

 

[Emerald]

The white berries from the Chinese trees are tasteless. The Chinese trees grow like weeds and interbreed with the American trees, dulling their flavor. Finding non-contaminated American trees is very hard. I would not make wine from any mulberry tree without tasting the berries first.

The trees around here that have white berries have much better flavor than the black ones, very sweet and have honey like overtones. I wonder if the area that they are grown makes a big difference? The black ones if you let them get really ripe are almost tasteless.
It's amazing how different folks have different opinions of taste. We search out the white berries for fresh eating and save all the rest for canning/freezing. the white berries also seem to be much bigger than the black and pink ones. At least around my house and the back field.

Also you are very correct in the tasting stuff first-- if it doesn't taste that good fresh eating, it probably isn't gonna make a good wine...

 

[Yooper]

I've heard that the white ones are far more flavorful, but lacking in the acids and such to make a well balanced wine. Given the quantity that I'm looking to make, I'd like to avoid using as many additives as possible. I have a feeling the nutrients I'll need alone may be a bit costly.

That being said, I think that I've discovered my first speedbump. My original plan was to ferment this in a foodsafe 55G drum. Now that I'm thinking about the actual process, I've realized that I will have no way to control the temperature of said drum...and while my basement does stay relatively cool in the summer, this fermentation is going to kick off quite a bit of heat I would imagine...any thoughts on this?

I think your basement would be fine. Many wine yeast have large temperature ranges, some up to 90 degrees! For example, Lalvin's EC1118 (champagne yeast) has a range of 39-95 degrees. I've done wines in the close-to-80-degree range, with good results. Just choose a yeast strain that can handle it. My favorite quick reference: http://winemaking.jackkeller.net/strains.asp

 

[johnnyo1977]

I like this thread. It makes me want to try making mulberry wine.
When the berries are picked would it be a good idea to run them through a squeezo to remove the seeds and stems so there is just the juice from the berries? Or do you through them into the primary with some pectic enzyme for a few days to break down the berries then transfer the must to a clean carboy for frementation?

 

[TerapinChef]

I would be doing a pectic enzyme "rest", a camden "rest", then was just planning on fermenting with the berries. Wasn't really planning on removing them until primary was finished...but I have to admit, I haven't done very much research into making fruit wines. All of my experience is with beer, and a few batches of mead. But you know what they say...."keep your feet on the ground, and keep reaching for the stars!"

 

[Yooper]

I don't have any experience with mulberries ( I think we're too far north), but I make wines with other berries. You don't want to keep the berries in the ferment for more than about 5-7 days. The fruit will start to get gross, and you want to remove the fruit once primary is finishing up.

Even with grapes, the ferment is started, and then a few days later the grapes are pressed. I use a big mesh bag for my fruit, and ferment in big buckets, so I can remove the fruit when needed.

 

[TerapinChef]

I was thinking that might have to be the procedure. Do you think the mesh brewbags would work, or am I going to have to go cheesecloth? Gosh I might need to mount a winch on my ceiling to get that bag out of there once the fruit's ready....Thanks for all ur advice guys, I feel like my thread is bonifide now that Yoop's chimed in!

 

[Yooper]

I was thinking that might have to be the procedure. Do you think the mesh brewbags would work, or am I going to have to go cheesecloth? Gosh I might need to mount a winch on my ceiling to get that bag out of there once the fruit's ready....Thanks for all ur advice guys, I feel like my thread is bonifide now that Yoop's chimed in!

Those big mesh brewbags are perfect- that's what I use. You can buy the biggest ones, the kind you'd use for a BIAB, and load them up with fruit. You can use as many as you need. Usually, for a 10 gallon batch of wine, I might have 4 bags of fruit in there.

What helps a lot is to freeze the fruit. I use clear (food safe) garbage bags. Just rinse the fruit, and freeze it. While it's still mostly frozen, you can put it in the mesh bags. Then tie off the bag at the top and allow the fruit to start to thaw. Then, you can add your water and campden (sulfite). If you have a refractomber, you can figure the sugar amounts right then. Otherwise, you'd have to guestimate the sugar. Probably 2 pounds per gallon, if mulberries are like blackberries. I'd add the sugar (dissolved in hot water) in increments, stirring well to check the SG. You want wine, not rocket fuel! I'd probably go with an OG in the 1.085-1.100 range.

 

[meading_of_minds]

I've got access to some wild mulberry trees. I might try this. But one question. Are you removing all the stems by hand before freezing them or just not worring about them? I know when I used to make jelly, we removed them. And would it just be easier to crush them down to juice and work from that?

 

[TerapinChef]

Not removing stems, or juicing them or anything. I think it would be easier to just toss em in a bag like Yooper said than bother with the trouble (AND MESS!) of juicing them.

 

[Yooper]

I pick off all of the stems on chokecherries. It's a pain, but I've read that you can get some astringency from the stems. I'm not sure about mulberries, but keep that in mind!

 

[TerapinChef]

So I'm thinking I'll be basing my recipe off of this one, at least loosely.


Per 5G batch:
25# Mulberries
2 1/2t Pectin Enzyme
6# sugar
2t acid blend
1t tannin

Freeze mulberries, place in mesh bag. Allow to defrost, add 5G warm water. Dissolve 2 Campden Tablets in must, wait 12 hours. Add Pectin Enzyme, add 1Q orange juice, 1T Yeast Nutrient, 1t tannin, and yeast to flask. Stirplate for 12 hours. Strain Fruit, add sugar and acid blend. Check SG, looking for about 1.100. Add yeast, let it :rockin: until I hit about 1.038 or so, then transfer to secondary and wait about 9 months. Then taste, "season" if necessary, and invite some people over to help me bottle!

 

[Yooper]

The only change I'd make is to increase the campden tablets to one per gallon. Otherwise, I like it! (what are mulberries, by the way?)

Oh, and one other little item- you probably want to only go to the 1.090 area. I like blackberry wine at 1.085-1.095. It gets pretty "hot" at 1.095, though, so my preference is no higher than 1.090. (Don't be surprised if you have to go to 2-2.5 pounds of sugar per gallon to reach it- usually berries don't have as much sugar as you think!)

 

[Yooper]

Oh, and one other minor thing- when you mix up the must, leave out the yeast and the pectic enzyme. The reason is that neither one of those ingredients do well with sulfites, and they don't work well together either.

After 12 hours of campden-ing (sulfiting), you can add the pectic enzyme safely. Wait another 12 hours, and then add the yeast.

 

[TerapinChef]

Yoops:
Mulberries are these:

They kind of look like a big blackberry that grows on a small tree/large bushy thing. They're the reason that birds poop purple, wine colored stains in the summertime, and people tend to hate them for that reason. Plus they're too hard to make pie out of cuz the stems don't come out easily.

I was shooting for a higher OG thinking that the yeast would poop out at a higher FG leaving me a sweeter wine. Thanks for the advice on the Campden tablets, I wasn't sure if the ratio changed at higher volumes. I was planning on putting the Camden in for 12 hours, then adding the pectin enzyme 12 hours later, then adding the yeast 12 hours after that. Should I give the Campden a full 24 before the pectin enzyme goes in?

 

[Yan]

Yoops:
Mulberries are these:

They kind of look like a big blackberry that grows on a small tree/large bushy thing.

I've seen them grow on rather big trees. But then I live in a dry region, so a big tree here isn't as big as a big tree elsewhere, i guess. Still, the one I'm thinking about is just near my house around sixty feet.

 

[Yooper]

Yoops:
Mulberries are these:
They kind of look like a big blackberry that grows on a small tree/large bushy thing. They're the reason that birds poop purple, wine colored stains in the summertime, and people tend to hate them for that reason. Plus they're too hard to make pie out of cuz the stems don't come out easily.

I was shooting for a higher OG thinking that the yeast would poop out at a higher FG leaving me a sweeter wine. Thanks for the advice on the Campden tablets, I wasn't sure if the ratio changed at higher volumes. I was planning on putting the Camden in for 12 hours, then adding the pectin enzyme 12 hours later, then adding the yeast 12 hours after that. Should I give the Campden a full 24 before the pectin enzyme goes in?

No, I fixed my typo. 24 hours total from campden to yeast!

Well, some yeast strains will easily go to 18%, even 19%, if they're happy. Even a strain that should poop out at 12-14% might not if the yeast is working well. I'd start lower, and either feed incrementally later on, or stabilize and back sweeten. One thing that works great with some wines is to rack when done, wait a week or more, and then add some honey or sugar. It'll usually ferment a bit, but slower and without as much vigor, often stopping short of finishing up. I got a FG with a crabapple wine like that- not sweet, but not bone dry either. I added 1/4 cup honey. Waited. Added another 1/4 cup, and the yeast just finally stopped. I think racking it before that was a key, though. (This was a 3 gallon batch, so 1/4 cup honey at a time isn't much, but it was enough to poop out the yeast)

 

[TerapinChef]

Sounds like a plan. Come on, mulberries! One thing I am a bit nervous about. I made a raspberry mead a while back. Just honey and raspberry sauce. It fermented out a bit drier than I would have liked, but I'm letting it age and it's getting better at the 2 year mark. The thing is, all traces of raspberry fermented right out of the primary! Their isn't a drop of fruit flavor to be found! Anyone encountered this before?

 

[TerapinChef]

So here's what ended up happening with this whole project...

I ended up with a ton of mulberries, and I threw all of them in my 20G brewpot. I added maybe 2 Gallons of water and about 8 pounds of sugar. I got it all up to a boil and let it get good and boiled out. Then I poured all of it through a 5G nylon mesh bag into a bucket, then transfered all of this into my other brewpot and chilled it with my immersion chiller. I hung the bag over the brewpot to let the weight of the berries squeeze themselves out (with a little help from me, of course).

Then I put it all in the demijohn with my yeast (71B-1122). After a day or two I added a pint of Tart Cherry Juice concentrate (62 Brix) and a pound of dried currants and a half pound of dried blueberries. I rinsed these very well, brought them to a boil for 2 minutes, then put them in the blender until they were pretty smooth. Then I cooled this and added it to the fermenter. I did also use some yeast energizer/nutrient and a pectic enzyme addition as well.

I also added, a few days ago, about 3 pounds of Star Thistle Honey leftover from my 5G bucket mixed with 2Q of water. I wanted to add some honey to it for the flavor as well as up the total volume.

Can't wait to see how this turns out, it's already got a lot of promise (nice acidity, good balance with sweetness, etc)