Let's start some controversy....to secondary or not?

[101DDD]

All, I've been on the site for some time now and posting the occasional question, but in one of the responses I got, the comment was made that transferring to secondary is becoming less common.

Is that true? I was always told of yeast flavors being introduced when sitting in primary too long.

I know this is controversial and there will be responses on both sides, so let's have this debate and find what the brewing world thinks!

 

[broadbill]

why not? We hasn't been discussed this week yet so have at it

 

[LKABrewer]

This has been hashed out on here too many times. I think we can all agree that the yeast flavor is a myth. There are too many stories on here where the beer sat for months with no off flavors. If you think a secondary works for you, then go for it. If sitting on the primary yeast cake for a month give good results, though, then why bother?

 

[Lunchtime]

I think it all depends on the beer and situation.

 

[BrewerinBR]

It is a matter of personnel preference. I do not secondary any beers that are not being aged more than 30 days. Most of the beers I brew I leave in primary for 21 days then cold crash for 24 to 48 hours and bottle, unless I am going to dry hop them, then I on day 21 I had the dry hops and let it sit for 7 more days then cold crash and bottle. If I am planning to age a beer in my basement I leave for 28 days in primary and then transfer to secondary and age it for 28 days or more.

 

[paulster2626]

You should always use a secondary if you want to make good beer. If you want to make just "okay" beer, then leave it in the primary for 4+ weeks.




Controversy started.

 

[J8D]

I thought we all voted an agreed based on the below discussin that we would not do secondaries unless adding fruit, lagering, or dry hopping. Are we doing a recount or something? I have only lived in Florida for six months and already another recount....

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f163/secondary-not-john-palmer-jamil-zainasheff-weigh-176837/

 

[Revvy]

I suggest you read THIS thread, it's become the "uber discussion" on this topic thread. Rather than re-invent the wheel for the hundredth time this week....You haven't noticed a plethora of threads talking about this already?????

To Secondary or Not? John Palmer and Jamil Zainasheff Weigh In .

Most everyone on this forum has ventured their opinions on the subject many many many many many many many many many many times, and most of them have ended up in the above thread. If you really do want opinions, and even some facts and citations, and articles, podcasts and other things on this topic, hit that thread.

Quite a lot of us leave our beers in primary 3-4 weeks.

And all the reasons why and everything else you can imagine is covered in that thread. Including the whole history of the debate/discussion and even the change in Palmer's view of it (which I think was greatly influenced by this forum. We were the first to openly discuss it, and to openly experiment with it, and to call shenanagans on the yeast/autolysis fear.

This isn't a "controversy" anymore....hasn't been for 3-4 years for most of us. It's an accepted practice, covered even in BYO magazine, in podcast, and caused John Palmer to re-evaluate his book. All this discussion is now is a boring re-tread of a beaten to a pulp dead horse......It may be a new discussion to you, but the "brewing world" has already weighed in, and on here mostly in that thread.

 

[pksmitty]

You should always use a secondary if you want to make good beer. If you want to make just "okay" beer, then leave it in the primary for 4+ weeks.




Controversy started.

You should never secondary. Good beer is only made by letting it sit on the yeast cake for a month.




Controversy continued.

 

[badbrew]

Well this isn't a dictatorship so I'm going to secondary on my next brew...

...and I plan to drink tap water, eat doughnuts, stay home on the next election day, buy a v8, and leave the toilet seat up. Got a problem?

 

[Tyrone]

why, god.... WHY?!?!?

(I am a convert of the church of the NMS --no more secondaries *except for fruit-- we'll see if I go to Beer Asgard now...)

 

[wildwest450]

Stop feeding the trolls.

I secondary all my beers in the keg.

_

 

[Airborneguy]

I primary in a bucket, secondary in a serving vessel, and after I drink it, I want to tertiary on anyone who brings up this stupid topic again.

 

[kh54s10]

I secondary all my beers..... in my stomach!

 

[101DDD]

All right, all right, I admit I should have searched through the threads first. Sorry, it had been on my mind all night and I had 2 minutes to dig, so I chose starting the thread. Not trying to be a troll

If it shows anything, it's that the community here is willing to jump in and help, even if it's been asked before. Thanks for being gentle, gentle-men.

 

[maffewl]

For the best beer, I always secondary when I get down to 3.6 airlock bubbles per 46.9 seconds.

I learned it from wildwest450.

 

[dcHokie]

For the best beer, I always secondary when I get down to 3.6 airlock bubbles per 46.9 seconds.

I learned it from wildwest450.

Those numbers seem off, have you calibrated your airlock recently?

 

[kevokie]

For the best beer, I always secondary when I get down to 3.6 airlock bubbles per 46.9 seconds.

I learned it from wildwest450.

I been doing it wrong...crap.

 

[jetmac]

unless I am going to dry hop them, then I on day 21 I had the dry hops and let it sit for 7 more days then cold crash and bottle.

There's another controversial subject. You're not dry hopping long enough

 

[jetmac]

I suggest you read THIS thread, it's become the "uber discussion" on this topic thread. Rather than re-invent the wheel for the hundredth time this week....You haven't noticed a plethora of threads talking about this already?????

To Secondary or Not? John Palmer and Jamil Zainasheff Weigh In .

Most everyone on this forum has ventured their opinions on the subject many many many many many many many many many many times, and most of them have ended up in the above thread. If you really do want opinions, and even some facts and citations, and articles, podcasts and other things on this topic, hit that thread.

Quite a lot of us leave our beers in primary 3-4 weeks.

And all the reasons why and everything else you can imagine is covered in that thread. Including the whole history of the debate/discussion and even the change in Palmer's view of it (which I think was greatly influenced by this forum. We were the first to openly discuss it, and to openly experiment with it, and to call shenanagans on the yeast/autolysis fear.

This isn't a "controversy" anymore....hasn't been for 3-4 years for most of us. All it is now is a boring re-tread of a beaten to a pulp dead horse......It may be a new discussion to you, but the "brewing world" has already weighed in, and on here mostly in that thread.

+1

revvy; you always know the right thing to say

 

[BradleyBrew]

I think we should debate the use of a secondary vs. primary only and re-hydration vs. direct pitch for dry yeast at the same time on the same thread. That would be fantastic lol

 

[Brewnoob1]

If you want "good" beer, send it to me when finished. If you want "great" beer, send it to me when finished. Or just send it to me in general when finished for "other" results. Kthx

 

[two_hearted]

Quaternary fermentation is where its at. Its what the pros do.

 

[BetterSense]

I've been going to stop secondary on a batch just to try it out, but I can never bring myself to leave the beer in that dirty carboy with all that krausen sticking to the sides and 2 inches of yeast in it. After a couple weeks I always transfer it to a clean container to dry hop or just age a week or two before bottling. Having it in that nice clean container is a clean feeling, like new socks. Old habits die hard, I guess.

 

[friday]

Not, unless I'm really lazy and I don't have time to bottle for a couple of months.

Really I think my beer is better if it's on the yeast for 30 days. Past that I'll secondary until I have time to bottle.

 

[wildwest450]

For the best beer, I always secondary when I get down to 3.6 airlock bubbles per 46.9 seconds.

I learned it from wildwest450.

Now you're catching on!


_

 

[Exbeerienced]

All, I've been on the site for some time now and posting the occasional question, but in one of the responses I got, the comment was made that transferring to secondary is becoming less common.

Is that true? I was always told of yeast flavors being introduced when sitting in primary too long.

I know this is controversial and there will be responses on both sides, so let's have this debate and find what the brewing world thinks!

101DDD,
Like you, I am new here. Conversely, there are some here who have thousands, if not tens of thousands, of posts. Those folks have seen it all, read it all, and written much of it. Sadly, we missed many of those interesting discussions and are naturally discouraged from being allowed to discuss them again. I think we best serve ourselves, as well as the more experienced posters here, if we try to keep to the search tool and archives. It kind of sucks, but we are just late to the party and there's no changing that!

 

[mikeysab]

Wow, has there been zero mods that have seen this? Or are they just letting it exist?

 

[Yooper]

Wow, has there been zero mods that have seen this? Or are they just letting it exist?

101DDD,
Like you, I am new here. Conversely, there are some here who have thousands, if not tens of thousands, of posts. Those folks have seen it all, read it all, and written much of it. Sadly, we missed many of those interesting discussions and are naturally discouraged from being allowed to discuss them again. I think we best serve ourselves, as well as the more experienced posters here, if we try to keep to the search tool and archives. It kind of sucks, but we are just late to the party and there's no changing that!

This is a forum. Which means we "talk", and it is completely inappropriate to tell someone they can't post or shouldn't because it's been done before. I'm sorry that some members feel that way- to say that they feel they should be confined to only reading other threads and using the search makes me feel bad.

No one is holding a gun to anybody's head making them answer- if you choose not to rehash/discuss/answer, that's cool. The great thing about having 80,000 members in this forum means that there is always something for everybody to discuss.

 

[Diver165]

Well this isn't a dictatorship so I'm going to secondary on my next brew...

...and I plan to drink tap water, eat doughnuts, stay home on the next election day, buy a v8, and leave the toilet seat up. Got a problem?

Tap water?!?!? Anarchist...

 

[Exbeerienced]

This is a forum. Which means we "talk", and it is completely inappropriate to tell someone they can't post or shouldn't because it's been done before. I'm sorry that some members feel that way- to say that they feel they should be confined to only reading other threads and using the search makes me feel bad.

No one is holding a gun to anybody's head making them answer- if you choose not to rehash/discuss/answer, that's cool. The great thing about having 80,000 members in this forum means that there is always something for everybody to discuss.

Thanks, Yooper. What I don't understand, is if a topic is old hat to an experienced poster, why doesn't he just ignore it then, and let the new folks enjoy discussing the topic? Really it's that simple!

 

[Yooper]

Thanks, Yooper. What I don't understand, is if a topic is old hat to an experienced poster, why doesn't he just ignore it then, and let the new folks enjoy discussing the topic? Really it's that simple!

Yes, it really IS that simple. I don't understand it either.

 

[bob1852]

Sadly, we missed many of those interesting discussions and are naturally discouraged from being allowed to discuss them again.

You did miss the great cinnamon debate of 2009...

 

[samc]

I understand it as being a loss of control of the discussion. Someone might have invested a lot of time posting "gospel" in one major thread and they might fear the outbreak of new ideas/thoughts in a new thread.

Not saying this is the case but it could be an answer.

 

[mikeysab]

To me, the OP was just looking to stir up some crap. Starting with the thread title "Let's start some controversy", but if starting controversy is within the rules, then that's fine. Then to continue that thread name with a "to secondary or not", which has been used in many previous threads, seemed like a little overkill on the subject.

We're all free to beat a dead horse if we want. I was looking out for HBT's interests, not my own.

 

[Homercidal]

Yes, it really IS that simple. I don't understand it either.

I ignored it. I only peeked again to see if this thread was actually still going.

Now it's back to the airlock thread!!

 

[wildwest450]

When you start a thread with "lets start some controversy", it's clear he has read more than a few threads on here and is just looking for attention. So in my book, he's open to whatever he get's.

_

 

[Hugh_Jass]

Thanks, Yooper. What I don't understand, is if a topic is old hat to an experienced poster, why doesn't he just ignore it then, and let the new folks enjoy discussing the topic? Really it's that simple!

Or POLITELY offer a link to another discussion that contains a discussion of the subject. It's home Homebrewtalk not Homebrewsearch or HomebrewctrlC/V

That said...when you start a thread with the title "Let's start some controversy", you're kinda asking for some, well, controversy.

 

[LandoLincoln]

There's another controversial subject. You're not dry hopping long enough

Heresy. Dry hopping is never necessary. Just use the right amounts of hops during the boil, you newb.

 

[BrewKnurd]

When you start a thread with "lets start some controversy", it's clear he has read more than a few threads on here and is just looking for attention. So in my book, he's open to whatever he get's.

_

I will agree that's an odd way to start a thread. I think someone else started a thread with a similar "lets fight!" tone to it a couple days ago. I don't get it.