Imperial Saison - "cien"

[inkubuzz]

Im planning on experimeinting with something like a "Imperial Saison" on Saturday.The Idea was aiming for 1.100 OG, 100 IBU, Mash for 100 mins and boiling 100 minutes.
The original recepie was made in metric system (grams and liters) so thats why the strange amounts of grain and hops.

what do you think, any last minute sugessions before I order the ingredients?


Recipe: cien (100 in spanish)
Brewer: Cristobal Gevert
Asst Brewer:
Style: Imperial IPA
TYPE: All Grain


Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 6,60 gal
Post Boil Volume: 5,77 gal
Batch Size (fermenter): 5,55 gal
Bottling Volume: 5,49 gal
Estimated OG: 1,104 SG
Estimated Color: 6,6 SRM
Estimated IBU: 100,3 IBUs

Boil Time: 100 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type %/IBU
18 lbs 11,8 oz Pilsner (Weyermann) (1,7 SRM) Grain 85,4 %
2 lbs 3,3 oz Munich I (Weyermann) (7,1 SRM) Grain 10,1 %
7,1 oz Acidulated (Weyermann) (1,8 SRM) Grain 2,0 %
8,8 oz Oats, Flaked (1,0 SRM) Grain 2,5 %
6,00 oz Cascade [6,00 %] - Boil 90,0 min Hop 93,7 IBUs
1,59 oz Saaz [3,40 %] - Boil 15,0 min Hop 6,5 IBUs
2,00 g Irish Moss (Boil 15,0 mins) Fining -
1,0 pkg Safale American (DCL/Fermentis #US-05) Yeast -
1,59 oz Saaz [3,40 %] - Dry Hop 2 weeks Hop 0,0 IBUs



Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, 100 min
Total Grain Weight: 21 lbs 15,0 oz
----------------------------
Name Description Step Temperat Step Time
Mash In Add 25,23 qt of water 149,0 F 100 min

Sparge: Drain mash tun, Batch sparge with 2 steps (2,93gal, 1,46gal) of 167,9 F water

 

[Komodo]

Interesting. I personally wouldn't use Cascade in a Saison, but Styrian Golding, Hallertau, Santiam, Tettnang, etc instead. Cascade would really pull it out of character. Also your IBU look really high to me. I would do almost half that. I'd also do a sugar addition in the fermenter to dry it out, but after it's done the main ferment.

 

[beergolf]

I would not use the Cascade and use any of the hops komodo recommended. IBU's are too high, so cut them back.

You could also drop some of the Pilsner and add some sugar to help dry it out. Adding it after fermentation slows will work great.

I wold also use a saison yeast. 3711 would work great.

Sounds komodo and I have the same thoughts.

 

[KraphtBier]

Crafting a saison requires a specialty yeast. Without the right yeast the taste will not come anywhere close to actual saison. Wyeast 3724 or 3711 and White Labs 565 or 568 are your friends if you truely want the brew to have saison flavor. Mash low, add sugar as fermentation slows, and ramp the temps up from the high sixties (initial pitch temp) to the mid to high eighties as fermentation progresses. Good luck.

 

[phenry]

Crafting a saison requires a specialty yeast. Without the right yeast the taste will not come anywhere close to actual saison. Wyeast 3724 or 3711 and White Labs 565 or 568 are your friends if you truely want the brew to have saison flavor. Mash low, add sugar as fermentation slows, and ramp the temps up from the high sixties (initial pitch temp) to the mid to high eighties as fermentation progresses. Good luck.

This. A Saison isn't a Saison without Saison yeast. Just like any other Belgian. And I wouldn't completely say Cascade is out of place in a Saison, I use Simcoe and Cascade in my Farmhouse ale. The yeast completely dominates the character, and the hops play a supporting role of hints of citrus and floral notes. I would drop the bitterness down though, that's approaching DIPA territory with what you have there.

 

[inkubuzz]

hmmm...theres my main problem... in Chile we dont get Wyeast or White Labs liquid yeast por homebrewers. We only can get some Dry Yeast, like Fermentis or Muntons. What other yeast should I Use?

As of the hops...well I know its totally out of proportion, but the idea was to put everything at 100 (OG, IBU, mashing time and boiling time) I will change the Cascade for other (although I love cascade)

 

[inkubuzz]

maybe Fermentis T-58?

 

[inkubuzz]

or maybe I shuould just loose the pilsner and replace it for pale malt.

At the beginning I wanted to do a DIPA actually, but wanted to use pilsner malt, because I wanted it to be dryer. using pilsner it wasnt a Pale Ale anymore so I figured it would be a strage Saison...

I dont mean to put it on a championship or anything... maybe its a new style! Imperial Double Indian Saison :rockin:

 

[phenry]

Just because you use pilsner malt doesn't mean it can't be a pale ale. A DIPA's hops will completely override just about any flavor contributions from the base malt, so the difference between pilsner and pale malt really won't be distinguishable I'd imagine.

And you can make pale malt just about as dry as you want. Mash low and long. My best DIPA finished out at 1.007, and it used pale malt.

 

[inkubuzz]

perfect... im going with the DIPA name then... ill change the grain amount for some sugar when fermetation drops... how less pilsner should I use and how much sugar ?
Im think 1 kg less pilsner and 500 grms sugar (2.2 and 1.1 lbs respectively)

 

[Komodo]

I use 1 lb sugar in my 4 gallon batch. It's about a 1.065 beer.
The general consensus is to use 15-20% of your fermentables.
14-15 lbs Pilsner malt (depending on your efficiency) and 3 lbs sugar would get you close and really dry it out.