HELP! Help for a relative NEWB--fleeting flavor?....

[40ozBreWing]

Hello all, I am hoping you guys and gals can help me. I am relatively new to brewing and brewed up my 3rd batch a few weeks back. The style I was / am going for is a session style IPA; Founders All Day IPA being my inspiration.

Here are the particulars from my brew / beer:
Boil Size 6.5 gals; Batch size 5.1 gallons; OG – 1.043; FG – 1.006; ABV – 4.86; IBU – 57; BU:GU – 1.3

I used Wyeast 1056 smack pack for fermentation but since I was 1. Short 60 billion yeast cells (per calculations), and 2. was concerned with getting a FG that would still yield me close to 5% beer, I went ahead and added another ¼ of a packet of Safale-005 dry yeast to the mix, when I pitched the Wyeast.

Here was my process, I brewed on 6/23 and 5 days later I had reached the FG of 1.006, confirmed by SG tests with the hydrometer (I know this because I checked the next few days and the gravity was the same). On July 1, I went ahead and racked to secondary, for further ‘clearing’ of the beer, being careful not to splash or introduce any oxygen during the transfer. It was at this time I took the liberty to taste my creation and it was OUTSTANDING! It was just what I was going for; great flavor, beautiful color and great hop aroma and flavor (some of which I attribute to the hopback I built and used).

So, since I was busy, I did not actually dry hop in the secondary until the 5th of July. I let it dry hop for 5 days and bottled on the 10th.

HEREIN LIES MY ISSUE AND CONCERN. When me and my brew buddy racked from the carboy to the bottling bucket we of course took a sample to taste……..and it was not the same beer I tasted when I racked to secondary. The beer wasn’t as near as “bright” and fresh tasting; it wasn’t as aromatic and tasteful as it was the first time I tasted it, when I racked to the secondary. I devised a rockin’ recipe that, upon first taste was exactly what I wanted, but upon tasting it prior to bottling everything was more ‘muted’. Right now, until tasting the final bottled product, I am a little bummed.

MY QUESTION is am I just not being patient and worrying about nothing, with the idea that once the beer is carbonated the flavors will come back out again??? Or is there somewhere I went wrong? I was very careful to gently swirl the beer into the bottling bucket and priming sugar solution, and kept the hose submerged so, again, to eliminate as little oxygen introduction as possible. I am hoping that when I taste to final carbonated product that my worries were for not, but until then…..

I eagerly, and appreciatively await your thoughts, and responses. In the meantime, I am thinking the following. Perhaps you can comment on this as well. I plan to do this same exact recipe next time except I am considering the following. Once I have reached final gravity, in that 5 to 7 days, I will skip dry-hopping and bottle it while it is at its ‘freshest’. And/or once fermenting slows down, dry-hop in the primary for a few days and still be bottling 7 to 9 days after brew day (again, making sure that FG has been met first). Do you guys see any issue with this? Is it okay to bottle this soon after fermentation is complete?

Again, thank you very much in advance for any and all words of advice or encouragement!!! The brewing bug has it hooks deep in me!

BW

 

[V-Fib]

It could be oxidized if it darkened up on you. Hops will always loose their aromas as they age but it seems like you had a pretty fast turn around.

Sadly I don't think flavors will come back but I've had beers do some crazy things flavor wise as they age. I've had 2 that I nearly dumped but after sitting for a few weeks they turned out really good.

For you next go I would definitely skip the secondary and dry hop in the primary. I've done it with good success but you'll have to wait for the hops to settle out. For me bottling or kegging in 9 days is way to fast of a turn around. I've been led to believe the yeast are still doing work after fermentation. I normally leave mine in the carboy for 4 weeks but if you as 10 homebrews what they do you'll get 10 different answers.

 

[40ozBreWing]

Thanks V-Fib!
It doesn't appear to have changed (?), so hopefully it is not oxidized? The top pic is the sample from the fermentor (prior to racking to 2ndry), the one below of the bottled sample from 2 days ago (obviously). Ignore the glass sample, that is an ADIPA for color comparison. Oh, and for the record, that is the only clear bottle i used, just to be able to see the color! All of the others were bottled in brown bottles.

 

[V-Fib]

Looks good, just keep reading the forums and checking out youtube videos. I feel like I got the most from Beer-N-BBQ with Larry and Brew Geek Nation. There's plenty of things to learn and add to or change with each brew. The biggest factor that changed my beer for the better was fermentation temperature control. Have to keep the yeasties happy.

 

[oujens]

Beer doesn't have to darken to have oxidation. There are different levels of it. What you described is typical when oxygen is introduced during transfer. Secondary doesn't really help for an ale and presents more risk for oxidation. Oxidation can be tricky with basic home brew equipment. If interested, I recommend reading the cold side practices on ********************. It provides some interesting information on oxygen and provides some practices to minimize it. A lot of heated debate on this board has been on HSA, but I think there are some good practices presented on the cold side that can help you preserve that hop flavor and aroma.

 

[40ozBreWing]

Beer doesn't have to darken to have oxidation. There are different levels of it. What you described is typical when oxygen is introduced during transfer. Secondary doesn't really help for an ale and presents more risk for oxidation. Oxidation can be tricky with basic home brew equipment. If interested, I recommend reading the cold side practices on ********************. It provides some interesting information on oxygen and provides some practices to minimize it. A lot of heated debate on this board has been on HSA, but I think there are some good practices presented on the cold side that can help you preserve that hop flavor and aroma.

Thanks, OU. I will definitely check it out. I am still holding out hopes that the beer will be good (although maybe not as hoppy or aromatic as i would like) and will yet learn more from this batch. I think i have decided to heck with racking to secondary altogether, just like you mention. Like i said, i will just dry hop in the primary after fermentation slows down. Does that sound about right?

 

[oujens]

Thanks, OU. I will definitely check it out. I am still holding out hopes that the beer will be good (although maybe not as hoppy or aromatic as i would like) and will yet learn more from this batch. I think i have decided to heck with racking to secondary altogether, just like you mention. Like i said, i will just dry hop in the primary after fermentation slows down. Does that sound about right?

Yes, I would venture to guess a very large percentage of home brewers dry hop in the primary. The low oxygen website actually outlines a process of adding hops with a few gravity points remaining so the yeast consume oxygen introduced by dry hopping. I too have struggled with the hop aroma and flavor. I've had success with a couple other beers using improved cold side practices, and I'll be interested to see what it does for my pale ales and IPAs.

 

[40ozBreWing]

Yes, I would venture to guess a very large percentage of home brewers dry hop in the primary. The low oxygen website actually outlines a process of adding hops with a few gravity points remaining so the yeast consume oxygen introduced by dry hopping. I too have struggled with the hop aroma and flavor. I've had success with a couple other beers using improved cold side practices, and I'll be interested to see what it does for my pale ales and IPAs.

Yeah, that was a very technical article; I skimmed and will have to read again. I like the idea of aerating after the yeast has been pitched, but i did not get a sense of how much to aerate; again though, i skimmed the article. Where i am at a disadvantage is i am not using a closed system, nor do i keg....yet.

 

[oujens]

Yeah, that was a very technical article; I skimmed and will have to read again. I like the idea of aerating after the yeast has been pitched, but i did not get a sense of how much to aerate; again though, i skimmed the article. Where i am at a disadvantage is i am not using a closed system, nor do i keg....yet.

All of us are at a disadvantage without big boy equipment. It may take a couple reads for things to make sense, but in the end a lot of the recs are not complex and could be implemented with existing equipment. Closed transfers are a big part of it. If anything, continue finding ways to minimize oxygen on your transfers and use this as a learning opportunity. It will help you plan your future equipment upgrades.

Something I've done is switched to a corny keg for fermenting. Its built to hold pressure, and transfers beer with ease. If you do get a kegging system, you might consider this as a fermenter upgrade. My experience so far is positive, but I do sacrifice a bit of beer due to fermenting in a 5 gallon vessel vs. 6.5 gallons.