EZ Boil wiring for heating element (240v, no neutral)

[BrocTree]

Hi, I do 5 gallon eBIAB and was hoping to get more insight into wiring an ezboil DSPR 320 for just a heating element and on 240V with no neutral. I'm pretty lo-fi, I don't have any pumps and don't maintain perfect temperature when mashing. (Does anyone else do just a heating element with ez-boil without pumps?)

Background: I previously used two 5500w ripples running on 120 V (resulting wattage=2750). I had a dedicated 240V receptable installed a few years ago, and am finally getting around to brewing again and am making the switch to just using ONE 5500w ripple at 240V. I've realized that 5500w might result in an overpowered boil (5 gallons) and that's the main reason I want an ezboil (and maybe in the future, I'll use some of the mashing features).

Now that I've gotten around to looking at wiring, I just realized that I only have 3 wires and can't use any of the plans with a neutral. I modified a plan that I saw on this thread. I've really appreciated the previous plans I've seen from @doug293cz (hope you don't mind that I used microsoft paint on your wiring diagram). I used purple as the return color because it's more intuitive for me.

Questions:
1) I'm not as familiar with wiring for 240V--Is this modified diagram going to blow everything up? (I don't think so?)
2) Are there any safety features that I need to add/consider?
3) It looks like everything from the original plan can be used at 240V except for the contactors.
4) The fuses are still okay, right? And I would want fast blow fuses?

 

[doug293cz]

Here's a design I did for 240V only (no neutral.) It does have a pump but that can just be deleted. It doesn't have the safe start interlock circuitry because I haven't figured out the best way to implement it without a neutral. It's also less important if there is no pump in the system.

Brew on

Your modifications look like they will work, but there is a bit too much unswitched (live at all times) line voltage wiring for my comfort level. It should also have some more fuses added to be safer. I should be able to clean it up pretty quick.

Brew on

 

[Bobby_M]

Hi, I do 5 gallon eBIAB and was hoping to get more insight into wiring an ezboil DSPR 320 for just a heating element and on 240V with no neutral. I'm pretty lo-fi, I don't have any pumps and don't maintain perfect temperature when mashing. (Does anyone else do just a heating element with ez-boil without pumps?)

Background: I previously used two 5500w ripples running on 120 V (resulting wattage=2750). I had a dedicated 240V receptable installed a few years ago, and am finally getting around to brewing again and am making the switch to just using ONE 5500w ripple at 240V. I've realized that 5500w might result in an overpowered boil (5 gallons) and that's the main reason I want an ezboil (and maybe in the future, I'll use some of the mashing features).

Now that I've gotten around to looking at wiring, I just realized that I only have 3 wires and can't use any of the plans with a neutral. I modified a plan that I saw on this thread. I've really appreciated the previous plans I've seen from @doug293cz (hope you don't mind that I used microsoft paint on your wiring diagram). I used purple as the return color because it's more intuitive for me.
View attachment 821582
Questions:
1) I'm not as familiar with wiring for 240V--Is this modified diagram going to blow everything up? (I don't think so?)
2) Are there any safety features that I need to add/consider?
3) It looks like everything from the original plan can be used at 240V except for the contactors.
4) The fuses are still okay, right? And I would want fast blow fuses?

The main issue I have with the above design is that the first contactor that the incoming L1/L2 hits is highly redundant. In effect, the only thing it is doing (that the Element enable contactor ISN'T) is preventing the DSPR320 powering up.

This is what I built myself, but I just removed the pump switch and outlet which is the only thing that used the neutral in the first place. The Auber MVA-22R acts both as a main power indicator and a volt/amp meter. Very slick. This design does not have a safe start interlock, but I consider it to be optional.

One thing to carefully note, which caused me quite a headache at first, is that the red L2 DOES go through that second Normally Open contact on the element enable switch. When I ran that directly to the top LED contact, leakage current through other indicator LEDs would cause the DSPR and/or element LED to light up even with the key switch off.

 

[doug293cz]

The main issue I have with the above design is that the first contactor that the incoming L1/L2 hits is highly redundant. In effect, the only thing it is doing (that the Element enable contactor ISN'T) is preventing the DSPR320 powering up.

The only real purpose of the first contactor in a one element, no pump system is to implement the safe start interlock. In a multi-element, multi-pump, plus maybe some other stuff system, having a main power contactor can be advantageous. Also, the more things you have that should be off when the power is first applied, the more useful the safe start interlock is. Notice that the second design I posted in this thread does not use the safe start interlock, so doesn't have the main power contactor.

Brew on

 

[doug293cz]

This is what I built myself, but I just removed the pump switch and outlet which is the only thing that used the neutral in the first place. The Auber MVA-22R acts both as a main power indicator and a volt/amp meter. Very slick. This design does not have a safe start interlock, but I consider it to be optional.

One thing to carefully note, which caused me quite a headache at first, is that the red L2 DOES go through that second Normally Open contact on the element enable switch. When I ran that directly to the top LED contact, leakage current through other indicator LEDs would cause the DSPR and/or element LED to light up even with the key switch off.

Curious why you didn't wire up the element firing lamp as shown below:

Brew on

 

[BrocTree]

Here's a design I did for 240V only (no neutral.) It does have a pump but that can just be deleted. It doesn't have the safe start interlock circuitry because I haven't figured out the best way to implement it without a neutral. It's also less important if there is no pump in the system.

View attachment 821609

Brew on

Your modifications look like they will work, but there is a bit too much unswitched (live at all times) line voltage wiring for my comfort level. It should also have some more fuses added to be safer. I should be able to clean it up pretty quick.

Brew on

Thank you so much! Just to make sure I understand correctly--I could use this plan with just removing the pump (and associated wires). There would be fuses before and after the main power on switch (and it looks like I could use 1amp fuses for all of them, because it was the pump that required the 10amp fuses, right?)

 

[BrocTree]

The main issue I have with the above design is that the first contactor that the incoming L1/L2 hits is highly redundant. In effect, the only thing it is doing (that the Element enable contactor ISN'T) is preventing the DSPR320 powering up.

This is what I built myself, but I just removed the pump switch and outlet which is the only thing that used the neutral in the first place. The Auber MVA-22R acts both as a main power indicator and a volt/amp meter. Very slick. This design does not have a safe start interlock, but I consider it to be optional.

View attachment 821636


One thing to carefully note, which caused me quite a headache at first, is that the red L2 DOES go through that second Normally Open contact on the element enable switch. When I ran that directly to the top LED contact, leakage current through other indicator LEDs would cause the DSPR and/or element LED to light up even with the key switch off.

Thanks for sharing this--I didn't know that the MVA-22R existed. I love the idea of seeing how many amps are being pulled in real time. At first I was confused by where this was the wiring diagram before I realized that it's powering the AC current transformer (which will need to go around one of the 10awg hot wires going to the heating element, right?)

 

[doug293cz]

Thank you so much! Just to make sure I understand correctly--I could use this plan with just removing the pump (and associated wires). There would be fuses before and after the main power on switch (and it looks like I could use 1amp fuses for all of them, because it was the pump that required the 10amp fuses, right?)

Correct.

Edit: You would only need the fuses before the main power switch, as the ones downstream from the switch would be redundant.

Brew on

 

[doug293cz]

Thanks for sharing this--I didn't know that the MVA-22R existed. I love the idea of seeing how many amps are being pulled in real time. At first I was confused by where this was the wiring diagram before I realized that it's powering the AC current transformer (which will need to go around one of the 10awg hot wires going to the heating element, right?)

Where the power connections and current sensing coil are connected/placed depends on just what you want to measure. By connecting different ways, you can measure total system power (incoming voltage and incoming current) or you can measure just the power going to the element (voltage across the element and current thru the element) which will be lower due to the voltage drop across the SSR, and current used by the other components.

Which do you want to measure?

Brew on

 

[Bobby_M]

My current sensing loop is around the incoming L1 to sense total current.

 

[Bobby_M]

Curious why you didn't wire up the element firing lamp as shown below:

View attachment 821661

Brew on

Primarily because it would be fused off the 1A fuse the way I did it.

 

[doug293cz]

Primarily because it would be fused off the 1A fuse the way I did it.

But only for shorts in the L1 wires, or an internal short in the lamp. The L2 wires are not fused for shorts.

I tend to accept the small risk of having the Element Firing lamp unfused in my designs, as there are only two wires and four connections, so not a lot of potential fail points. I also call out 20AWG wire for these lamps, which should self fuse in the case of a short. Might be a little smoke in the box, but shouldn't cause much damage. Also, the input GFCI should trip in the case of one of the wires shorting.

Brew on

 

[BrocTree]

My current sensing loop is around the incoming L1 to sense total current.

That makes sense. I don't think I specifically need to know exact the voltage/amperage of the heating element, so I'll probably just wire for detecting the totals.

Because everything is 240V (vs a mix of 240 and 120V), then I could put it around either the incoming L1 or L2 and get the same reading?

I was going to use 18awg for the thinner wire because it's what I already have, but I may get 20awg specifically for that light thanks to the discussion above.

 

[doug293cz]

Because everything is 240V (vs a mix of 240 and 120V), then I could put it around either the incoming L1 or L2 and get the same reading?

Correct.

Brew on

 

[doug293cz]

I found my version of 240V, no neutral with the "Safe Start" interlock that I had done a while ago (but forgot about.) I'll drop it here just for completeness.

Brew on