Define Long Primary

[hops2it]

I like the philosophy of a long primary and have made several batches this way. I've also racked to secondary on several occasions and although I saw better clarity, it spooks me a little to be honest and frankly does feel like overkill in many situations.

However...some batches just don't seem to clear in primary. Just made some of Edwort's Haus Pale and after 3.5 weeks I bottled but it was WAY cloudy still. As in near zero visibility through the bottle. FG was reached well in advance of this time however. So I guess my question is, for those of us that don't keg, what's the best recommended advice to get decent clarity. I'm not one who needs crystal clear but unless we're talking about a heavier wheat or similar, I don't want pea soup either. So, lengthen primary even more, incorporate gelatin somehow, other? Should note that I use Irish Moss in most styles and it certainly may help some, but IMO, is not enough to make a vastly aprreciable differences in many cases.

 

[hoppymonkey]

Sounds like you should add a good cold crash to your regiment. I put mine in by beer fridge for a couple days, but a couple bags oh ice will do if you dont have that option.

FYI, Yeast strain matters a lot too.

 

[NordeastBrewer77]

Have you tried Irish moss/whirlfloc? I know that's an obvious ? but had to ask. Another thing you could do is cold crash your beer before bottling/kegging to clear it up.

 

[Airborneguy]

You say you are not kegging... are you sure you are pouring carefully out of the bottle? How are you transferring during your bottling process? If you are doing a proper "long" primary, I'd suspect your problem is that you are transferring too much yeast into the bottling phase.

 

[gtlaw10]

IMHO and from what I could glean from some of the heavyweights on this forum is that a long primary is anywhere from 1 to 4 months.
I have personally never gone beyond 6 weeks in primary and that was only because I was away - it should be noted that it was one of my clearer brews to date - I didn't get noticable yeast-bite or any palatable signs of autolysis.
Gelatin is cheating in my view, which is along the lines of the philosophy the OP may have been hinting at and that is KISS, Occam's Razor, Minimalism, whatever you choose to call it. However gelatin does seem to be the way to go for clarity without lengthy primaries, or filters.
As was noted above, the type of yeast will alter clarity some strains are far less attenuative than others.
Cold also helps, I chill brews for a minimum of 48 hours before cracking one if I choose to cold crash.
Patience is perhaps the best advice I can give you, and I'm sure you're already aware but crystal clear homebrew is something of a myth without filtering. Plus all the yeast iun suspension just provides the drinker with a shot of vitamin B12.

 

[1Mainebrew]

Sounds like you should add a good cold crash to your regiment...Yeast strain matters a lot too.

This is so true. After you bottle and let it carb up, be SUPER patient with how long you let it sit in the fridge. I had a Belgian Golden Strong Ale that took like 5 months to get clear. But with a bit of patience it WILL clear up. Bottom line, how does it taste?

 

[g-star]

Use whirlfloc/irish moss and a flocculent strain of yeast like S-04. Whirlpool prior to transfer from your kettle to the fermenter. Cold crash your primary 48hrs before bottling. Most standard gravity beers < 1.065 OG are ready to be bottled/kegged in 3 weeks or less...no need for "long primaries", although they also don't hurt.

 

[hops2it]

Haven't tasted it yet other than the hydro sample which was fine. Don't think yeast is an issue here...S-05 and got awesome attenuation. My racking method is conservative, I stay above the yeast cake and if anything leave a little beer I should probably be getting to be on the safe side.

You guys are pretty much verifying my thought about cold crashing. I was fridge shopping last weekend for that very reason. Just wanted to be sure I wasn't overlooking any other avenues. I will agree that most of my cloudier beers have eventually cleared in the fridge or even in the bottles which I store in 60s temps for 3 weeks and then longer as fridge space (or lack thereof) allows. I'm not a fan of waiting months on an ale, wit, IPA etc however so I'm leaning toward dedicating a fridge for cold crash/beer storage and using gelatin in the primary as needed. Seems like most feel there's still enough yeast to promote healthy bottle conditioning post-gelatin. Agree or no? And any objections to using gelatin in the primary if it comes to that?

 

[Golddiggie]

4+ weeks in primary, no cold crashing, no gelatin, I do use Irish Moss and/or Whirlfloc in all batches. Careful racking to bottling bucket/keg also helps.

I also let my brews go a minimum of 4 days in the fridge before I open a bottle. Careful/proper pouring is also important there. I poured one of my brews, last night (haven't started drinking yet tonight) from a 750ml (Belgian) bottle into a 22oz glass. Unfortunately, there was more brew than would fit in the glass, so I poured the last (minus the trub layer) into another glass. Probably due to the pour halt, that other glass was cloudy as a mother F... Didn't even drink it (only talking a small amount)... The big glass was super clear, and great. That batch went 5 weeks in primary.

IMO, if you don't rush your batches, you can get super clear brew (to your glass) without needing to cold crash, use gelatin, or do any extra/special processes. Use good flocculation rating yeasts does help too. The yeasts I've used to date rate "medium" or above for flocculation ratings. Given enough time, I believe, all yeast will flocculate to being visibly clear. Of course, there will still be yeast in suspension to carbonate (in bottles) unless you actually filter it.

Try increasing the Irish Moss dose you give your batches. That one change could make a large difference for you... I use a heaping 1/2 tsp in my ~5 gallon batches.

 

[Yooper]

A "long primary" for me is two weeks or so. I think chilling the beer (cold crashing) is very helpful in clear beer. Another key is clear wort to begin with. If you get a good hot break, a good cold break (use whirlfloc, which helps), and the wort is clear before fermentation, you will have a clear beer after fermentation. I like to use flocculant yeast like S04 which clears the beer well, but S05 will clear well too with a cold crash.

 

[Vance71975]

I like the philosophy of a long primary and have made several batches this way. I've also racked to secondary on several occasions and although I saw better clarity, it spooks me a little to be honest and frankly does feel like overkill in many situations.

However...some batches just don't seem to clear in primary. Just made some of Edwort's Haus Pale and after 3.5 weeks I bottled but it was WAY cloudy still. As in near zero visibility through the bottle. FG was reached well in advance of this time however. So I guess my question is, for those of us that don't keg, what's the best recommended advice to get decent clarity. I'm not one who needs crystal clear but unless we're talking about a heavier wheat or similar, I don't want pea soup either. So, lengthen primary even more, incorporate gelatin somehow, other? Should note that I use Irish Moss in most styles and it certainly may help some, but IMO, is not enough to make a vastly aprreciable differences in many cases.

To me Long is 6-8 weeks. I always run a full 30 day primary. Try using a Fining and a Short Secondary. Say 30 days primary, transfer to secondary with fining, let set for a week, then chill the whole carboy down to 34 degrees, let sit for a week or 2 at 34 then, Bring back up to room temp,Bottle, and add about half a package of Re-hydrated Nottingham with your priming sugar. Should help a ton doing it that way!

 

[phenry]

I've never used anything in my brews in order to get them clear, but they seem to clear up just fine. No cold crash, finings, or waiting days after moving the fermenter before racking. I usually just leave them in the primary for 2-4 weeks, depending on style, bring them up the stairs, and rack into my bottling bucket. I guess I might just be lucky, but probably as soon as I start caring about clarity I bet I'll get beer that's as clear as mud.

 

[Golddiggie]

Using the nylon hop bags in the boil also helps reduce the trub in primary significantly. I dry hop with whole hops, and haven't had any clarity issue there. I've only dry hopped for up to a week so far, so that could be a part of maintaining the clarity there.

I still think you can get just as clear a brew without cold crashing. BUT, you'll need to make sure you give the brew time. Personally, I have zero issue giving the brew as much time as it needs to become great. It just means I'm planning batches to brew within the next two weeks that I'll be enjoying in about two (to three) months. :rockin: Brew every other weekend and you should be able to handle the longer primaries...

 

[hops2it]

Haven't tried a whirlfloc tab yet. I may try one along with some more Irish Moss next time around.

 

[nefarious_1_]

I regularly Primary for 3 - 4 weeks, so anything over 5 would be considered long for me. I never worry too much about clarity at bottling: most of the time, it's quite clear with no haze issues. If it's not, I know a little time sitting in bottles is all that's needed. After proper carb time, a little aging and a couple weeks in the fridge, I'm very pleased with the results.

 

[gannawdm]

I've brewed 39 batches so far. Clarity has been at the bottom of my concerns, but I have observed some unexpected results on that topic. My last all grain belgian wit was crystal clear - using wlp 400 (not exactly the floculating champ) and plenty of wheat and unfiltered. I didn't try to make this beer clear by any means (no cold crashing), but it looked like it was filtered, as clear as any BMC.

On the other hand, I made an all grain maris otter american (used am. hops) IPA with s-04 (flocculates like cement) and it ended up cloudy as hell.