Confused about vanilla bean

[kenpotf]

All,

I have some vanilla beans that I'll be using in a porter. I want a strong vanilla flavor out of it. I've read some people say to use 2 beans for the most part, but my recipe calls for 5.

What I don't know is this - do I scrape the stuff out of the pod and throw it into the secondary, or do I scrape the stuff out and toss it away? I've gotten mixed reviews from this. Some say throw it out and only rough up the skin, cut into bits, and throw the pod in. Others say just split it, scrape the gunk into the wort and then toss the bean pod into the wort as well....

How do I get the best flavor, and 5 seems a little excessive to me I would think... I want strong vanilla flavor, but I don't want to be completely overwhelmed by it...

Thanks!

 

[jtratcliff]

Split, scrape insides, chop the pod into smaller pieces, put it all (scraped goo and chopped bean pieces) in the fermenter.

I've used 2 or 3 beans in a couple of different recipes and not gotten over-the-top vanilla flavor or aroma.

I wouldn't hesitate to use 5 if I wanted a strong vanilla flavor.

 

[ToddB]

For my chocolate, pumpkin porter that I just kegged, I sliced the vanilla beans in half lengthwise, scraped the seeds and put everything in a small container of vodka to soak over night. This will kill off any bugs that may be lingering on the beans. Then, I just dumped everything into the secondary and racked the beer on top of it.

BTW - that porter called for 4 beans and I did not smell a strong vanilla scent. But it may have been masked by the cocoa power and pumpkin puree.

 

[Hammy71]

Yeah, two does not really do much in my experience. 5 in a porter would not scare me.

 

[kenpotf]

Yall are awesome! Thank you! 5 it is


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[unionrdr]

I brew a robust porter for Christmas with 2 beans split length-wise, scraped & chopped into a couple ounces of vodka in a sealed jar during primary fermentation. I strain it into the priming solution & add it that way. 2 beans is plenty & still taste the beer.

 

[Natdavis777]

I was planning on doing 4 in my vanilla bourbon porter. My buddy used two in his last porter, and honestly, it was lacking.

 

[unionrdr]

I'm beginning to think that with vanilla beans, like fruit/juices, it depends on when you add it? Whether in primary, secondary, or at flame out, the effects seem to differ.

 

[kenpotf]

Do you think soaking in vodka strips the beans of flavor though? What about spraying them with starsan? I've also read that some just throw them in and trust that there's enough alcohol in the fermented beer to kill anything off. When you soak in vodka, do you pour vodka and all into the secondary?

Also, I wasn't going to do a secondary, but instead I was just going to throw this into the primary when it's done fermenting. Am I risking anything doing it like this?

Thanks!


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[Peyope]

I starSan the knife and cutting board along with the outside of the beans. You probably don't need to but I have a spray bottle pre mixed and it's easy to do. I also boil the mason jar that I use to soak the beams (SO uses the jars for juicing and I want to make sure they're not going to have off flavors or go bacteria above the fill line ).

Pour the vodka in the secondary with the beans. I used 2 beans (just the insides) in a bourbon imperial stout, added to the secondary for one week (it was a last minute decision). I got a decent amount of vanilla in the nose but not much flavor. I'll try adding the outside of the beans next time as at the time I wasnt sure if that would produce off flavors. Please report back with the results!

Also no risk to adding to the primary.

 

[metanoia]

Do you think soaking in vodka strips the beans of flavor though? What about spraying them with starsan? I've also read that some just throw them in and trust that there's enough alcohol in the fermented beer to kill anything off. When you soak in vodka, do you pour vodka and all into the secondary?

Also, I wasn't going to do a secondary, but instead I was just going to throw this into the primary when it's done fermenting. Am I risking anything doing it like this?

Thanks!


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Yes, the vodka would strip the flavor from the beans, but it doesn't matter because you're throwing the vodka and beans both into your beer, so you're getting the same flavor regardless. And without vodka, there should be little to no risk of infection putting them in the fermenter after fermentation is complete.

I'm planning on using a bean next week in my gingerbread brown ale, just going to pop the lid, throw the (sliced and scrapped) bean in there, and let the beer extract the flavor. I'd probably use 2 beans if I had them, but I'm only down to 1 so it'll have to be enough. 5 seems like total over kill. You'll probably get the flavor you're looking for in a couple of days, but you will also get that same level of flavor if you let 2-3 beans sit in the fermenter for 4-5 days; these beans are extremely potent. Plus, the advantage of putting them in the fermenter (I'd advise against secondary for reasons we all know) is that you can determine exactly how much vanilla flavor you will get from the beans. Take a sample of the beer every day after adding the beans, and when it tastes just the way you'd like it, bottle or keg! Easy as pie.

 

[FiddlersGreen87]

Vanilla Extract is like 35% alcohol. The vodka soak is for two reasons, 1) to sanitize and kill anything that might be hanging out on your bean. :rockin: 2) The alcohol is what actually extracts the essence of the bean. The alcohol in your beer will accomplish this, but a higher alcohol like bourbon or vodka will as well with the added benefit of #1.

I have a bean soaking in just enough vodka to submerse it in the glass Tupperware container it's sitting in on top of my fridge. I cut it lengthwise, chopped it in half, and scrapped a little bit. The intent is to maximize surface area. When I pass by the fridge I shake the container for a couple seconds. It's been soaking since last Monday, and it'll all go in the fermenter tomorrow to soak for 3 days along with the coconut. Then I'll rack to the keg.

 

[kenpotf]

So does adding the vodka affect alcohol levels, or is it so little that you don't really worry about it?


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[Peyope]

So does adding the vodka affect alcohol levels, or is it so little that you don't really worry about it?


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Correct. Don't worry about it. I read somewhere how much alcohol was needed to make an impact, can't find it at the moment but the ~6 oz you'd be adding would have a minimal affect on your fg.

 

[chezhed]

Impact of the beans depends upon freshness I think as well as when they are added....less fresh requires more beans.

Personally I just sanitize a sharp knife and split each bean in about three pieces lengthwise and just toss them in the primary after two weeks. If I secondary, I transfer them into the secondary....and if I keg, I let them go in there as well. If I plan to bottle, I boost the bean count by one. But I'm lucky in that I can get fresh beans regularly from Veracruz.

 

[worlddivides]

I soaked 2 and a half beans in Irish whiskey for about 2-3 weeks before putting the beans and bourbon in a stout I made. The bourbon smelled very strongly of vanilla before I put it in my stout, but the final beer had ZERO vanilla taste. It did, however, have some very faint vanilla smell, but no vanilla flavor. Part of it might have to do that I also put about 6 ounces of cacao nibs soaked in vodka in and the smell of chocolate and taste of chocolate was quite noticeable (but not what I'd consider "strong").

In short, I think 5 vanilla beans would DEFINITELY not be too much.

 

[unionrdr]

You don't need to spray them with Starsan. Soaking in the vodka will do. But scraping the beans & paste from inside the beans & chopping the outside part will dissolve them better in the vodka. I swirl the jar every so often to help dissolve the paste. I got plenty of flavor out of two beans. But they were sealed in a plastic bag inside the small glass jar they came in.

 

[AlCophile]

NO! Do NOT assume vodka will sanitize anything!!! Help me here, Yooper-they never listen to me!
Alcohol must be between 60 and 80 %, as in Bacardi's 151 proof, if they still make it(?). If you use StarSan to wipe the outside of the beans, it may do the job, but, can't guarantee it.
Also, vodka is useless in a bubble-lock. Use StarSan. The tiny amount of SSan will not affect the beer. It's dilute phosphoric acid, added to sodas. I'd extract the beans in 151 proof for several hrs. and use the resulting solution. It may even be better to add after ferm'n. is over???
Btw, vanilla flavor is vanillin, ortho-methoxy benzaldehyde, a single compound, so it should be easy to follow it by nose.

 

[unionrdr]

I know, you mentioned this before. But in a sealed container, it works as the head space of the small jar I use, for example, is filled with alcohol fumes. Not exactly a welcome environment for nasties. And even cheap vodka has more alcohol in it than vanilla extract from the store. I even started using 80 proof white lightnin' (legal kind) mixed 50/50 with Starsan in my air locks to keep the Starsan from foaming out in no time during initial fermentation. Science is all well & goo, but in brewing, experience is also a good thing. Try things out for yourself & see what really works & what is claimed to work or is said shouldn't work.