BruControl: Brewery control & automation software

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Button Element - I find myself adding a statement that sets ["Button" state = false] after any 'if' statement that looks for the button to be on, otherwise it runs through subsequent 'if' statement(s) as if I pressed and held the button... I also set it false in the bootstrap program... what are the initial and one-shot properties for a button element?
 
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Not sure what you mean... this script works as expected, with 'TB1' being a button:

Code:
[start]
"TB1" State = false

[loop]
if "TB1" State == true
print "Pressed"
"TB1" State = false
endif

if "TB1" State == true
print "On my own"
endif

sleep 1000
goto loop
 
While I'm here, will throw out a teaser... We have incorporated an Element "alias" to allow you to name your Elements whatever you like. It's boringly-called 'Display Name' and defaults to the Element Name unless you change it.

In the example above, the button is named 'TB1' but will now display 'My Button'. This will allow you to change your element's displayed named without breaking your scripts. Thanks to @oakbarn for the initial request!

upload_2019-12-4_13-42-3.png


We are working on an update... we've added an SQL database to to store data and logs. Have had some hiccups with it so far, so taking more time than desired (as usual). Reliability is priority #1. Also fixed some bugs like overlapping alarm sounds, text which crashes scripts, Globals' graphs on alternate Workspaces not displaying, etc.
 
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Not sure what you mean... this script works as expected, with 'TB1' being a button:

Code:
[start]
"TB1" State = false

[loop]
if "TB1" State == true
print "Pressed"
"TB1" State = false
endif

if "TB1" State == true
print "On my own"
endif

sleep 1000
goto loop

That is what I do, I had issues without the '=false"' statements, for reasons that are now obvious, I incorrectly assumed they were pulled to false logically, unless pulled true... I thought of them as momentary contact buttons.. thank you for the clarification.
 
Check out this BruControl automated keg washer we made. It's built with a Feather Wi-Fi UniShield and runs a script to automate the full process of rinsing, heating, washing, and flushing. Portable unit just needs a water feed and 120VAC. Can be used to clean & sanitize kegs, fermenters, buckets, etc.

 
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I just moved BruContol to my new touchscreen computer. The resolution on my previous laptop was 1600x900. My new computer is 1600x900.

The screen "size" incorporated a bigger area. It had scroll bars (v&h) so I could not display the entire screen at once. The new computer has an even smaller area that is displayed without scrolling. Is there any way to change the resolution of a workspace outside of the computer resolution?

I would like to be able to use the "whole" workspace without scrolling.

If I create a new configuration, the workspace does not have scroll bars.

I read page 31 of the manual and could not see any aid there.

I also change the theme to The Bezier but that did not get rid of my scroll bars.

Basically, I do not want scroll bars
 
You have scroll bars because you have elements don't fit into the workspace. Move and resize them so they all fit and the scroll bars should go away.

Also note that the default in Windows for high res displays is to scale everything 125%. Look at your Display setting in Win10.
 
I did find one issue that solved a problem. I had my task bar docked on the side in one case and on the bottom of the other. I have everything set to 100% on all my computers as that is best for most of my apps that I use. I will move all of the Elements around.

How I sorta created this issue: I wanted to reuse the same alarm but wanted different wav files. I created a hiddenalarm that I turned on first the opened the resusable alarm. The only issue is that in order for the hidden alarm to sound WHILE the reusable alarm is active is that it the playing alarm must be on the same workspace. These hidden alarms were move off the workspace somehow. I will move them back

Suggestion: Have the Alarm wav files like the background where you have choices.

IN ADDITION: Have #4 where you can change the path with code. That way you could have infinite numbers of wav files or bac backgrounds. You are calling the path already. If #4 could be tied to a global string type (similar to trying an input Temp) or an Inspector Element variable, you could simply put the patch as the value of the Global for #4. This could work for a wav file and the backgrounds. I wish I had more choices. By allowing a path, I would never run out of choices.
 
Another request:
I have several globals and alarms that I have as Hidden Locked but use thru the scripts. Some of them are on a separate workspace that is just a holder. I find it much easier to have them on a different workspace as my "main" workspaces are filled totally with Elements. It really is a pain if I have to find an Element "hidden" below another Element. It would be really nice if a Workspace had the visibility property that worked like other things that have the visibility property. Basically it would remove it from the Tab Bar at the top if Hidden or Hidden locked.
I would like my holder workspace to disappear totally unless I want it to show. Being able to remove other Workspaces from the tab would also be nice until I needed them.

For example, I have a Second Batch workspace that I do not always use. In addition, I will eventually move my Fermentor Processes from it's BCS to BruControl. I would prefer that those workspaces to be hidden when I am Brewing on the hotside so that I don't (or one of my many brewing elves) touch the wrong widget on a screen.
 
Hi all! HBT member @Die_Beerery and researcher / contributor to low oxygen brewing methods (documented at ********************) will be hosting a web podcast with me as his guest this Thursday, 12/12/20 at 8:00 / 7:00 / 5:00 pm EST / CST / PST.

We will discuss a handful of topics centered around Brewery Automation and it’s implementation in LODO. We’ll also field questions and comments in a live chat.

I would be happy to hear about any topics you’d like us to discuss, and of course we would be honored if you would join us live!

We’ll post up a link before the podcast! In the meantime, here is his channel where the podcast will be hosted: https://www.youtube.com/user/rabeb25
 
Cool Keg washer! That might have to get added to the (endless) list of things I want to make with it.
 
Hi all! HBT member @Die_Beerery and researcher / contributor to low oxygen brewing methods (documented at ********************) will be hosting a web podcast with me as his guest this Thursday, 12/12/20 at 8:00 / 7:00 / 5:00 pm EST / CST / PST.

We will discuss a handful of topics centered around Brewery Automation and it’s implementation in LODO. We’ll also field questions and comments in a live chat.

I would be happy to hear about any topics you’d like us to discuss, and of course we would be honored if you would join us live!

We’ll post up a link before the podcast! In the meantime, here is his channel where the podcast will be hosted: https://www.youtube.com/user/rabeb25
This sounds very interesting. I would like to hear more about how to get started with making decisions about BruControl hardware implementation for people not familiar with Arduino. In particular, what are the pros and cons of the various shields you sell, what is the best use for each shield or at least some examples of how they have been used successfully. For example, why you went with the board you did for the automated keg cleaning system above.
On the low-oxygen-brewing methods side, I would be interested to know more about implementation of pH and dissolved oxygen in-line read out. Also, any comments on how significant the switch to the closed Stout system with the nitrogen or CO2 purging of tanks and lines has been in terms of final product. I'll try to tune in to the live podcast. Idea for the podcast is great.
 
This sounds very interesting. I would like to hear more about how to get started with making decisions about BruControl hardware implementation for people not familiar with Arduino. In particular, what are the pros and cons of the various shields you sell, what is the best use for each shield or at least some examples of how they have been used successfully. For example, why you went with the board you did for the automated keg cleaning system above.
On the low-oxygen-brewing methods side, I would be interested to know more about implementation of pH and dissolved oxygen in-line read out. Also, any comments on how significant the switch to the closed Stout system with the nitrogen or CO2 purging of tanks and lines has been in terms of final product. I'll try to tune in to the live podcast. Idea for the podcast is great.

I knew nothing of automation a few months ago...

I suggest following the wiring diagrams and purchasing components per the brucontrol website. Then utilize the forum for things you don’t understand.

Again, read up on the tools available at brucontrol.com. They provide diagrams, order lists and general information... once you have a grip on what your doing you can make better decisions for yourself.

Get something together to begin the project and then work your way through it. Everyone who follows is here to help with whatever they can
 
Check out this BruControl automated keg washer we made. It's built with a Feather Wi-Fi UniShield and runs a script to automate the full process of rinsing, heating, washing, and flushing. Portable unit just needs a water feed and 120VAC. Can be used to clean & sanitize kegs, fermenters, buckets, etc.


Nice. I do something similar except I have three vessels (Stations):

One for PBW (Heated) (SSBrewTech Pump and Spray Ball).
One for Rinse (source my regular Electric HLT) (Chugger Pumped off my regular setup)
One for SaniClean

I have outlets on my brew wall which I control with the software.

I just move the Keg/ Bucket/ Carboy from Station to Station on Alarm.

The Rinse just dumps the water to my garden and bees.

The Saniclean is a home depot bucket with a Sump Pump. SaniClean is room temp.

I have a Black and Grey Keg connector T ed off the spray column on all three when cleaning Kegs.

I only have a spray ball on the PBW one and the other two just have a pvc home made sprayer.
I do have a siren connected to my alarm so I can be elsewhere until ready to change (Alarm only on PBW Timer).

I am going to copy your cart idea for the PBW Station. I have a 20 g electric HLT that I could use as the vessel when cleaning that can be reused as an HLT when I brew (I use it when I need very soft water (mix of distilled and Tap) on a few of my lagers).

What pumps did you use for the spray ball?
That is nice work.
 
I knew nothing of automation a few months ago...

I suggest following the wiring diagrams and purchasing components per the brucontrol website. Then utilize the forum for things you don’t understand.

Again, read up on the tools available at brucontrol.com. They provide diagrams, order lists and general information... once you have a grip on what your doing you can make better decisions for yourself.

Get something together to begin the project and then work your way through it. Everyone who follows is here to help with whatever they can
Thanks. That is very encouraging. I appreciate your input. I have read through the manual and some of this forum. I know where I want to land, but there seem to be so many different ways to get there that I'm not sure what the first step should be. Perhaps the podcast will help make that clearer. In the meantime, thanks again.
 
I need help! I’m still fighting the sensor dip while active device is on. I’m seeing the same issue whether I use contactor or SSR. It’s not an issue of high amp draw devices either, having the issue with an LED lamp now. Also tried moving the panel 40’ away from load.

Any ideas? Perhaps because I’m in a house built in 1960’s which was originally wired 2 prong? I have 3 prong outlets but not sure a true ground is utilized.

Need help!
 
I need help! I’m still fighting the sensor dip while active device is on. I’m seeing the same issue whether I use contactor or SSR. It’s not an issue of high amp draw devices either, having the issue with an LED lamp now. Also tried moving the panel 40’ away from load.

Any ideas? Perhaps because I’m in a house built in 1960’s which was originally wired 2 prong? I have 3 prong outlets but not sure a true ground is utilized.

Need help!

Have you tried powering the Arduino with its own separate power supply and isolate it making sure no ground/- is common with he rest of the circuit?
 
I need help! I’m still fighting the sensor dip while active device is on. I’m seeing the same issue whether I use contactor or SSR. It’s not an issue of high amp draw devices either, having the issue with an LED lamp now. Also tried moving the panel 40’ away from load.

Any ideas? Perhaps because I’m in a house built in 1960’s which was originally wired 2 prong? I have 3 prong outlets but not sure a true ground is utilized.

Need help!

Sorry... don’t recall your system. Please provide details or pics or schematics.
 
Have you tried powering the Arduino with its own separate power supply and isolate it making sure no ground/- is common with he rest of the circuit?
Yea I have the Arduino powered with its own separate power supply, its a 24v to 12v stepdown. The ground ties to where all the other grounds tie, which is a central location (din mounted bus bar). The bus bar is tied to my backing plate which is tied to AC earth ground. I believe the concept here is to have a dedicated ground circuit from each device to a central point, please correct me if I'm wrong. One thing I'm confused about is why there are multiple grounds on components. I see three on the Mega, two on Salon board and two on RP3. I ensure all pins are utilized with dedicated circuit as described above. In an attempt to diagnose the issue, I've tried a single ground to each of these but that didn't resolve the issue.

Sorry... don’t recall your system. Please provide details or pics or schematics.
Below is a diagram of both Main panel and the Sub panel. The main panel is all DC components harboring the Mega, RP3, Salon Board relays and DC power supplies. The sub panel is where the AC controlled devices come into play. The signal between the two is a 12mm connector.

When I plug the sub panel into the main panel is where I see the issue. Upon connecting, the salon relay will pulse on/off at a steady pattern about every four seconds or so. I see this issue WITHOUT a load on the AC side of the sub panel. For diagnoses all I have is a 40A SSR and a 110v receptacle wired and still see the issue, again with no load (AC device disconnected entirely). This leads me to think its a wiring or DC issue.

Upon the salon relay active condition, the DC+ exits the main panel, enters subpanel goes through SSR+ then negative returns back to main panel ground.

Ive tried using various grounding terminals within the main panel, still no help.



MAIN PANEL(1).png

A_C SUBPANEL.png
 
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Yea I have the Arduino powered with its own separate power supply, its a 24v to 12v stepdown. The ground ties to where all the other grounds tie, which is a central location (din mounted bus bar). The bus bar is tied to my backing plate which is tied to AC earth ground. I believe the concept here is to have a dedicated ground circuit from each device to a central point, please correct me if I'm wrong. One thing I'm confused about is why there are multiple grounds on components. I see three on the Mega, two on Salon board and two on RP3. I ensure all pins are utilized with dedicated circuit as described above. In an attempt to diagnose the issue, I've tried a single ground to each of these but that didn't resolve the issue.

All of the GND pins on the arduino and the sensors are all common and tied together. They are so you can wire multiple devices to the board without having to stuff multiple wires into one socket.

Below is a diagram of both Main panel and the Sub panel. The main panel is all DC components harboring the Mega, RP3, Salon Board relays and DC power supplies. The sub panel is where the AC controlled devices come into play. The signal between the two is a 12mm connector.

When I plug the sub panel into the main panel is where I see the issue. Upon connecting, the salon relay will pulse on/off at a steady pattern about every four seconds or so. I see this issue WITHOUT a load on the AC side of the sub panel. For diagnoses all I have is a 40A SSR and a 110v receptacle wired and still see the issue, again with no load (AC device disconnected entirely). This leads me to think its a wiring or DC issue.

Upon the salon relay active condition, the DC+ exits the main panel, enters subpanel goes through SSR+ then negative returns back to main panel ground.

Ive tried using various grounding terminals within the main panel, still no help.

So the behavior has changed to happening with no load? Back a couple pages, it was only when you turned on the A/C Unit.
 
All of the GND pins on the arduino and the sensors are all common and tied together. They are so you can wire multiple devices to the board without having to stuff multiple wires into one socket.



So the behavior has changed to happening with no load? Back a couple pages, it was only when you turned on the A/C Unit.

This is correct, I’ve had this work fine with heat lamp, shop light and a solenoid valve. But realize as the build progresses so do the variables. I can’t say for certain this just happened over night.

When I disconnect the sub panel, everything seems to function correctly (the salon board stops pulsing) it’s odd because all the sub panel currently consists of is the SSR and a receptacle. Can you confirm the DC- from SSR should return back to DC- in the main panel?
 
Can you confirm the DC- from SSR should return back to DC- in the main panel?

I would suggest taking the direct route back to the PS's -24DC terminal from the SSR.

Your other issue sounds like a difference in potential's with respect to ground and the -DCV outputs. I would suggest with the 2 panels connected together and energised take a multi meter and connect one of your test leads to the -DCV terminal side of your 24VDC power supply and the other to your common grounding block. Measure for DC volts. You should see zero volts DC, if not you may have to supply a ground lead from said terminal to ground. You can also check your other PS's as well using this method.
The reason I mention this is that I had a similar issue with my 24VDC PS but with mine, the proportional valves were cycling with no user input. Even though I had provided a ground to the input side of the PS, there was a slight voltage rise coming off the -DC side. Once I supplied a direct ground to the terminal the issue was resolved.
If you do not already have one, provide a common ground wire linking the 2 panels together via a common ground block. Not sure if you are using painted metal control panels/boxes but ensure there is no paint around the grounding studs.
Also try not daisy chaining the grounds from the PCB's to one another and instead dedicate a separate connection to each.
 
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Do you have a picture of the physical wiring on the main panel? How are all of your DC- points tied together? You mention your earth ground is connected to the DC- paths. How is that wired physically? Do you have an updated picture of the sub panel?

Also in your diagram, is your 24DC- line tied to earth ground?
 

The video above shows the symptom I'm observing on the Salon Board relay. I decided to check the DC signal jumper cords that join the main and sub panel, I thought the overall length or possibly one of the four cords was malfunctioning. I then proceeded to use a single cord and the symptom disappeared. I plugged in my LED light and everything worked fine. I then proceeded to plug in my AC unit and the issue started again. It continues to blink even when reverting back to LED light. So the problem begins when the high amp draw is connected then persists for some time through future testing- this is in alignment with my previous posts. Not sure how this could happen, perhaps stored energy? I restarted the panel and it returned to normal.
I would suggest taking the direct route back to the PS's -24DC terminal from the SSR.

Your other issue sounds like a difference in potential's with respect to ground and the -DCV outputs. I would suggest with the 2 panels connected together and energised take a multi meter and connect one of your test leads to the -DCV terminal side of your 24VDC power supply and the other to your common grounding block. Measure for DC volts. You should see zero volts DC, if not you may have to supply a ground lead from said terminal to ground. You can also check your other PS's as well using this method.
I measure 0 volts when performing the test described above. Ive always had this terminal to ground tho. I tried using a direct route back to the PS 24DC- this didnt resolve the issue.
The reason I mention this is that I had a similar issue with my 24VDC PS but with mine, the proportional valves were cycling with no user input. Even though I had provided a ground to the input side of the PS, there was a slight voltage rise coming off the -DC side. Once I supplied a direct ground to the terminal the issue was resolved.
If you do not already have one, provide a common ground wire linking the 2 panels together via a common ground block. Not sure if you are using painted metal control panels/boxes but ensure there is no paint around the grounding studs.
Also try not daisy chaining the grounds from the PCB's to one another and instead dedicate a separate connection to each.
I am using plastic control panel with metal backing plate. The AC earth ground ties to the backing plate and all DC- circuits tie to the backing plate via DIN mounted terminal blocks. I do not have any daisy chained grounds from PCB's in fact each component has its own ground circuit to the terminal blocks.

Do you have a picture of the physical wiring on the main panel? How are all of your DC- points tied together? You mention your earth ground is connected to the DC- paths. How is that wired physically? Do you have an updated picture of the sub panel?
Check out the attached pictures. All DC- circuits together to backboard (which is attached to AC earth ground via the green wires shown bottom left). The DC- (depending on location) tie to the backing plate at either one of the three locations. You'll see two locations of DIN mount terminal blocks (yellow/green) which have continuity to DIN rail. These are used for Salon Board relay, Mega and RP-3. The third location is the 2in 8 out DIN mount terminal distribution which the DC- IN is tied to the backing plate at the same location the AC earth ground ties to the backing plate. This is used for the 24V DC- return from the SSR at subpanel.

In testing Ive tried alternative wiring utilizing a common distribution block (which also ties to AC earth ground), didnt resolve the issue.

Also in your diagram, is your 24DC- line tied to earth ground?
This is correct. All DC- whether 12V, 5V or 24V tie to a common earth ground.

Main.jpg

Main-1

Main-2.jpg

Main-2

Main-3.jpg
Main-3

Main-4.jpg
Main-4

Sub-1.jpg

Subpanel-1
 

The video above shows the symptom I'm observing on the Salon Board relay. I decided to check the DC signal jumper cords that join the main and sub panel, I thought the overall length or possibly one of the four cords was malfunctioning. I then proceeded to use a single cord and the symptom disappeared. I plugged in my LED light and everything worked fine. I then proceeded to plug in my AC unit and the issue started again. It continues to blink even when reverting back to LED light. So the problem begins when the high amp draw is connected then persists for some time through future testing- this is in alignment with my previous posts. Not sure how this could happen, perhaps stored energy? I restarted the panel and it returned to normal.

I measure 0 volts when performing the test described above. Ive always had this terminal to ground tho. I tried using a direct route back to the PS 24DC- this didnt resolve the issue.

I am using plastic control panel with metal backing plate. The AC earth ground ties to the backing plate and all DC- circuits tie to the backing plate via DIN mounted terminal blocks. I do not have any daisy chained grounds from PCB's in fact each component has its own ground circuit to the terminal blocks.


Check out the attached pictures. All DC- circuits together to backboard (which is attached to AC earth ground via the green wires shown bottom left). The DC- (depending on location) tie to the backing plate at either one of the three locations. You'll see two locations of DIN mount terminal blocks (yellow/green) which have continuity to DIN rail. These are used for Salon Board relay, Mega and RP-3. The third location is the 2in 8 out DIN mount terminal distribution which the DC- IN is tied to the backing plate at the same location the AC earth ground ties to the backing plate. This is used for the 24V DC- return from the SSR at subpanel.

In testing Ive tried alternative wiring utilizing a common distribution block (which also ties to AC earth ground), didnt resolve the issue.


This is correct. All DC- whether 12V, 5V or 24V tie to a common earth ground.

View attachment 656521
Main-1

View attachment 656522
Main-2

View attachment 656523 Main-3

View attachment 656524 Main-4

View attachment 656525
Subpanel-1



It looks like you have 2 GND wires going into the DC devices. You only need 1 wire and having 2 can cause issues. I think your problem lies with the way you have your grounding set up for your DC side.

Edit: On the Salon board there are 2 GND, one for the 24V coil power and one for the signal GND. Not sure if you need both, since all DC- are connected.
 
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It looks like you have 2 GND wires going into the DC devices. You only need 1 wire and having 2 can cause issues. I think your problem lies with the way you have your grounding set up for your DC side.

I’ll disconnect the redundant GND wires. But I’ve tried eliminating these in testing and it didn’t resolve the issue, I put them back since I wasn’t sure.

What do you suggest i reconfigure?
 
I then proceeded to use a single cord and the symptom disappeared. I plugged in my LED light and everything worked fine. I then proceeded to plug in my AC unit and the issue started again. It continues to blink even when reverting back to LED light. So the problem begins when the high amp draw is connected then persists for some time through future testing- this is in alignment with my previous posts. Not sure how this could happen, perhaps stored energy? I restarted the panel and it returned to normal.

1...Ok, different tack here going to ask a few questions, just trying to understand your power flow process, and for clarification when you refer to AC unit, you are referring to an actual "air conditioning unit? The flashing relay problem exists only when the "AC" unit is plugged in, but otherwise with nothing plugged in all is fine, correct?

2... It appears you are powering the Salon Relay Board coil...VCC from your 24VDC power distribution block. The flashing relay (I'll call it #5) is controlled by PIN/PORT# ?? from the MEGA and allows 24VDC (NO+C)to flow through 12mm connector/cable into the "Main Panel" then onto the "Auto Side" of the 3 way switch, which eventually powers the +SSR control wire.

3...The "Manual Side" of the 3 way switch is powered directly from the 24VDC power supply/distribution block which eventually powers the +SSR control wire.

4...Does the problem occur under the following conditions (1) AC unit plugged in, 3 way switch to middle "OFF" position and MEGA output turned OFF/ON(2) AC unit plugged in, 3 way switch to "Auto" position and MEGA output turned OFF/ON(3) AC unit plugged in, 3 way switch to "Manual" position and MEGA output turned OFF/ON. This may be a bit of a pain since you will probably have to shut down/or reset the MEGA each time once the error occurs to clear it.

5... What is the AMP draw with respect to "IN RUSH" current at start up and after start up "Steady State" of the AC unit.

6...Are both the Main and Sub panels sourced from the same 120VAC circuit?

7...You had mentioned in an earlier post you had an older style type wiring in the house and were uncertain as to whether or not you had a true ground. What was the outcome of this?

What I'm trying to determine, is the problem related to control via the MEGA or switching via "Manual Mode" or something inherent within the AC unit itself.
Also is the IN RUSH current caused by the AC unit causing a spike, thus knocking out or messing with the MEGA output signal to the relay board.
 
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1...Ok, different tack here going to ask a few questions, just trying to understand your power flow process, and for clarification when you refer to AC unit, you are referring to an actual "air conditioning unit? The flashing relay problem exists only when the "AC" unit is plugged in, but otherwise with nothing plugged in all is fine, correct?

2... It appears you are powering the Salon Relay Board coil...VCC from your 24VDC power distribution block. The flashing relay (I'll call it #5) is controlled by PIN/PORT# ?? from the MEGA and allows 24VDC (NO+C)to flow through 12mm connector/cable into the "Main Panel" then onto the "Auto Side" of the 3 way switch, which eventually powers the +SSR control wire.

3...The "Manual Side" of the 3 way switch is powered directly from the 24VDC power supply/distribution block which eventually powers the +SSR control wire.

4...Does the problem occur under the following conditions (1) AC unit plugged in, 3 way switch to middle "OFF" position and MEGA output turned OFF/ON(2) AC unit plugged in, 3 way switch to "Auto" position and MEGA output turned OFF/ON(3) AC unit plugged in, 3 way switch to "Manual" position and MEGA output turned OFF/ON. This may be a bit of a pain since you will probably have to shut down/or reset the MEGA each time once the error occurs to clear it.

5... What is the AMP draw with respect to "IN RUSH" current at start up and after start up "Steady State" of the AC unit.

6...Are both the Main and Sub panels sourced from the same 120VAC circuit?

7...You had mentioned in an earlier post you had an older style type wiring in the house and were uncertain as to whether or not you had a true ground. What was the outcome of this?

What I'm trying to determine, is the problem related to control via the MEGA or switching via "Manual Mode" or something inherent within the AC unit itself.
Also is the IN RUSH current caused by the AC unit causing a spike, thus knocking out or messing with the MEGA output signal to the relay board.


I missed the part about the old house wiring.

We will definitely need the answer for 7 ASAP as this is likely the source of the problem. I'm going to guess you have 3 prongs on the AC unit and 2 on the led/heat lamp?
 
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Hi all! HBT member @Die_Beerery and researcher / contributor to low oxygen brewing methods (documented at ********************) will be hosting a web podcast with me as his guest this Thursday, 12/12/20 at 8:00 / 7:00 / 5:00 pm EST / CST / PST.

We will discuss a handful of topics centered around Brewery Automation and it’s implementation in LODO. We’ll also field questions and comments in a live chat.

I would be happy to hear about any topics you’d like us to discuss, and of course we would be honored if you would join us live!

We’ll post up a link before the podcast! In the meantime, here is his channel where the podcast will be hosted: https://www.youtube.com/user/rabeb25

Looking forward to the live podcast tonight! Please jump on and share your experiences, ideas, and questions!
 
1...Ok, different tack here going to ask a few questions, just trying to understand your power flow process, and for clarification when you refer to AC unit, you are referring to an actual "air conditioning unit? The flashing relay problem exists only when the "AC" unit is plugged in, but otherwise with nothing plugged in all is fine, correct?
Yes, when I say AC i mean Air conditioning unit. The symptom begins when I use the Air conditioning unit and persists even after I disconnect it. Its almost like energy is being stored somewhere or the Salon Board is going into a certain mode. I can "reset" it by disconnecting and reconnecting the DC control jumper. I also notice the relay shut off even when I plug in the DC jumper cord. Or anytime I plug an extension cord in.

2... It appears you are powering the Salon Relay Board coil...VCC from your 24VDC power distribution block. The flashing relay (I'll call it #5) is controlled by PIN/PORT# ?? from the MEGA and allows 24VDC (NO+C)to flow through 12mm connector/cable into the "Main Panel" then onto the "Auto Side" of the 3 way switch, which eventually powers the +SSR control wire.
I am powering the Salon Relay Board VCC using 12v DC via a stepdown which pulls from 24VDC (I have the 12v coil model). The flashing relay #4 is controlled by Pin D34
D34. The contact side of the relays use 24V DC+ (NO) and flows OUT of the main panel through the 12mm connector/cable and into the SSR at sub panel. The DC- returns back to the main panel. The wiring diagrams suggest a 3 way switch Auto/Manual but these are currently taken out of the build for diagnoses. Check out the picture below to show you what I am working with. This is the sub panel, but please note Ive eliminated the excess ground wires.

Sub-1.jpg


3...The "Manual Side" of the 3 way switch is powered directly from the 24VDC power supply/distribution block which eventually powers the +SSR control wire.
Again, the switch stuff has been eliminated until I can figure out this issue.
4...Does the problem occur under the following conditions (1) AC unit plugged in, 3 way switch to middle "OFF" position and MEGA output turned OFF/ON(2) AC unit plugged in, 3 way switch to "Auto" position and MEGA output turned OFF/ON(3) AC unit plugged in, 3 way switch to "Manual" position and MEGA output turned OFF/ON. This may be a bit of a pain since you will probably have to shut down/or reset the MEGA each time once the error occurs to clear it.
Perhaps you can reiterate the conditions since I have eliminated the switches?
5... What is the AMP draw with respect to "IN RUSH" current at start up and after start up "Steady State" of the AC unit.
How do I test this?
6...Are both the Main and Sub panels sourced from the same 120VAC circuit?
To date, I have tried both. I ensured they were both sourced by the same 120VAC circuit which has correct wiring. 120V across hot and ground and 120V across neutral and hot. I see milliamps across neutral and ground.
7...You had mentioned in an earlier post you had an older style type wiring in the house and were uncertain as to whether or not you had a true ground. What was the outcome of this?

What I'm trying to determine, is the problem related to control via the MEGA or switching via "Manual Mode" or something inherent within the AC unit itself.
Also is the IN RUSH current caused by the AC unit causing a spike, thus knocking out or messing with the MEGA output signal to the relay board.
I'm looking deeper into this. I did test my shed (which controls the Air conditioner) and neutral and hot were wired wrong by previous owner. I also came across an extension cord that has been used during testing which was also reverse wired. I fixed the extension cord and am no longer using the shed circuit until I have time to fix it.

I see the same issue using a different AC unit (similar BTU). I dont think it is the IN RUSH from the AC. I'm leaning towards faulty wiring in my house or some other issue with my panel wiring.


I missed the part about the old house wiring.

We will definitely need the answer for 7 ASAP as this is likely the source of the problem. I'm going to guess you have 3 prongs on the AC unit and 2 on the led/heat lamp?
This is correct. Can we rule out the house wiring being that I ran the main and sub panel on the same circuit which is testing 120V across hot and ground and 120V across neutral and hot? I cant say for certain if another circuit is causing problems. This is quite the chore but its on the list to do. Thoughts?
 
Yes, when I say AC i mean Air conditioning unit. The symptom begins when I use the Air conditioning unit and persists even after I disconnect it. Its almost like energy is being stored somewhere or the Salon Board is going into a certain mode. I can "reset" it by disconnecting and reconnecting the DC control jumper. I also notice the relay shut off even when I plug in the DC jumper cord. Or anytime I plug an extension cord in.


I am powering the Salon Relay Board VCC using 12v DC via a stepdown which pulls from 24VDC (I have the 12v coil model). The flashing relay #4 is controlled by Pin D34
D34. The contact side of the relays use 24V DC+ (NO) and flows OUT of the main panel through the 12mm connector/cable and into the SSR at sub panel. The DC- returns back to the main panel. The wiring diagrams suggest a 3 way switch Auto/Manual but these are currently taken out of the build for diagnoses. Check out the picture below to show you what I am working with. This is the sub panel, but please note Ive eliminated the excess ground wires.

View attachment 656677


Again, the switch stuff has been eliminated until I can figure out this issue.

Perhaps you can reiterate the conditions since I have eliminated the switches?

How do I test this?

To date, I have tried both. I ensured they were both sourced by the same 120VAC circuit which has correct wiring. 120V across hot and ground and 120V across neutral and hot. I see milliamps across neutral and ground.

I'm looking deeper into this. I did test my shed (which controls the Air conditioner) and neutral and hot were wired wrong by previous owner. I also came across an extension cord that has been used during testing which was also reverse wired. I fixed the extension cord and am no longer using the shed circuit until I have time to fix it.

I see the same issue using a different AC unit (similar BTU). I dont think it is the IN RUSH from the AC. I'm leaning towards faulty wiring in my house or some other issue with my panel wiring.



This is correct. Can we rule out the house wiring being that I ran the main and sub panel on the same circuit which is testing 120V across hot and ground and 120V across neutral and hot? I cant say for certain if another circuit is causing problems. This is quite the chore but its on the list to do. Thoughts?

Is there any voltage across your neutral and ground? I assume your outlets are 3 prong, since you said your panel power on your AC Power is grounded. Are your outlets wired correctly? Meaning do you have a separate ground conductor going from your outlet to the main breaker panel? The ground and hot wire could read 120 if there is some kind of suspect wiring, like a ground to neutral jumper. Have you plugged in one of those outlet testers?

You could try to uncouple your DC circuit from your AC ground coming from your wall. Meaning, all your DC- are tied together still, but they are not tied to your earth ground coming from your AC power. If this works, then you have a problem with your house wiring I think.
 
Again, the switch stuff has been eliminated until I can figure out this issue.

Is your intent to eventually use the 3 way switch for "Manual/Auto" control?

Perhaps you can reiterate the conditions since I have eliminated the switches?

Ok 2 options come to mind here

(1) if your intent is to remove the above mentioned switch permanently, and your control voltage on the SSR is 3-32VDC then remove the relay out of the picture all together and drive the + side of the SSR with MEGA using your allocated pin D34. See if this shifts the problem to the SSR (control light blinking on/off) or corrects the issue.
(2) if your intent is to keep said switch try using one of the other relays on your Salon board temporarily moving the the wires replicating exactly as you now have wired.

How do I test this?

Either through manufacturers spec sheet or if you have access to an Amp Clamp and measure current draw on the hot wire on start up and while running. Also if you have a clamp you can measure the approximate load on the entire circuit while everything is on...panels + AC unit. I may have missed this in an earlier post but what is the rating in (AMPS) for this circuit you are connected too?

To date, I have tried both. I ensured they were both sourced by the same 120VAC circuit which has correct wiring. 120V across hot and ground and 120V across neutral and hot. I see milliamps across neutral and ground.

To clarify you have tried using 2 completely different 120VAC sources? One source for the panel(s) and another 120 AC source for the AC unit?

Is there any voltage across your neutral and ground? I assume your outlets are 3 prong, since you said your panel power on your AC Power is grounded. Are your outlets wired correctly? Meaning do you have a separate ground conductor going from your outlet to the main breaker panel? The ground and hot wire could read 120 if there is some kind of suspect wiring, like a ground to neutral jumper. Have you plugged in one of those outlet testers?

You could try to uncouple your DC circuit from your AC ground coming from your wall. Meaning, all your DC- are tied together still, but they are not tied to your earth ground coming from your AC power. If this works, then you have a problem with your house wiring I think.

I concur with this statement!!
 
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I am posting this here for anyone having problems in the future, hopefully they can find this with a search. A heads up for anyone using onewire (1wire, 1-wire) temp sensors (like the DS18B20). I was having issues with my sensors dropping and getting bad readings constantly. To solve the problem, I put decoupling capacitor across the 5V+ and GND bus for my connectors. I used a 10uF ceramic cap, and it worked so I did not try anything smaller. Typically, larger value caps are for lower frequency noise and smaller caps for for higher frequency noise. I have my onewire sensors being powered from my MEGA 5V rail.

Edit: This resolved my issue until a DC pump powered by 24V is running. The pumps have their own power supply, but the gnd is tied to my main DC gnd circuit as I need to have common reference for PWM signal to the pumps. The issue is only when the pumps are running and seems to be proportional to the amp draw of the pumps (worse signal when higher speed/amps). My MEGA is powered from a separate 12V power supply. I have diodes across the +/-. I probably need to add large caps across the motor +/- and/or the 24V power supply. But, my plan is to completely remove the 24V circuit from the rest of the system, and use a separate, dedicated MCU.

Edit 2: Just a note, I had to use a 2.2K resistor for the onewire network when using an esp8266, even though I was powering with 5V.

Also, when dealing with onewire networks, this resource is excellent, (https://www.maximintegrated.com/en/design/technical-documents/tutorials/1/148.html). Looking through the info, it seems that we are all probably using the worst possible physical network for our sensors, a star network. Having a star network, especially with different sized legs/wire lengths, causes signal problems. They also state that using a 150 Ohm resistor on the signal wire of each "leg" can help.

On a different note:
@BrunDog On the topic of onewire devices, I would like to request that instead of assigning an index value from an array that gets populated every time the system reboots, Brucontrol will store the device addresses and we assign the address the to element. This way, replacing a probe, or expanding, will not require a reshuffle. Onewire devices can just be discovered on boot, and stored. You could use a small onewire menu (like the interface menu), to discover newly plugged in devices, delete addresses, or rename them.
 
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