Beginner, trying to run before walk

[xico]

I've been reading about brewing for about a year but only started a couple months ago. I'm 7 brews in and I'd like some input on how to improve the processes of a few.

1. Gose
2. Chocolate ginger
3. All brett stout
4. Rye Bruin on tart cherry and blackberry


1. An adaptation of :
http://citybrewer.blogspot.com/search?q=gose

This beer had a great bite at the time I racked to secondary but it is muted now after its two months since brewday. I pitched Roselare which has provided a sweet aroma that doesnt meld well with the salt, which i was hoping would reinforce something more sour. I now think my choice of microbes was imprudent. But it's what I got.

The gravity is at 1.001 or less. I know I'm supposed to wait but I started reading about fruit beers and considered pineapple. I know bromelain can potentially cause issues in a beer but it denatures at 70 degrees C (156F). I was considering racking this 5 gallon batch on 4 lbs. of frozen pineapple steamed with cayenne. This could either be a fun idea or a really bad one.

My thinking with pineapple is that the acid will add some bite, and any residual aromas and perhaps flavors are compatible with a bit of heat and salt. I've been hoping to get much more sour a flavor but I also know that with slow brews interference may do more harm than good. I'd appreciate any warnings.

2. Another disappointment in flavor thus far. The mouthfeel is thin and at time of racking to secondary i got very little flavor from it despite the 2 cups of cocoa powder that went into the boil. It's now on 10 oz. of juicy skinned and chopped ginger root, 4 oz. cacao nibs, 2 cinnamon sticks, a vanilla bean. All but the ginger were soaked in bourbon for only a number of hours for sanitary purposes. (That bourbon is now soaking my oak chips)

3. This is my favorite thus far. I adapted the recipe from this homebrewer:
http://citybrewer.blogspot.com/2009/05/tasting-100-brett-l-stout.html

Fantastic stuff! I built up the Wyeast 5526 several times until I had a thick and frothy 2L starter (about 8 days at 82F) The starter smelled heavy on the bacteria (something out of my kefir cultures or fermented veggies) and now the airlocks are pumping out cherries, as has been noted by many others before. I mini-mashed this as I'm still on extract equipment. I used 6 row (3 lbs for 2lbs unmalted grains with 8 quarts of water).

113F protein rest (15 min), 120F beta glucan (20 min), 140 (30 min), then 155 (20), then 165 (30 min) with specialty grains. The flaked grains looked indiscernible. When I emptied the grain bag of adjuncts I thought I was emptying the 6 row.

Now there is a lot of material that settled out in my carboy. The fermentation has taken off but I'm assuming a lot of this is unconverted starch, is that correct? There is only an oz. of hops and it's only been two days since the brew and can't be dropped yeast and proteins. Is there a concern? What didn't work if indeed I left a lot of starches behind?

4. A variation I pulled from:
http://www.themadfermentationist.com/2014/11/extract-sour-stout-on-blackberries-and.html

I hit the right gravity and attenuation went well despite having to revive a free pack of Oud Bruin Wyeast 3209 (sacc with lacto). We just racked to secondary and the flavor is completely bland. We added 2.5 lbs of blackberries and 24 fluid ounces of tart cherry juice. I'm tempted to throw some brett in but I want to give the lacto a chance to show what it can do. I've read conflicting information about lacto. Some people insist that lacto is gone from aged beers and others that say they don't come out until a year or more down the road. Should I simply wait on this or throw in some more critters? Should I add more fruit?

With fruit and juice the gravity went up to 1.010 from 1.008. The airlock is bubbling a couple times a minute. Also, I used a fine mesh bag for the berries as I've heard of problems with pulp clogging the piping. It's really fine mesh, will this inhibit access for the critters? The fruit was frozen, thawed, and crushed within the bag.

--
I recognize that a lot of what I'm doing is intermediary brewing and I'm just a beginner. I know I haven't given details but I have notes and could provide information if needed. If some of these brews sound like things that you've done before, I'd appreciate getting your input.

 

[Pappers_]

2. Another disappointment in flavor thus far. The mouthfeel is thin and at time of racking to secondary i got very little flavor from it despite the 2 cups of cocoa powder that went into the boil. It's now on 10 oz. of juicy skinned and chopped ginger root, 4 oz. cacao nibs, 2 cinnamon sticks, a vanilla bean. All but the ginger were soaked in bourbon for only a number of hours for sanitary purposes. (That bourbon is now soaking my oak chips)

First, I wouldn't be too worried about anything until the beer is finished - secondaried (in this beer's case), packaged, carbed and chilled. Honestly, its very difficult to make assessments mid-way and I think new brewers get needlessly worked up by their lack of patience.

For example, the coco powder added to the boil is going to give little chocolate flavor compared to the cacao nibs you are using in secondary. Those will lend significant chocolate-y flavors.

As for the mouthfeel, carbonation changes our perception of mouthfeel a lot. That being said, what is the base-style of the beer? If its a stout, there is a wide range of mouthfeels within stout styles - not all stouts are intended to be big or heavy mouthfeels. Using a recipe for a bigger stout, or maybe even a robust porter, might give you something you'd enjoy.

Cheers and congratulations on your first batches!

 

[mrdail87]

2. Another disappointment in flavor thus far. The mouthfeel is thin and at time of racking to secondary i got very little flavor from it despite the 2 cups of cocoa powder that went into the boil. It's now on 10 oz. of juicy skinned and chopped ginger root, 4 oz. cacao nibs, 2 cinnamon sticks, a vanilla bean. All but the ginger were soaked in bourbon for only a number of hours for sanitary purposes. (That bourbon is now soaking my oak chips)

First, I'd agree with above, you won't really know until it's fully conditioned.

Also, what specialty ingredients you add isn't nearly as important as what malts, hops, and yeast use (and in what quantities). Along with other things like mash temp/time, fermentation temp, etc. These will always be your most important factors to flavor and mouthfeel. If your base isn't strong on it's own, speciality ingredients won't help it.

This is really the only beer I can give advice on unfortunately as I don't brew the other varieties you listed.

 

[xico]

Thanks for the responses, here is the list of ingredients:

1.5# Chocolate malt 350 L
1# Black malt 500 L
.5# Caramel 20L
.5# Caramel 10L
3.3# Dark LME
1# Golden Light DME

Fuggle hops, 1.5 oz 60 mins, .5 at 15 min

2Tbs unsweetened cocoa powder 20 mins
4 Chipotle peppers soaked at 15 mins
4 cinnamon sticks 10 mins
1.5 cups maple syrup flame out
1.5 cups cranberry blossom honey flame out

1 whirlfloc tablet at 15 mins
Nottingham Dry Ale Yeast (made into a 1.5 L starter on stir plate 24 hours before pitching)

OG 1.045
Fermented at stable 68-71 F
Brewed 1/17
Stable gravity at 1.010 from 1/26, 1/28 and 1/30
1/30 racked to secondary.



It's good to know that more will come from the additions and when the brew is fully conditioned. I was so happy with the saisons and IPA I made but these others above take so long that I'm afraid to make the newbie mistake of tinkering with that which should be left alone.

 

[Pappers_]

@xico Wow that's a lot going on in that beer! Very fun.

With an OG of 1.045, its going to be a light-ish beer and you might consider doing a little bigger beer if you are adding all these flavors to it. More background to support the flavors.

That being said, this looks like a really interesting experiment - let us know how it turns out!

 

[Damoxemus]

Thanks for the responses, here is the list of ingredients:

1.5# Chocolate malt 350 L
1# Black malt 500 L
.5# Caramel 20L
.5# Caramel 10L
3.3# Dark LME
1# Golden Light DME

Fuggle hops, 1.5 oz 60 mins, .5 at 15 min

2Tbs unsweetened cocoa powder 20 mins
4 Chipotle peppers soaked at 15 mins
4 cinnamon sticks 10 mins
1.5 cups maple syrup flame out
1.5 cups cranberry blossom honey flame out

1 whirlfloc tablet at 15 mins
Nottingham Dry Ale Yeast (made into a 1.5 L starter on stir plate 24 hours before pitching)

OG 1.045
Fermented at stable 68-71 F
Brewed 1/17
Stable gravity at 1.010 from 1/26, 1/28 and 1/30
1/30 racked to secondary.



It's good to know that more will come from the additions and when the brew is fully conditioned. I was so happy with the saisons and IPA I made but these others above take so long that I'm afraid to make the newbie mistake of tinkering with that which should be left alone.

You don't need to make a starter with dry yeast. In fact, that can actually mess it up, iirc.

With a gravity of 1.045 just rehydrate the yeast and you're good to go.

 

[progmac]

I read your list of four beers and to me they all sounded like bad ideas except for the third one, the brett stout. I read your reviews and your taste buds seem to agree.

There is an unlimited universe of beers that can be made. I think the universe of beers worth making is much smaller.

 

[Calder]

I don't want to discourage you, but how about making some decent beer before adding all these strange ingredients.

Many ingredients do not taste the same in beer as you might imagine them, and can often lead to dissapointing beers.

When I started, I wanted to make lots of fancy beers (tame by what you are trying to do), and often ended up with 5 gallons of dissapointing beer, that I had to drink. Decent IPAs, Stouts, Belgians, etc, offer a wide world of different flavors out there to be discovered,

 

[mrdail87]

Thanks for the responses, here is the list of ingredients:

1.5# Chocolate malt 350 L
1# Black malt 500 L
.5# Caramel 20L
.5# Caramel 10L
3.3# Dark LME
1# Golden Light DME

Fuggle hops, 1.5 oz 60 mins, .5 at 15 min

2Tbs unsweetened cocoa powder 20 mins
4 Chipotle peppers soaked at 15 mins
4 cinnamon sticks 10 mins
1.5 cups maple syrup flame out
1.5 cups cranberry blossom honey flame out

1 whirlfloc tablet at 15 mins
Nottingham Dry Ale Yeast (made into a 1.5 L starter on stir plate 24 hours before pitching)

OG 1.045
Fermented at stable 68-71 F
Brewed 1/17
Stable gravity at 1.010 from 1/26, 1/28 and 1/30
1/30 racked to secondary.



It's good to know that more will come from the additions and when the brew is fully conditioned. I was so happy with the saisons and IPA I made but these others above take so long that I'm afraid to make the newbie mistake of tinkering with that which should be left alone.

I'm afraid what you have here is specialty grain overload. Especially with those roasted grains (chocolate malt and black malt). 2.5 lbs of roasted grains is a lot, even for a stout, and even some imperial stouts. The Dark LME has some roasted grains in there too, so this is probably getting close to 3 lbs of roasted grains.

I remember having the same reaction when making my first recipes. While all of these ingredients sound delicious (and they are), you'll find a little goes a long way with some of them.

I'm afraid those other ingredients are likely going to be masked significantly by your specialty grains. I know it's hard to hold back when you first start out, but trust me, you'd be surprised how good of a beer you can make using rather simple recipes. And it makes for a good leaning experience.

I learned a good rule of thumb when I first started making recipes: Use a max of 4 varieties, and max of 2 lbs, of specialty grains. Honestly, most of my beers still fall within this range today, but it helped keep me from going over board when I first started out.

 

[xico]

I don't want to discourage you, but how about making some decent beer before adding all these strange ingredients.

Many ingredients do not taste the same in beer as you might imagine them, and can often lead to dissapointing beers.

When I started, I wanted to make lots of fancy beers (tame by what you are trying to do), and often ended up with 5 gallons of dissapointing beer, that I had to drink. Decent IPAs, Stouts, Belgians, etc, offer a wide world of different flavors out there to be discovered,

Good points and constructive, I've also made two saisons and IPAs as well, which I didn't post anything because they are just what you're mentioning: simple nice brews that aren't that experimental.

So, yes, I am also brewing "clean" beers. But, I have been getting into brewing to make things that I may not have tasted before. Agreed, that doesn't mean it will be a good result but I've learned from every mistake and this wide world of flavors and varieties you've mentioned are only what they are because people started messing with ingredients and processes--they are the results of long chains of mistakes.

I may be a novice brewer but I'm a long-time tinkerer and that's not going to change for beer making.

 

[xico]

I'm afraid what you have here is specialty grain overload. Especially with those roasted grains (chocolate malt and black malt). 2.5 lbs of roasted grains is a lot, even for a stout, and even some imperial stouts. The Dark LME has some roasted grains in there too, so this is probably getting close to 3 lbs of roasted grains.

I remember having the same reaction when making my first recipes. While all of these ingredients sound delicious (and they are), you'll find a little goes a long way with some of them.

I'm afraid those other ingredients are likely going to be masked significantly by your specialty grains. I know it's hard to hold back when you first start out, but trust me, you'd be surprised how good of a beer you can make using rather simple recipes. And it makes for a good leaning experience.

I learned a good rule of thumb when I first started making recipes: Use a max of 4 varieties, and max of 2 lbs, of specialty grains. Honestly, most of my beers still fall within this range today, but it helped keep me from going over board when I first started out.

Yeah, this recipe came from my local homebrew shop and i made it with the hope of gifting it though I'll be looking for a more suitable option in case after conditioning it's disappointing.

The gravity was light as well due to beginner's mistakes I've since learned from. It took a handful of times and now I seem to be able to control the gravity better.

 

[xico]

You don't need to make a starter with dry yeast. In fact, that can actually mess it up, iirc.

With a gravity of 1.045 just rehydrate the yeast and you're good to go.

That wasn't the gravity I had hoped for, and besides, I had just built my stir plate, you gotta try your new stir plate...

 

[fuelish]

There is an unlimited universe of beers that can be made. I think the universe of beers worth making is much smaller.

Amen

 

[mrdail87]

Yeah, this recipe came from my local homebrew shop and i made it with the hope of gifting it though I'll be looking for a more suitable option in case after conditioning it's disappointing.

The gravity was light as well due to beginner's mistakes I've since learned from. It took a handful of times and now I seem to be able to control the gravity better.

Yeah, if the OG were more along the lines of an imperial stout, it would probably still be strong, but not overpowering. I might still recommend scaling the specialty grains back slightly if you want those extra special ingredients to come through.

And I hate to harp on the recipe, but there an awful lot of special ingredients here too.

The way I've always explained this to newer brewers is to think of brewing like cooking. Think of specialty grains, special ingredients, and hops as spices. If you keep adding spices to a dish, even in small quantities, your flavors become muddled, and no single one gets to stand out or be noticed. Likewise, it's just as easy to add too much of a spice and overpower your palette.

It's all part of the learning curve, and I'd be lying if I said I hadn't done it myself.

 

[xico]

Thanks those suggestions are all very helpful and constructive.

 

[xico]

A follow-up for whoever may be interested:

1. Gose on the pineapple is, just delicious! The salt has taken a background to a barnyard funk on the tongue with tropical fruit aromas. I didn't think I could make something like this before and I'm more motivated now then ever before!

A question regarding bottling. When I racked the beer on the fruit the gravity was at about 1.001 and now it has stayed at 1.008. Is there a way to make sure the yeasts are ready for priming sugar? I ask because there isn't much information I've come across with pineapple. I knew to denature enzyme but I'm curious, should I be expecting a drop to 1.001-1.005?

Does it make sense to pitch more yeast at bottling?

2. Brett stout, still going and will be left alone at least another month.
3. Rye bruin finally has a lot of sourness to it after two noticeable periods of CO2 production since it was put on the fruit. It's not particularly exciting but it's definitely got potential.
4. chocolate stout, probably a lost cause, no flavor is being imparted as yet. but it will get me drunk.

5. brett berliner weisse - my first time sour worting and man will i be doing that again! i made a starter of wort with a cup of base malt and left it by the radiator for 5 days, with minimal headspace to ensure i'd be pitching the bugs i want. i let the 5 gallons ferment 4 days to taste, then i pasteurized while making an additional 1.5 gallons of wort boiled with hops and added the two into the bucket.

I stepped up a starter from three bottles of st. bretta from crooked stave and decided to use it based on the original beer's flavor profile, the starter's taste and smell, and because i have no idea how it'll turn out (which is still exciting).

I've heard what most have said thus far about how most beers shouldnt be made, and how these sound like bad ideas, but i'm inclined to disagree. we're all entitled to our opinions, but the benefits to exploration come with a very acceptable amount of risks if done correctly.

I guess I'll continue posting if there is some interest shown. Photos were lost on account of a few cars driving over my phone when it fell out of my pocket crossing a highway.

 

[paperairplane]

Your stout finished way too dry. Probably because of the honey and maple syrup. The amount of chocolate malt probably pushes it to the front of the flavor list. All the adjuncts probably muddled the flavors a little.

You can make really good, complex stout with nothing but 2 row, flake barley and black malt. One bittering addition. Yeast and water. 6 total ingredients.

Certainly some ambitious endeavors here... More simple beers may not be as inspiring on paper, but beers with only 1 malt and a couple hops, or a few simple malts teaches a lot about what each ingredient brings to a beer.

Keep tinkering and have fun - it's your beer. I would maybe limit some ingredients and process so that it is easier to refine what is working and what isn't.

 

[lazarwolf]

Good points and constructive, I've also made two saisons and IPAs as well, which I didn't post anything because they are just what you're mentioning: simple nice brews that aren't that experimental.

So, yes, I am also brewing "clean" beers. But, I have been getting into brewing to make things that I may not have tasted before. Agreed, that doesn't mean it will be a good result but I've learned from every mistake and this wide world of flavors and varieties you've mentioned are only what they are because people started messing with ingredients and processes--they are the results of long chains of mistakes.

I may be a novice brewer but I'm a long-time tinkerer and that's not going to change for beer making.

I think the idea of making more basic beers for a while before you experiment is a good one. Not because you shouldn't experiment, but rather, because brewing classic style beers allows you to perfect and home in your process. In your post I see allot of information about ingredients, and not allot about process. The great brewers I know talk more about process and sanitation than ingredients. You mentioned peppers in a beer, we're they waxed? We're they organic? What was the capsicum level? That can all produce weird flavors. Now as for the Brett, I'm all for it. To me is just another kind of yeast. Keep on bretting. A starter out of dry? Dry yeast has the yeast nutrients in the package, you used then up on a 2ltr starter. Did you add more? Did you get enough of in to support that amount? What was the mash temp? What sparge process? What is your best brew day sanitation regiment?
That's why you brew the basics for a while. Also, IMHO one little experiment at a time helps you learn more. You learn exactly what a certain ingredient does in a certain wort within a certain mash. That's how great beers are born. Sam c. Didn't brew raison in one batch. It was literally dozens. Russian River took years to develop Pliny. I love the enthusiasm, but does the world really need a chocolate pineapple ghost pepper continually wet hopped bier bierre DE garde on nitro?

So keep on tinkering, just do it one tinker at a time, while following processed proven by centuries of brewers. Maybe, you'll be the next great brewer. Sounds like you have a great head for flavor combinations.

 

[paperairplane]

,,, does the world really need a chocolate pineapple ghost pepper continually wet hopped bier bierre DE garde on nitro?....

Well, there's Rogue's next beer...

 

[lazarwolf]

If I could like that again I would. Woke up swmbo, laughing.

One other comment, most experiments that move brewing forward are based on a needed improvement. Something was lacking, although process were good. So brewers started trying to solve a problem with what they had available.

 

[Pappers_]

A follow-up for whoever may be interested:

1. Gose on the pineapple is, just delicious! The salt has taken a background to a barnyard funk on the tongue with tropical fruit aromas. I didn't think I could make something like this before and I'm more motivated now then ever before!

A question regarding bottling. When I racked the beer on the fruit the gravity was at about 1.001 and now it has stayed at 1.008. Is there a way to make sure the yeasts are ready for priming sugar? I ask because there isn't much information I've come across with pineapple. I knew to denature enzyme but I'm curious, should I be expecting a drop to 1.001-1.005?

Does it make sense to pitch more yeast at bottling?

Congratulations on the pineapple Gose, sounds interesting.

I'm not sure that I'm clear on your bottling question. I think you are saying that your process was that you had primary fermentation, then when fermentation was done, you racked the beer onto pineapple and it started a secondary fermentation, when the yeast began to eat up the fruit sugars. Is that correct?

In any case, you need to wait to bottle until fermentation activity has stopped. If you're not sure, wait a little longer. If fermentation isn't done, if it continues after you bottle, the bottles may burst - no bueno.

To be absolutely sure that the yeast are done, that you are ready to prime and bottle, you can take two or three gravity readings a few days apart. If there is no change, you're good to go.

I usually pitch more yeast if I'm dealing with a high alcohol beer - the alcohol will make the yeast slow and lazy, so putting in some new troops helps. Most beers don't require that, though.

Have you bottled before or is this your first time?

 

[xico]

I have bottled before but only sacch brews and this will be my first brett. The pineapple was actually put into a tertiary ( i didn't want to stuff the pineapple through a carboy hole so I moved it back to a bucket.

My concern is that the brew pre-fruit was at 1.001-2 and now it's stable at 1.008. There was no visible sign of CO2 production on the fruit, a notable difference to my blackberry/cherry rye which furiously bubbled a couple days into the re-rack.

I'm wondering if I should maybe throw some more yeast into the fermentor and see if it's stuck. As you mentioned, I'd rather know I'm at a final gravity before adding priming sugar and bottling. I've received shrapnel from exploding bottles before and I'd like to avoid a recurrence if I can help it (one piece was not 2 cm from my eye and gave my cheek a deep slice).

I appreciate the input!

 

[Hoppity]

The pineapple was actually put into a tertiary ( i didn't want to stuff the pineapple through a carboy hole so I moved it back to a bucket.

My concern is that the brew pre-fruit was at 1.001-2 and now it's stable at 1.008. There was no visible sign of CO2 production on the fruit, a notable difference to my blackberry/cherry rye which furiously bubbled a couple days into the re-rack.

Oxidation alert: when you went back to bucket, did you lay down a blanket of CO2?

 

[xico]

I think the idea of making more basic beers for a while before you experiment is a good one. Not because you shouldn't experiment, but rather, because brewing classic style beers allows you to perfect and home in your process. In your post I see allot of information about ingredients, and not allot about process. The great brewers I know talk more about process and sanitation than ingredients.

All good points and have been noted. Process is arrived at for each person differently. For two years prior to brewing I helped friends in their endeavors and read enthusiastically. So my eagerness to experiment is largely fueled by having been thinking about brewing far longer than actually being able to do it.

All this said, these are the beers that I'm sharing that aren't more conventional. I haven't mentioned my IPAs, saisons, and pale ales I drink and share regularly as these are less a mystery for me. The ones I've mentioned in this thread are ones I don't know what to make of.

As far as process, I'm limited. If I had an all-grain set-up this would be more central to the experience but I'm limited to mini-mashing 6 and 2 row with flaked grains to add a little more to the otherwise limitations of extract. Of late, it's been as follows:

113-115 for 12-15 mins
125 for 10
140 for 20 mins
145 for 25 mins
148-150 for 15
155 for 15
then 165 with specials with the usual 30 minute infusion.

The chocolate stout (the one I'm least interested in as it was to be for a gift, i drink only a handful of stouts a year) seems to have invoked the most criticism.

To answer the ingredient questions, no, the peppers were not waxed but were grown organically by my uncle and dried in the field they were picked. Aside from the waxes many dried veggies and fruits are sulfured which is also something to be avoided.

Thanks again for your thoughts.

 

[xico]

Oxidation alert: when you went back to bucket, did you lay down a blanket of CO2?

Nope, I know buddy that's an issue. I was working with what I had and I have no cartridges. Sub-optimal, but then again, so is everything I'm doing at this point.

 

[Calder]

My concern is that the brew pre-fruit was at 1.001-2 and now it's stable at 1.008. There was no visible sign of CO2 production on the fruit, a notable difference to my blackberry/cherry rye which furiously bubbled a couple days into the re-rack.

When adding fruit, and racking, you really don't have to worry about oxidation. Good transfer practices to minimize O2 in the beer is all you need. The start of re-fermentation will scrub some O2 from the beer and also provide a CO2 blanket. ..... I think someone is overly paranoid.

My concern with your beer is that the gravity went up. Yes, adding sugars will increase the gravity, but most (it not all) fruit sugars are 100% fermentable; meaning the FG after fermentation will be the same or lower than pre-addition of fruit. Something is wrong! I'm not reading the whole thread to see what happened, but what was the OG, and what yeast; the only thing I can think of is, that you may have reached the abv limit of the yeast.

 

[xico]

Gravity prior to fruit was 1.001-1.002, using the Rosalare yeast blend from Wyeast. This discrepancy has made me wonder as well. I pitched a 25-30 mL slurry of white labs brett brux to see if I can get some more activity going.

 

[xico]

Just a quick follow-up.

The gose turned out really pleasant but not without its problems. The carbonation process has been slow but is improving every couple weeks. The flavors come in exactly as I had hoped. Horse blanket up front, to pineapple, to salt, to a mild nip of cayenne on the throat. I'm happy I experimented and will definitely return to improve the recipe.

The bruin's lacto has made its presence known and work well with the malic acid from the berries and tart cherry juice. The rye is heady on the nose and thankfully plays a minor role on the tongue. It is ready to bottle once I find enough glass.

Brett stout is bottled and delicious flat already. The b. lambicus throws a lot of fruit out there and more funk than I had expected. I can't wait to open and start the tasting!

The sour worted all brett wheat I made is the best I've done to date. It's the first one I could say I'm proud of and eager to share! It should get down to bottling gravity in a few more weeks.

Witbier made today. Spices included are coriander, chamomile, ginger, and fresh grapefruit zest. 6 gallons are to be clean, the remaining 2.5 gallons will be racked onto the yeast cake of the all-brett stout.