What about just bumping up a batch's recipe by a gallon or so and using that extra wort for starters? 2 birds 1 stone kinda thing.
Anyone ever use Fast Pitch canned wort for starters?
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What about just bumping up a batch's recipe by a gallon or so and using that extra wort for starters? 2 birds 1 stone kinda thing.
Yea, I've thought about that too. Or just pulling off a 1500mL for a real wort starter just to pitch it back into the wort the next day. I guess you would have to be comfortable enough with your process to leave the wort for 12 hours before pitching your yeast. I've read thats what some no chill folks do. While their wort is cooling in a container, they make a starter and the starter is ready to go in about the same time as it takes the wort to cool down.
douglasbarbin
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I do this sometimes, although I dilute and boil the starter wort separately so it isn't hopped.
I thought I'd add my small experience. I picked up a 4-pack last week from NB. I did a small 1L starter on some WLP644 that I had laying around. Definitely the easiest starter I've ever done and I'm happy so far. It cost me $2.50 to make my starter and saved me more than that in time. I think if large starters or multiple steps are required, then this product might not be the best option, but for a 1L or 2L starter there is a good market for this.
People voiced concerns over adding unboiled water to the canned wort on their website.
The response was that if the water is safe to drink it's safe for making a starter from...
Uh, ok, so why not just mix some dry DME into a flask and call it a day? So much cheaper!
The response was that if the water is safe to drink it's safe for making a starter from...
Uh, ok, so why not just mix some dry DME into a flask and call it a day? So much cheaper!
BrewerBrad82
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I see it as the exact same thing as doing a partial boil extract batch and then topping up with cold water. People do that all the time, Adding water to the concentrated Fast Pitch is no different in my mind.
douglasbarbin
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I agree. Meaning, it is bad practice to do either of those things.
You referring to just tap water or any water that's not previously boiled?
douglasbarbin
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Tap water. Distilled, bottled, or RO should be fine.
bobbytuck
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I've made three starters now with fast pitch. Used regular tap, sanitized yeast pack, tops of starters, flask, stir bar.
Just sampled the first one I pitched a week ago. Didn't decant -- just poured entire flask in fermenter. No issues -- no infection. Quick start, fast finish.
Really happy.
Just sampled the first one I pitched a week ago. Didn't decant -- just poured entire flask in fermenter. No issues -- no infection. Quick start, fast finish.
Really happy.
Have used these 3 times thus far and have had horrible attenuation every time. Thought these would be a time saver over making starters with DME, and while they were, it's not worth the cost of stuck fermentations. There are plenty of positive reviews on NB, so maybe variables have changed in my brewing process concurrently to using Fast Pitch unbeknownst to me, but this has crippled my last 3 batches and using Fast Pitch as my starter is the only thing that has changed in the process that I know of.
Needless to say, I won't be using them again and do not recommend them.
Needless to say, I won't be using them again and do not recommend them.
BrandonS
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I got a couple cans for free that I haven't used yet. Adding tap water to the process is the deal breaker for me. Why would I want to start off with less than ideal sanitation so early in the process, especially if I want to overbuild. As others mentioned, I might as well just use Malta or some apple juice.
The part that bugs me is I rated it low on NB for this reason and it seems my review was filtered and I was given a 10% off code instead. It has made the decision easy for me to purchase a pressure canner. I will add DME to water like you say, then pressure can it for the piece of mind.
parrothead64
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I got a couple for free so I used them and it was fine I don't know if I would buy them that was not that big a deal to use DME
parrothead64
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I might use them again if I needed to step up a starter
While I also use apple juice (hard cider as a byproduct of brewing is A-OK with me) - I just want to point out to people that this bit about tap water being a beer contaminant is typically unfounded. Municipal tap water contains basically nothing living besides a tiny bit of caulobacter, (even then the caulobacter is probably living on the tap outlet rather than pipes, though that's a guess) which aren't going to compete with yeast. I say this as a person who used to do the whole "streak tap water on LB/YPD" demo in college microbio labs for students. Maybe your location isn't up to standard, but federal regulations have no tolerance for fecal coliform contamination, really low HPC counts, and wild yeast/lacto/pedio aren't hanging out in your water pipes.
I've done this, usually by accident. Slight oversparge leads to wort that won't fit into fermenter, or if it does then the batch won't fit the keg. Bottle it up and freeze it.
Finally someone said this! This was my exact train of thought as soon as I read a couple lines into the thread. I do this all the time and have yet to be burned by it.
Something else that people don't seem to be catching is that for some reason there are folks out there who are pitching multiple liquid yeast packs per batch. These seem like a good option for those folks, since $2.50 for a jar / can of wort for a starter is cheaper than another yeast pack.
FreddyMar3
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On the plus side, it's just a matter of time until competitor products come out at a better price. So in that sense, happy to see that something like this is on the market.
Exactly! Until this method fails me I see absolutely no reason to change it.
I bought 4 cans in early December and used 2 last month and 2 this week. It's great that it's fast and I can't even complain about the cost. I wouldn't mind having these on hand when things got busy but I have no problem mixing, boiling, cooling and spinning.
FWIW, the first one I did was fine. Starter was fine, beer was fine but it's darker than what I usually make.
I say it's not a bad idea, there's a niche for it but it's not something I'm going to be doing regularly.
FWIW, the first one I did was fine. Starter was fine, beer was fine but it's darker than what I usually make.
I say it's not a bad idea, there's a niche for it but it's not something I'm going to be doing regularly.
I've used it a couple of times and I have to say that with 3 year old and 6 week old boys at home, the time savings is worth it for me. Had results at least as good as using DME starters. No mess in the kitchen, I swear I can't use DME without a couple of poofs coming out of the bag and onto counter tops and glass top stove. If I'm ordering from NB and committed to the shipping cost, I'll tack on a 4 pack again.
I've used it, and it was fine. Time savings didn't seem all that great, and the cost is so much higher. My new method for starters is to basically drop the DME, water, stir bar and 2 drops of Fermcap into my flask, put the porous stopper in the top of the flask, then boil. Super easy, no boilovers, and everything is sanitized in one shot with basically 10 minutes of work. Do that in the AM, pitch in the PM after it's cooled. Easy!
I think what he's saying is that his process for making starters (Which he described) doesn't save him that much time over using a Fast Pitch.
I want to update my previous comments - I have been having slow fermentations even after going back to traditional starters using DME, so I retract my comments about having bad luck with the fast pitch starters - it appears my problems lie elsewhere
FreddyMar3
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I want to update my previous comments - I have been having slow fermentations even after going back to traditional starters using DME, so I retract my comments about having bad luck with the fast pitch starters - it appears my problems lie elsewhere
What's your starter process look like?
I also bought a 4 pack of these in December or January. I've always used DME, but the convenience of these has won me over. yes, it's an extra 2 bucks or so for each can, but I'll gladly pay two bucks. I used to keep extra liquid yeast around just in case I forgot to get the starter going, so the cost difference is a little less for me.
MaryB
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I see nothing in the fast pitch that would affect attenuation... are you using saved yeast or fresh? Temp control changed? Is the starter showing good signs of activity and active fermentation? Water source you added to the Fast Pitch? Lot of unanswered questions...
MaryB
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I picked up 8 cans. Using the third one tomorrow(just added the yeast so it can sit and ferment overnight). This time of year I have lawn mowing, garden weeding, berry picking/jam making/freezing/wine making, garden produce to blanch and freeze or dehydrate, hot weather that slows me down on top of it. Plus I am disabled and if this keeps me from having to stand over the stove in summer to make a starter I am all for it! Next fall I might get some 2 row and make a 5 gallon batch of starter wort to pressure can in pints. My pressure canner can handle 20+ pints at a time(did I mention I can garden produce too?) so I can make a bunch in cooler weather. I just pressure canned 22 pints of chicken meat and stock for quick meals(pressure canner is the Amish microwave! heat and eat later on!) also. So once I get cooler weather I can do a batch just for a starter but this time of year I do not have the time to mess with it, an extra $2 I can handle!
Northern Brewer has a promo going for 20% off on select items plus a free 4pk of Fast Pitch. I wanted another big mouth bubbler, so since those were part of the promo, I have a 4pk of Fast Pitch coming.
Looking forward to see if it's as easy as it sounds. On the flip side, this thread is making rethink how I do my starters. The 6qt pressure cooker that was linked is now $25 from Amazon. Then there's the apple juice wort substitution too.
My three pound bag of DME is almost exhausted, so the Fast Pitch should buy me some time until I get more if I don't go the other routes mentioned in this thread.
Looking forward to see if it's as easy as it sounds. On the flip side, this thread is making rethink how I do my starters. The 6qt pressure cooker that was linked is now $25 from Amazon. Then there's the apple juice wort substitution too.
My three pound bag of DME is almost exhausted, so the Fast Pitch should buy me some time until I get more if I don't go the other routes mentioned in this thread.
Ive been using fast pitch for a while. i can have my starter going on my stirplate in under 5 mins with no boiling of anything and its been making pretty healthy starters consistently. the only thing i dont like is if i want to make a 500ml starter, its not an option. its 1L or nothin.
I am one who has not tried the Fast Pitch. I bought a pressure canner at a yard sale for $5. Bought a new gasket set online for $10. About $3.50 worth of 2 row gets me about 2 Gallons of starter wort. That beats the crap out of using DME.
I have also read that the cheap pressure cookers are not right for canning. They don't give the proper amount of pressure to be totally safe. But I don't know if that info is current.
I have also read that the cheap pressure cookers are not right for canning. They don't give the proper amount of pressure to be totally safe. But I don't know if that info is current.
That is correct. You need a "Canner" in order to get the required pressure to get the temp up to proper canning temps. IIRC it's 15 lbs (250F) for 45 minutes or more. I know it was hard to find any information online specific to starter wort, but there isn't enough sugar content to allow for boil-canning.
I was avoiding making more starter wort due to the heat and being busy, but I might pull out the canner and make some more up while I'm brewing outside this weekend. It's really handy to have on hand when you are using liquid yeast.
jmill
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The thing that keeps me from trying this is shipping cost. If you're ordering a bunch of stuff or making a big equipment upgrade, it might make sense as an add on. But if you're just ordering the fast pitch to try, shipping makes it fairly expensive.
MaryB
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NB has flat rate and I am always ordering from them... long as it isn't a big bulky item(bulk malt, brew pots, buckets etc) $7.99 shipping!
treacheroustexan
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I just bought a 4 pack for giggles.
This. It's relatively pricey yes, but the time savings is immense in my book, making it worth it.
I haven't used or made a canned starter yet but I am beginning to prepare wort for a starter and keep it in the freezer. It is really easy to make wort with a vacuum sealer and sous vide cooker. No mess, no babysitting a pot. Keep it hot long enough, and it is pasteurized. Then it goes into the freezer for later use. It's not sterile enough for room-temperature storage, though!
This is a nice compromise if you have the freezer space.
A pasteurization table is quoted in this thread:
http://www.beersmith.com/forum/index.php?topic=13524.0
I do 150F for an hour or so which is probably overkill.
This is a nice compromise if you have the freezer space.
A pasteurization table is quoted in this thread:
http://www.beersmith.com/forum/index.php?topic=13524.0
I do 150F for an hour or so which is probably overkill.
It is not safe to just "freeze" wort. It has to be pressure canned to be totally clear of botulism risk (240f) Wort is a low acid food and freezing is not enough.
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