Yeast Washing Illustrated

[WheeledGoat]

In other words, you're effed.

LOL!

I'm glad things turned out well for ya - beergeek's comment just broke me up is all...

 

[EarthBound]

All that's left to do is label the jars and put them in the fridge. Then when it's time to make a starter, you just pull one out, let it warm to room temp, and decant most of the liquid out of the jar, give the rest a good shake, and pitch it into your starter..

After putting them in pint jars, how soon can I start making a starter? Just a couple hours, probably?

 

[seabass07]

I would think you could use it for a starter immediately. No reason to chill it for a few hours just to bring it right back to room temp. If I was going to use it immediately, I'd just pitch the whole jar in the starter instead of cold crashing and decanting off the clear liquid.

 

[Esmitee]

I may have missed this part?

BB info says to pour the 4 boiled n cooled jars into the carboy.And swirl.

Do you also pour the large jar filled with the same water into the carboy, Or just the 4 pints? Im going to rack my brown Ale tonite, and wanta wash the yeast.

Did this a week or so ago and got alot of trub into my mason jars.

Also, is the 20 minutes the most time to wait, or watch and look to see if most of the trub has fallen 1st? Maybe longer than 20 minutes?

 

[CTownBrewer]

A couple questions from someone who hasn't washed yeast before...

1) Are there any issues from washing yeast from a high gravity beer? I was just concerned the yeast could be too stressed from fermenting a 9%+ ABV beer.

2) How many yeast cells would you say you'd end up with in one of the pint sized mason jars? I know the typical Wyeast Smack Pack has about 100 billion, so would one jar of washed yeast start with a similar cell count? A lot of the recipes I've made already require 200-400 billion cells, so I want to make sure I have the correct pitching rates.

 

[Moebius]

Has anyone tried washing mead yeast this way?

 

[stompbox]

Dumb question..... How do you get the hops and other trub out of the yeast? Or is this somehting you should note be worried about?

 

[Aschecte]

Dumb question..... How do you get the hops and other trub out of the yeast? Or is this somehting you should note be worried about?

When you wash the yeast you add the sterilized water in the beginning then swirl it up ........ what settles out in that first 30 minutes is the heavier trub and hop material. This leaves the yeast still in suspension for you to harvest.

 

[Accidic]

Thought I'd contribute the dumbest thing to this thread: Living in the San Fernando Valley, I don't even know where to buy mason jars. We're just far too detached from the 20th century to bother with anything like canning.

You don't have to use Mason jars. That said if you care to find them you may be in a similar situation as the stores (grocery or otherwise) do not carry them at non-canning times of the season. *IF* you have one you might find them at a farmer's supply (like Co-op or Tractor Supply for examples). Alternatively if you're heart is set on Mason style jars there are a variety of options out there. For one it appears that Wal-Mart (assuming you have one, doesn't everyone? ) has a generic line of salsa that they keep in Mason jars (I haven't tested the lids on these but they look right. They're also etched with deep "Mason" on the jars themselves.) which for some damn reason isn't kept with their Generic salsa (Pace clones) options but rather on the top shelf. They come in Black Bean & Corn and a Chili Lime and are much nicer than the other options imo and strangely are also cheaper per ounce. Alternatively if you don't have a Wal-Mart there is a spaghetti sauce that costs about the same as comparable level spaghetti sauces (~$2-2.50/jar) that comes in a "Mason" jar (and etched with the name as well). I've tested these personally and can confirm for you that standard rings and lids will fit these. Or like some have done on here you could use just about any container although glass seems to be the favorite regardless of source as long as you clean it well and sanitize.

Unwashed yeast cakes don't last long in the fridge in my experience. The literature ("Yeast") suggests keeping unwashed yeast for up to a week. I tried to save an unwashed cake for 3 months and it was completely dead when I tried to revive it on my stirplate with 1.030 wort. So if you expect to brew within a week, go for it. But if you want to store yeast for months and months without worry, wash it. It only takes 30-40 minutes (during which you can walk away and do whatever you want) if you have some boiled, canned water just sitting in the back of your fridge.

I am wondering why this is true...is there something chemical in the bottom of the fermenter that kills the yeast ??

While I am speculating to some extent I would say one of the potential chemicals in the bottom of the fermenter that kills yeast is alcohol. Alcohol toxicity to most beer yeasts is what, in the 10% range? While lower percentages may be present in the resulting beer it's still going to be fighting at those yeast cells even if it's not doing it as efficiently. The water you added not only gave you extra space to help decant the yeast from the trub (in the multiple steps) but also thins out the remaining alcohol that would have been in the beer you made. This also reduces the effectiveness of the alcohol protecting the mix and increases the chance of bacterial contamination.

While I've had most turn out well (even with trub in the bottom for just over 6 months with no problems), I've also had a few that I threw them away upon opening just off the smell alone. I've had less issues since learning to separate the yeast out better though and in a double washed batch I had it take off no problems at just over 22 months in a starter to which I swirled it up, let it settle out then poured the active/suspended yeast into a 2nd starter and it worked without a hitch. I wouldn't recommend it as a general rule mind you but even if you have accidently frozen yeast there's a chance it will take off in a starter. As I understand it though the chances of mutation are much MUCH greater with that kind of stress though. Palmer pointed out (IIRC it was Palmer anyway) that reuse and mutation over the centuries helped to lead us to some of the strains not to mention variety of yeast we have today so if you don't mind taking a chance on the cost of a starter which doesn't tend to cost a lot anyway what can it really hurt to give it a try?

 

[stratslinger]

2) How many yeast cells would you say you'd end up with in one of the pint sized mason jars? I know the typical Wyeast Smack Pack has about 100 billion, so would one jar of washed yeast start with a similar cell count? A lot of the recipes I've made already require 200-400 billion cells, so I want to make sure I have the correct pitching rates.

I'm also very interested in an answer to this question... Buying new yeast packets every brew day can be more expensive, but at least you can get a good estimate of your starting cell count. In this kind of case, I've got no idea how you'd calculate what's an appropriate starter size to use...

 

[BigB]

I'm also very interested in an answer to this question... Buying new yeast packets every brew day can be more expensive, but at least you can get a good estimate of your starting cell count. In this kind of case, I've got no idea how you'd calculate what's an appropriate starter size to use...

I know this thread is 115 pages long, but it has been answered numerous times... There is simply WAY too MANY variables to answer it in numbers. The only way you would know is by using a microscope and plates. However, most on here, including myself, find that a single jar of washed yeast behaves similarly to a single smack pack... Obviously ALWAYS make a starter. Results will vary drastically from brewer to brewer based on equipment, procedure, yeast health, age, temperature, water, how the Mets finished this year, etc, etc, etc.

 

[Grinreaper]

Well i just tried a yeast starter with my 5 months old belgium washed yeast. O decanted the water and maybe half of the grey brown layer. Pitch the beige color bottom goop and waiting for some action to start. It's been almost 5 hours, still no reaction from the yeast so far

 

[BigB]

Well i just tried a yeast starter with my 5 months old belgium washed yeast. O decanted the water and maybe half of the grey brown layer. Pitch the beige color bottom goop and waiting for some action to start. It's been almost 5 hours, still no reaction from the yeast so far

And this proves my point.... I just made a starter from a jar of WLP037 that I washed and jarred on 12-27-2010.. a full 9 months ago. Sure, it was a little slow to start, but it is fermenting like crazy now! So be patient! Yeast are some hardy little bastards... give em a chance.

 

[bigbeergeek]

Well i just tried a yeast starter with my 5 months old belgium washed yeast. O decanted the water and maybe half of the grey brown layer. Pitch the beige color bottom goop and waiting for some action to start. It's been almost 5 hours, still no reaction from the yeast so far

Give it 5 days if necessary (well, maybe not, but you get the point). They're coming out of a long slumber -- patience!

 

[Grinreaper]

Ok it's been more than 15 hours. There was small whitish spots on the surface and the yeast was at the bottom. So i reshaked it to give it more oxygen and see if it can help.

 

[kappclark]

And this proves my point.... I just made a starter from a jar of WLP037 that I washed and jarred on 12-27-2010.. a full 9 months ago. Sure, it was a little slow to start, but it is fermenting like crazy now! So be patient! Yeast are some hardy little bastards... give em a chance.

Yesterday, I pitched a 3 week old 2L starter flask of Essex Ale yeast (2nd gen )...1054 ,,, and the yeast are happy again. Yes - very hard workers.. I think we sell the yeast short .. if you had a viable starter, I think you can expect a viable fermentation...my lag time was 12 hours - which is fine with me..in 6 weeks, I will have some HPA to serve at Thanksgiving..and I give thanks to the faithful yeast!

 

[Grinreaper]

/Here's the update. After reshaking the jar i have fermentation. Really good one at that. Now here's the question. Is there still contamination in the starter that could affect to next beer?/

New update. WOW. Took 15 hours or so to see a fermentation in my 2 x Brewferm Grand cru. Just got back from work and amazed how much foam there is in my bucket. It's a 30 litres semi transparent bucket and the beer is only 18 litres. The whole empty space is filled with kraussen. There was a little bit in the airlock and my appartment smells like beer lol. The bucket is even in my fermentation chambre is built with a small whirlpool fridge.

 

[jeffjm]

Tonight I knew that I was going out after work, and also knew that I needed to keg my APA. I had every intention of reclaiming the 1056 goodness at the bottom of the carboy for a couple of bigger beers I'm doing this weekend. Since I was short on time tonight, I decided to boil my water, mason jars, etc. last night and let it cool for 24 hours.

After I got the kegging chores completed, I took the lid off of my stockpot that had the boiled and cooled water, jars, lids, and bands. The water was rust-red. Apparently I had a few rust spots somewhere, and they multiplied between last night and tonight.

So....by saving a few bucks by reusing lids and bands, I'm now going to spend $17 on more yeast, plus I'll use more starter wort than I would normally use for yeast that was harvested 36 hours before pitching.

Sigh....

 

[bigbeergeek]

Tonight I knew that I was going out after work, and also knew that I needed to keg my APA. I had every intention of reclaiming the 1056 goodness at the bottom of the carboy for a couple of bigger beers I'm doing this weekend. Since I was short on time tonight, I decided to boil my water, mason jars, etc. last night and let it cool for 24 hours.

After I got the kegging chores completed, I took the lid off of my stockpot that had the boiled and cooled water, jars, lids, and bands. The water was rust-red. Apparently I had a few rust spots somewhere, and they multiplied between last night and tonight.

So....by saving a few bucks by reusing lids and bands, I'm now going to spend $17 on more yeast, plus I'll use more starter wort than I would normally use for yeast that was harvested 36 hours before pitching.

Sigh....

I would have just used it.

 

[Accidic]

Me too. Rust isn't really an infection after all. Just a little more nutritive iron is all. Besides, looks like your lid did you a favor and ate some of the oxygen.

 

[lpdean40]

This thread was great and came in very handy. Haven't payed for yeast in about 2 years.

 

[milldoggy]

Been playing around with amount of water to use and I find the more water the better. I now use a gallon pickle jar per carboy, let sits 30 Minute, then into jars. No trub. So if anyone is a firt time washing, add more water than you think you need.

 

[Accidic]

You want jars filled to the top as I understand it reducing oxygen content encouraging the beasties to sleep.

 

[Grinreaper]

Tonight I knew that I was going out after work, and also knew that I needed to keg my APA. I had every intention of reclaiming the 1056 goodness at the bottom of the carboy for a couple of bigger beers I'm doing this weekend. Since I was short on time tonight, I decided to boil my water, mason jars, etc. last night and let it cool for 24 hours.

After I got the kegging chores completed, I took the lid off of my stockpot that had the boiled and cooled water, jars, lids, and bands. The water was rust-red. Apparently I had a few rust spots somewhere, and they multiplied between last night and tonight.

So....by saving a few bucks by reusing lids and bands, I'm now going to spend $17 on more yeast, plus I'll use more starter wort than I would normally use for yeast that was harvested 36 hours before pitching.

Sigh....

Never leave mason jar lids in water. It will rust even in a little water. Boil it then take them out and close the lids and let them cool on counter overnight.

 

[Accidic]

I believe that has been suggested a few times. I've also used purified water straight from the bottle as several producers heat the bottles to 180 which has the same general effect as boiling albeit slightly less effective.

 

[RussH]

I found this thread a while ago and thought I'd give it a try. This is an unbelievably well written instructional. I have no questions about the "how-to" of the process. I am currently washing yeast for the first time and its going good. Waiting for my fermenter to settle a bit, and will fill the big jar. Thank you so much. I'd buy your book

 

[smalliewader]

I haven't read all 117 pages, so maybe this has been brought up before. Why the additional step of going from carboy to large jar then to small jars?

Last night I tried something a little different. After putting the water in the carboy, swirling and letting settle for about 15 minutes, the trub was on the bottom, a definitive middle layer of suspended yeast and then the water layer on top. Using my auto siphon, I siphoned from that middle yeast layer directly into my final jars. After sitting in the fridge overnight, I have 4 jars with a nice layer of yeast on the bottom and little to no other sediment.

Is the additional washing step really necessary?

 

[Accidic]

I wouldn't think so. When I was s05 I get cleaner yeast than I do with wlp001. With it it takes longer and more effort to separate out the trub. I only keep the s05 for a month at the most anyway but I've never had any issues with it whatsoever.

 

[bmason1623]

dumb question here but if I use 8 ounce mason jars instead of 16 ounce ones do I need to add the yeast from two jars when I make my starter?

 

[Accidic]

Depends on how much yeast you have to work with in the bottom layer. My half cup jars and half pint (cup) jars are about the same diameter so equal yeast layer thicknesses are also as a result about the same yeast thicknesses. I have two styles of half pint and pint jars also. The wide mouth half pints are roughly about the same inner diameter as the regular ring pints so the situation would be somewhat similar. I tend to use whichever ones I have available anyway and even with the half cup jars (4oz) I've honestly had very little issue save maybe an extra 24 hours of startup time but I also don't really let them get terribly old either.

Alternatively you could just step up your starter a bit. As long as you have a decent yeast layer though I can't honestly imagine it'd matter too much and would ultimately depend on the type of beer you're pitching to.