Yeast packaging (Wyeast vs. WL)

[ESBrewer]

Do you prefer the packaging of Wyeast (Activator package) or White Labs (Purepitch)?

After trying out both I think I just hate the Wyeast Activator with some invisible inner pouch (contains sugar!) that you need to hunt for. When you finally hit it hard enough you need to be scared not to break the whole package so that yeast might be all over the kitchen. Ok, you could just forget the inner thing and make a starter from the outer pouch but as a starter guy I feel I'm just paying some cents for nothing and the package becomes unnecessarily large compared to White labs etc.. It is probably made for the brewers who don't make starters at all, but I always use a starter that contains all the yeast nutrients in the world...

 

[brewcat]

I've never been scared of popping a Wyeast package. You don't have to hit the inner pouch all that hard. The inner pouch contains Wyeast yeast nutrient. Wyeast is my go to liquid yeast.

 

[pantherburn]

I agree, I don't really care for the smack packs either. I'll tell you, I've recently started using a lot of dry yeasts and I really like them. No worries about transit temperature, awesome shelf life, no starters! The variety available is also much better than when I started brewing.

 

[balrog]

+1 for WYeast. Love it. Smack it. Smack it real good. I make starters too. I don't smack them.

 

[Oginme]

+1 for Wyeast. Hint: you really don't have to break the activator packets inside -- they just provide for wake-up and proofing of the yeast.

Aside from that the following statement from the White Labs FAQ site has me wary of their controls:

How much yeast is in my White Labs homebrew PurePitch? Your pitch rates seem low.
The wording on our PurePitch® packaging - 'Made to Contain over 100 Billion Cells' - is a target cell count number for each of our yeast packages. We specifically say “Made to Contain” because not all packages will contain more than 100 billion cells even though we target that number in our production and packaging processes.

This is because of the reality of cell biology - cell sizes vary, cell packing varies, and since cells are microscopic, those small variations lead to large fluctuations in cell numbers. Although the PurePitch® packages state a cell net volume of 40 mL, actual volumes range from 40 to 50 mL.

In our production, we allow for cell counts of 1.5 to 3.0 billion per milliliter which will produce 60 to 120 billion total cells if 40 mL. We target the high range of cell counts and fill volumes in our production and packaging processes, however as stated above, the reality of cell biology is that those numbers will vary.

We publish the QC data that includes the actual cell count of each lot on Yeastman.com. We state on Yeastman.com the allowed cell count range (1.5 to 3.0 billion per milliliter) because it accurately reflects the reality of packaging microorganisms. Our pitch rate is lower for initial pitches because our yeast is more viable and vital.


Really? 60 to 120 Billion cells per pack is a pretty wide range.

I've done yeast counts on Wyeast packages (without breaking the nutrient pack) and have always come up with a minimum of 98 billion cells and often have found as many as 125 billion in their packages. Average for my testing of 8 packages (all different strains) was around 108 billion. Only viable cells were counted and there were not many which stained as non-viable or unhealthy cells walls. Some of the packs were 7 weeks old, average age was around 3.5 weeks old.

 

[balrog]

+1 for Wyeast. Hint: you really don't have to break the activator packets inside -- they just provide for wake-up and proofing of the yeast.

Aside from that the following statement from the White Labs FAQ site has me wary of their controls:

How much yeast is in my White Labs homebrew PurePitch? Your pitch rates seem low.
The wording on our PurePitch® packaging - 'Made to Contain over 100 Billion Cells' - is a target cell count number for each of our yeast packages. We specifically say “Made to Contain” because not all packages will contain more than 100 billion cells even though we target that number in our production and packaging processes.

This is because of the reality of cell biology - cell sizes vary, cell packing varies, and since cells are microscopic, those small variations lead to large fluctuations in cell numbers. Although the PurePitch® packages state a cell net volume of 40 mL, actual volumes range from 40 to 50 mL.

In our production, we allow for cell counts of 1.5 to 3.0 billion per milliliter which will produce 60 to 120 billion total cells if 40 mL. We target the high range of cell counts and fill volumes in our production and packaging processes, however as stated above, the reality of cell biology is that those numbers will vary.

We publish the QC data that includes the actual cell count of each lot on Yeastman.com. We state on Yeastman.com the allowed cell count range (1.5 to 3.0 billion per milliliter) because it accurately reflects the reality of packaging microorganisms. Our pitch rate is lower for initial pitches because our yeast is more viable and vital.


Really? 60 to 120 Billion cells per pack is a pretty wide range.

I've done yeast counts on Wyeast packages (without breaking the nutrient pack) and have always come up with a minimum of 98 billion cells and often have found as many as 125 billion in their packages. Average for my testing of 8 packages (all different strains) was around 108 billion. Only viable cells were counted and there were not many which stained as non-viable or unhealthy cells walls. Some of the packs were 7 weeks old, average age was around 3.5 weeks old.

Ok.

Just.

Wow.

I guess I am happy in my simplistic ignorance or naivitee to presume 100b in the WYeast pkg I get. I would never have thought to count the....oh...wait...as an avowed dataphile I bet someday I start counting yeast cells. <shakes head>

This hobby can be frightful.

 

[SoCal-Doug]

Totally don't care either way. But I wish WL still used the plastic bottles. They were handy for storing stuff.

 

[ESBrewer]

Counting cells needs to be done from tiny samples drawn from large chambers so you can never count each and every cell in a container. Yeast cells will irregularly clump together etc. so you never know really. So I understand that the companies are not able to guarantee the count 100%. I think the numbers are reliable enough, it's about probabilities like many things in life.

I believe Wyeast is a great product (using it right now), but I still don't think I really need the huge foil package with sugar. In the future (when I get some more equipment) I'll store the yeast in a freezer and plates so then there will be no need for a new package every time.

 

[Oginme]

I actually did the study as a practice on cell counting. I had done some counting for the past couple of years, but never really had any confidence in my numbers. Counting a known quantity was helpful in improving my technique, thus I cannot claim it to be unbiased, though I did use differing dilutions for each of the packs I counted to provide some variability. I used the five cell technique and then the full grid. (Hint: hand tally counters are invaluable). I also do a lot of microscopy looking at dispersions of encapsulated materials and ground pigments so I have some aptitude for doing this type of work.

 

[beermanpete]

I like the Wyeast packaging a bit more than the White Labs packaging. White Labs should make the outer pack a bit larger to make it less likely to cut the inner pack when opening the outer pack.

 

[RM-MN]

Counting cells needs to be done from tiny samples drawn from large chambers so you can never count each and every cell in a container. Yeast cells will irregularly clump together etc. so you never know really. So I understand that the companies are not able to guarantee the count 100%. I think the numbers are reliable enough, it's about probabilities like many things in life.

I believe Wyeast is a great product (using it right now), but I still don't think I really need the huge foil package with sugar. In the future (when I get some more equipment) I'll store the yeast in a freezer and plates so then there will be no need for a new package every time.

Having looked at a few microphotographs of yeast counting, noticing how the yeast cells are clumped or spread on the photo and noting how many times the sample is to be multiplied to get to the billions of cells claimed, I have absolutely no faith in the numbers. However, I do have faith that the yeast will be sufficient to ferment my beer. It always has.

 

[Denny]

Counting cells needs to be done from tiny samples drawn from large chambers so you can never count each and every cell in a container. Yeast cells will irregularly clump together etc. so you never know really. So I understand that the companies are not able to guarantee the count 100%. I think the numbers are reliable enough, it's about probabilities like many things in life.

I believe Wyeast is a great product (using it right now), but I still don't think I really need the huge foil package with sugar. In the future (when I get some more equipment) I'll store the yeast in a freezer and plates so then there will be no need for a new package every time.

It isn't sugar in the nutrient pouch