Yeast Nutrients Recommendations Please?

[Hunny Bunny]

I have read about yeast nutrients, as an additive, but I would like to know more, if anyone has any specific information, on brands, strengths, and methods of incorporation into the fermenting mix please? I do have some [it is quite old, does that matter?] but I do not have the directions which came with it anymore, so I do not know how much I should use relative to my wort so that I am neither wasting it, or using too little to have any effect. Any and all help is deeply appreciated! (^_^)/

 

[renstyle]

I use Wyeast nutrient, generally 5mg/1 tsp per 5 gal/19L batch

Add 10 mins before turning off the burner in to the kettle.

 

[stealthfixr]

I think nutrients are more critical for extract brewers, as all-grain builds some yeast nutrients as a part of the process. As an all-grain brewer, I still use yeast nutrients on every batch as cheap insurance for complete & healthy fermentations. I have used Servomyces and WLN1000, and both seem to work equally well. However, Servomyces is more expensive, so I tend to use WLN1000 more.

 

[hotbeer]

I think nutrients are more critical for those that re-use and save yeast. Perhaps it is a thing for extract brewing, but I wouldn't know, I've never brewed with extract.

I wouldn't just add it to your yeast starter or wort without first having identified an issue with your beer that it might correct.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

https://www.brunwater.com/articles/zinc-and-ro-water

 

[Protos]

When multiplying and propagating harvested yeasts I use Lallemand's Yeastlife Extra.

 

[HM-2]

I use Young's. It's a cheap (like 1/10 the price of most of the beer specific yeast nutrients, at about £10 for 500g) insurance policy, particularly with higher gravity worts or Kveik. Only ever had one stuck ferm, and that was when I forgot it!

 

[McMullan]

Use a brewer's yeast nutrient blend specifically formulated for barley worts. White Labs and Wyeast have developed products. Both seem to work for me so I grab whichever's available at the time. If the yeast are healthy, pitched at a good rate (not under pitched) and aren't going to be repitched it's not really necessary to include nutrient additions. If you've got some, add some. It's not expensive. Unless it's called Servomyces. I wouldn't bother adding superstitious pinches of old-school remedies based on old wives' tales. They're incomplete. Potentially like adding only zinc additions. Limited research suggests adding zinc to FV wort has the most significant effect on yeast behaviour and fermentation performance, but remember the results here are limited to the wort and yeast used in that specific study. Environmental sources of zinc (soil, water, food, etc.) are highly variable so don't assume anything. Zinc is very important for biology generally, not just yeast cells. The problem is living cells don't seem to store zinc efficiently so they require external sources. Life probably evolved in a zinc rich environment. It's a no-brainer to add a little to anything biology if you have some. If it improves things continue adding it. Apparently, oysters are a very rich source of zinc, which might help explain this. Who knows?

 

[dmtaylor]

If you are brewing beer, you don't need any nutrients unless you plan to reuse the same yeast over and over. Otherwise, skip it. The malt has all the nutrients you need.

Cider, mead, and wine can be a little different story. I don't use nutrients in my cider, haven't found it necessary at all, but many people do. In mead and wine, yes, as these are nutrient deficient.

 

[Kickass]

I think nutrients are more critical for extract brewers, as all-grain builds some yeast nutrients as a part of the process.

Can you explain this? It doesn’t make sense to me since extract and all grain wort is of the same origin.

 

[McMullan]

Can you explain this? It doesn’t make sense to me since extract and all grain wort is of the same origin.

I think the logic might be how nutrient value tends to decline when organic stuff gets processed, preserved then stored over time. I think most of us accept fresh is better quality. Does that translate into better nutrient value? All I can offer really is that when I started making my own starter wort from grains I noticed the yeast seemed to culture better. I can't measure it specifically, but I'm happy to guess fresh all-grain wort is more nutritious therefore more fermentable. I wonder, too, about the oxidant (ROS) load of air-dried DME.

 

[troxerX]

A good source of inexpensive nutrients is washing and saving the yeast cake from one batch and tossing it in the boil of the next batch.. Otherwise adding dry baking yeasts (rapid dry yeast) to the boil will also be a good and simple approach. Another more sophisticated nutrient is mycelium extract but that might be more difficult to find and probably more expensive. The principle here is that dead lysed yeast provides exactly what live yeast needs to reproduce and have a healthy fermentation..

 

[McMullan]

Yeast (extract) is produced commercially for its nutrient value, but its quality depends on the growth medium, amongst other things. It's not necessarily the case spent brewer's yeast is of much use as a fermentation aid. Nor is it simply a case of tossing yeast into the boil. This isn't how controlled autolysis is carried out in the production of yeast extract. Yeast, like all living cells, are basically proteinaceous solutions. Boiling them for a short time is going to denature proteins of intact cells thus effectively locking up nutrients to minimise bioavailability. I'd question the advice offered in that YouTube video as misinformation.

 

[troxerX]

Affirmative, I mentioned fungi/mycelium extract as an alternative as I see it very often being used as a nutrient in fermentation related peer reviewed papers. But I wouldn’t go that far as questioning the practice of adding yeast to the boil as a misinformation. Yeast are more than proteins, there are minerals, amino acids, nucleic acids, carbohydrates, lipids, co-factors, vitamins etc that will be released when they are pitched and lysed in the boil. It may not be a perfect solution as a pure yeast extract but there got to be some value there, primarily when you often have expired yeast packs that will be discarded anyway.

 

[McMullan]

But pretty much all of these potential nutrients are associated directly or indirectly with proteins. That's kind of how life works. Quite a lot of research has been done in the area of yeast extract in terms of value as nutritional supplement. None suggests tossing spent yeast into the boil works as a fermentation aid. I have no idea where these random YouTubers get their info from

 

[mashpaddled]

Generally wort has most of the nutrients yeast need for a basic beer. The two nutrients that tend not to be there in sufficient quantities are oxygen and zinc. Barley has some zinc but not enough on its own and even less if you're using a lot of adjuncts. If you use RO or distilled water to build a water profile, you're missing trance minerals like zinc in the water. Typical brewing salts don't add zinc.

The harsher fermentation conditions (e.g. higher gravity, low pitch rate, high percentage of adjuncts) the better off you will be adding nutrients to ensure a good fermentation. The easier it is for yeast to uptake necessary nutrients the easier it will be for them to ferment thoroughly and with the flavor profile you expect. If yeast need to overcome harsh conditions, they are more likely to use up nutrients early in fermentation and may give up before they reach the expected range of attenuation. Yeast generally ferment the easiest sugars first so they need to do more work at the end to split up maltose and other less simple sugars.

But pretty much all of these potential nutrients are associated directly or indirectly with proteins. That's kind of how life works. Quite a lot of research he as been done in the area of yeast extract in terms of value as nutritional supplement. None suggests tossing spent yeast into the boil works as a fermentation aid. I have no idea where these random YouTubers get their info from

Spent yeast retain some nutrients which can be released through boiling. It's not a great source of nutrients but it's a source of nutrients. If you want to add a little to the boil to help out a 5-6% beer, sure. If you're trying to provide nutrients for a 12% stout, it's not enough. Incidentally spent yeast can be a suitable source of zinc, so a purchased nutrient blend lacking zinc can be supplemented with a little spent yeast in the boil.

 

[AlexKay]

I brew all-malt beers, most of the time. I add oxygen and zinc, the latter with a zinc sulfate nutritional supplement and a micropipette.

 

[McMullan]

Spent yeast retain some nutrients which can be released through boiling. It's not a great source of nutrients but it's a source of nutrients. If you want to add a little to the boil to help out a 5-6% beer, sure. If you're trying to provide nutrients for a 12% stout, it's not enough. Incidentally spent yeast can be a suitable source of zinc, so a purchased nutrient blend lacking zinc can be supplemented with a little spent yeast in the boil.

According to which evidence? Also, you do realise if there is a zinc deficiency in wort spent yeast are going to be deficient in zinc? They don't actually produce zinc as such. That requires laws of physics to be broken

 

[cmac62]

I generally use fermaid O and fermaid K also some DAP, but I have always heard and mostly believed that boiled baker's yeast was a good yeast nute and I'm fairly certain it won't hurt you, the yeast or your beer.

This thread drew me down a rabbit hole. I had always heard that boiling yeast as a nutrient was an excepted practice, and after looking at many google results is does seem to be accepted for the most part. I found a few posts that seemed to provide some good info. The first one seems to break it down pretty well as to boiled yeast and also provides a interesting idea to actually make yeast nutes from yeast with a souse fide machine.

https://suigenerisbrewing.com/index.php/2022/06/16/are-dead-yeasts-yeast-nutrient/https://www.lbds.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/Article_NutritionFermentation.pdfhttps://fermfacts.com/nutrient-requirements-of-the-yeast-cell/
On the home distiller site they talk about making a "yeast bomb" when doing a sugar wash or other low nute type of fermentation. Here is a post concerning a molasses and sugar wash and what they use as the yeast bomb. I don't know about the 20.0.0 fertilizer, but this is what is listed (see the mod's warning).

I will start with my " Yeast Bomb "
2 vitamin B, crushed with mortor and pestal
5 teaspoons of 20-0-0, agrcultural fertalizer admin edit: urea caution,"Commonly used in fertilizers, animal feed, and diuretics, Urea itself is not dangerous. However, in fermentation, Urea is known to contribute to the production of ethyl carbamate, which is a carcinogen and has therefore been banned in beverage alcohol production in some countries"
1/4 teaspoon of epsom salt
1/4 cup bakers yeast
1 gallon water
Boil all for 15 minutes and strain.

Edit: This was for a 10 gal wash.

I hope this is helpful.

 

[McMullan]

None of those googled links seems to offer any justification for adding spent yeast to the boil as an effective fermentation aid, @cmac62. Quite the opposite, I thought, skimming through them.

 

[McMullan]

Yeast nutrient blends formulated specifically for malted barley worts are sold in most homebrew shops and cost a fraction of the price of a pack of yeast, including dry yeast. Zinc sulphate even less. Making yeast extract as a fermentation aid is much more bothersome and time consuming.

https://www.academia.edu/27645378/Yeast_Nutrients_Make_Fermentations_Better

 

[cmac62]

Yeast nutrient blends formulated specifically for malted barley worts are sold in most homebrew shops and cost a fraction of the price of a pack of yeast, including dry yeast. Zinc sulphate even less. Making yeast extract as a fermentation aid is much more bothersome and time consuming.

https://www.academia.edu/27645378/Yeast_Nutrients_Make_Fermentations_Better

I agree with you. It is way easier to add a tbsp of fermaid to the boil that going through the process of making the yeast extract. The SGB article was written in response to a letter saying boiled yeast has everything yeast need in perfect balance, and his response is that this is not correct. He does say boiling yeast will add some nutritional value by breaking down the yeast cell and releasing some of the good stuff, but it will not breakdown proteins or release the larger water soluble molecules. Anyway, the OP asked what we are using and how much.

OP, I don't usually add yeast nutes to beer, but for mead/cider/wine they are really important as these musts are yeast nute deficient. Generally I make mead once or twice a year and when doing so I use the TONSA staggered approach, you can read more about this here: HOME | Mead Made Right. Also, the stuff you have is probably good to use, I don't think there is anything in there that would go bad. I would say smell it, but yeast nutes stink anyway. Also, the dosing recommendations I have seen is usually .5 to 1 tsp per gal. Hope this helps.