WLP 630 Limited Release Berliner Weisse

[emjay]

oxygen ingress occurs through the bung and airlock usually and the container (carboy, bucket, etc) is pretty unimportant here. "wort reacting with oxygen" not sure what you mean here, but

ideally you should pitch a large culture of yeast and lacto with little oxygenation therefore promoting growth of lacto but still getting a good fermentation from your brewers yeast. or pitch a large starter of lacto 12-24 hours prior to pitching your brewers yeast and before the pH drops too low so you still get a good fermentation. if it gets too low before the yeast can complete a proper fermentation you might get poor attenuation which is why i suspect brett is usually found in these berliner blends.

you say you are a big fan of brewing with bugs but you are the same guy that doesn't think a 100% brett L beer would be good...

I've had 2 styles brewed with Brett L only - way too aggressive for my tastes, and my personal feeling now is simply that I don't expect to ever find a great beer fermented only with Brett L.

I can be a big fan of pizza (although what I said is that it's a huge interest - not quite the same), but it doesn't mean I have to like it absolutely smothered in anchovies.

Your arguments are continuing to devolve in a big way, and I can see things will probably just start going in circles, so I'll just leave it at that. There's a whole slew of brewers here who have aerated/oxygenated their Berliner Weisse and have had nothing but great results, so I'll let the evidence speak for itself, and people can make up their own minds. I'm not even sure why I bothered arguing, because I know a BW can turn out fine either way, oxygenated or not.

 

[faithinchaos]

yes, my arguments devolve yet you're the one insisting an anaerobic bacteria works wonderfully in an oxygen rich environment and will still outcompete brewers yeast.

 

[emjay]

yes, my arguments devolve yet you're the one insisting an anaerobic bacteria works wonderfully in an oxygen rich environment and will still outcompete brewers yeast.

Nope, never said that. The environment remaining in the environment after about 12 hours is pretty negligible, and it does a horrible job competing with yeast, which is why it takes months rather than days to get a good amount of tartness.

Like I said, going in circles...

 

[faithinchaos]

yes you are doing a good job of going in circles.

should the lacto still be active after primary fermentation your best best is to get it into bottles as soon as possible (assuming you have reached terminal gravity) so that you are in an anaerobic environment where the lacto will strive. pitching more lacto at this time couldn't hurt.

 

[Mustangj]

Still has some sulfur notes...

 

[HopNuggets]

My Berliner Weisse with WLP630 has been in secondary for 9 weeks. I plan on pulling a sample at 11 weeks, on Father's Day, to see how it's coming along. I am excited now that the temperature has finally turned as we have been experience summer and skipped spring. The carboy is above 70 all the time now and up in the mid-70s most of the time so hopefully I'll get those tart and sour flavors to come out quicker!!!

 

[HopNuggets]

Just pulled a sample last night and it was not sour at all. It was very light and refreshing and there was a lemony aroma there but no tartness yet. Hopefully another couple months will help it some but I have a feeling this Berliner Weisse will be bottled off once it's ready and drank next summer.

 

[erikb]

Hi Guys - I am hoping to revive this thread as I am a NOOB and using the White Labs WLP 630. I purchased the White Labs BW vial but it was out of date. The guy at the brew shop told me to do a 1qt starter. That was done and I saw a white scum on top two nights ago but now it is gone and the yeast is clumpy at the bottom with little CO2 production. Now I am not seeing any activity after 48 hours at around 70 degrees. I have emailed White Labs to see what they say.

Do you think I should dump this starter and go with the Lacto for a few days and then the US-05 yeast or give this a try? White Labs says 65-72 degrees but some guys say upwards of 100 degrees. I am not sure what it is supposed to look like.

Also, I am wondering if you guys have any tips or pointers on this style, I am wanting a really tart beer. How long in primary? Do you do a secondary? How long in bottle conditioning?

Using 5lbs Wheat LME/.5oz Saaz/5 minute boil

 

[emjay]

Making a starter wasn't the best idea, but you work with what you got I guess. No activity after 48 hours is totally normal for a starter-sized fermentation. Just pitch it and cross your fingers.

Also, listen to White Labs. Over 100 will not only result in some awful tasting beer, but it's pretty close to killing the yeast!

Lastly, especially since you have an old product AND you made a starter, you might need to age this a very long time. Like... next summer is even a possibility. If you can't wait that long, some homebrew supply shops sell food-grade lactic acid, which you can carefully mix into the beer to get the level of sourness you like.

Edit: I see you I missed part of your post! I don't really like recommending dumping anything, so I will say that, if you can spare the fermentors and space, make a second batch with lacto and US-05. If not, I would pitch the lacto first, let it get 2 days head start (make sure everything is kept SANITARY), and then pitch your starter.

Also, 5lbs of Wheat LME is a too much for a BW, and that's important because the lacto likes low alcohol. 4lbs LME seems like the max, but I'll double check that in a short while.

 

[HopNuggets]

I brewed my Berliner Weisse with the WLP630 blend 6 months ago and I just took a sample this past weekend. A bit more lacto flavor has come through but still not tartness. I plan on just leaving it in secondary for the fall and winter, but if there is no tartness come spring time I think I may add some lactic acid and bottle it off. This will be the last time I use a blend. Next Berliner will be pitching pure lacto and then yeast as others have done.

 

[passedpawn]

My first BW was lacto, followed by sacc a day later. Primary about 4 months at 75. There was only the slightest tartness. I bottled, then put the bottles in 90F; small pellicles formed in the bottles within days. After a month in the bottles, they have a nice sour aroma and medium tartness. I'd still like more.

I just made a second batch. Half of it is in long-term primary storage, just like the first batch. The other half was bottled after only 8 days in primary and is now conditioning in 90F.

 

[emjay]

I'm about to bottle my batch I made in early February. No idea what it tastes like yet, but my LHBS just started stocking gallon jugs (rather than little 1/4/8 ounce bottles, or whatever's typical) of 88% lactic acid, produced by Five Star (the company behind Star San, in case people forgot or didn't know).

I just picked up one of these gallon jugs on Friday, so I'm more than ready to tart-ify my beer I may even try making a few bottles *well* beyond puckering

 

[Theoutlawjoseywales]

I brewed with this yeast March 2011 and bottled this past February 2012. I was hesitant about the beer turning out well until the past month or so where It's fully carbed and the tartness is coming out well.

I will use this blend again.

 

[user 70770]

Gosh I wish I'd seen this thread before starting. Brewed a Berliner last weekend with WLP630. Original gravity clocked at 1.035 and about 5ibus. I did a full hour boil.

I also did a kind of a mini starter the day of brewing just to get the yeast going a bit before pitching. I'm a bit upset at White Labs right now because I checked their website before buying this yeast, and they had very little information about how to handle this blend. So I assumed this blend should be handled just like any other yeast.

So the strange thing is that I got a very fast start with this yeast. I pitched the yeast around 8pm, and by 6am the next morning, I was already seeing a good deal of activity. I got a nice little krausen after 24 hours, but very strangely enough, it fell like a rock by 48 hours. I've never seen a fermentation do that. It's so strange to see a very active fermentation with basically unperturbed surface. Fermentation has been steady at an ambient temperature of 68F. It is now showing signs of slowing down.

I'm confident this will make beer, but maybe not the beer I was hoping for. I'd like to seek some advice on what I should do next. This beer was meant to be a strawberry berliner weisse. Before I started, my plan was to primary ferment for about 2 weeks, then rack over strawberries and secondary that for 2 more weeks and then bottle. But based on your comment, the level of sourness may be very low by bottling day. I also read that strawberry fades quickly over time and may be gone before the sourness develops properly. What do you guys recommend? Should I do a secondary without the fruit, then rack in a tertiary over fruit a few months later?

 

[tboog86]

If I leave this in primary for a about a month and then move it to secondary for 5-6 months will I need to add any additional yeast before bottling like you normally would for a beer that conditions for that long?

 

[emjay]

If I leave this in primary for a about a month and then move it to secondary for 5-6 months will I need to add any additional yeast before bottling like you normally would for a beer that conditions for that long?

Usually beer will still be able to carbonate after 6 months unless it's really high gravity (or *possibly* also unless it's extremely hoppy). A normal beer should be fine, and something that is as *LOW gravity* as a BW should be even more fine. However, it can't really hurt to add more yeast before bottling, especially since the word "usually" isn't exactly a guarantee...

Just make sure to follow the best/safe practice of waiting at least a few days (personally I'd give it a week) after adding the new yeast before you add priming sugar and bottle it, in order to make sure it's fully fermented so that you don't end up with bottle bombs; a BW should already be dry as hell and is possibly even actually the style that has the LOWEST risk of this, but it's an important safety measure that will not hurt the beer at all. So since the only "downside" to this is having to wait 3-7 days longer, and the potential upside is the personal safety of not only you, your family, and friends, but also the safety of your beer (and really, isn't that what's most important? ), it would be fairly foolish to skip such a short waiting period simply out of impatience.