When to add hops for maximum flavor potential?

[MMBB]

Long story short, I had a beer that I really liked a few months back. It was a pale ale that had a finish that was a dead ringer the leftover milk in a bowl of trix or furity pebbles. Hops involved were centennial, zythos, and calypso.

My question is, were I to do something like a centennial blonde, is there a certain point during the boil that is better for extracting that more of that citrusy flavor form the centennials (or other hops for that matter)? Or would dry hopping be the answer?

 

[acidrain]

The end of the boil imparts the most aroma with very little actual bittering.
Dry hop takes that a step further, and that is where you'll get the most floral/citrus aromas/taste.

 

[wtfDean]

+1 to the dry hop. definitely the way to go for the fruity/flowery notes that some hop varieties exhibit. another way to preserve as much hop aroma as possible is to utilize a hop stand, as described in this BYO article.

 

[lgilmore]

flavor comes from the last 15 minutes or so to 0 in the boil. The first 60 to 30 would be more about bittering. Dry hopping is for the nose, which will make beer taste better because it smells better it tastes better.

 

[CastleHollow]

I get the richest hop flavor when I do a continuous hop: separate my flavoring additions into 5 minute increments, starting with about 40 minutes to go in the boil. You can also use a technique called "hop bursting," which is adding very little early additions but a huge amount of hops in the last 10-15 minutes of the boil.

 

[gwapogorilla]

Personally, I think 'hop bursting" provides the most flavor. All hops added at 20 minutes or less left in the boil time. I use it for a few recipes. I get the bitterness by adding more hops to reach the desired IBU. More hops later in the boil equals more flavor.
+1 on the dry hopping as well. In addition to hop bursting, you get a tastey beer.

 

[fartinmartin]

Do many of you put dry hops into the keg ?
Apparently that's what they did to keep the beer fresh in transit hundreds of years ago, has it gone out of fashion ?

 

[zarfus]

Do many of you put dry hops into the keg ?
Apparently that's what they did to keep the beer fresh in transit hundreds of years ago, has it gone out of fashion ?

Yep! History of the IPA: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India_Pale_Ale#History

You definitely can put hops in your keg. I'd recommend putting them in a sock so the bottom of your keg stays clean. Hop aroma dissipates over time, which is why pale ales/IPAs are best fresh. Many commercial brewers have multiple rounds of dry-hopping (as the hops sink to the bottom of the fermenter and lose flavor)

 

[wtfDean]

+1 to the hop bursting recommendation, i am about to make a SMaSH pale ale with only .5oz cascade added at 60 minutes for a few IBU and to prevent boilovers, then 3oz at knockout for 30-45 minutes

 

[eric19312]

I've found my late additions are really sensitive to chilling method. I switched from immersion to counterflow chilling lately and first few batches were much more bitter than expected with less flavor/aroma.

What I was doing with immersion chilling was to hit flame out, start up the chiller, then turn it off when the wort got under 200F. Usually about 190-195. Then add my flame-out hops and let them steep for 20 min or so. Kettle would fall to about 170 in that time. Then restart the chiller, get the wort down to 70, then whirlpool, settle and transfer. Took a long time!

When I converted to counterflow I was throwing my flame out hops in to 212 wort and stirring. After about 10 min I'd start running the wort through the chiller into fermenters. Gravity transfer. Took about 20 min for 10 gallons, at the end the wort was still over 190 before hitting the chiller. So the "flame out hops" were in 190-212 wort for nearly 30 min...

What I'm trying now is to run some of my wort through the chiller at flameout. First half gallon or so goes through without any cooling to sanitize (resanitize) the chiller, then when the outflow of the chiller hits 180 I turn on the water and chill about 1 gallon down to 65F. I collect all this wort in a bucket with minimal splashing, then add it all back to the kettle, give that a big stir and add my flame-out hops. This dropped my kettle temp to 190F. Let that rest 20 min then proceeded to chill and transfer and the wort going into the chiller was down to about 160 by the end of the transfer.

I've also tried starting with immersion chiller to get those first 20 degrees, then adding the hops. But I need a friend to bring an immersion chiller when I do that cause I cannibalized mine to build my counterflow...

 

[wtfDean]

thanks for the tip eric! i hadn't considered that since partial chilling with a counterflow seems to be a bear, hop standing becomes more difficult when you graduate beyond an immersion chiller

 

[stpug]

As you can see, several individual techniques or a combination of techniques can achieve that smack-you-in-your-face hop aroma and flavor profile; it just takes figuring out what works for you and your system. For sure, flavor and aroma come from the latter half of the boil into post-fermentation, and they generally go hand-in-hand. The aroma you get from dryhopping can actually enhance the hop flavor profile because your taste and smell senses are so closely tied together.

eric makes a good point about chilling, steeping, and changing processes, and how that affects the outcome of your beer. A perfect example of how "process" will affect your final beer profile (particularly with late addition hops).

You said that you had a beer that finished like a bowl of trix or fruity pebbles, was this a beer that you brewed or bought? If it was something that you brewed then your my advice would be to look back through your notes for that brewday to see how you went about adding your late addition hops (timing and amounts) as well as how you went about cooling and fermenting that batch of beer. Keep in mind that yeast strain will have an effect on the final hop profile. Start from there and try to incorporate some/all of the process into the centennial blonde to see if you can achieve similar results.

Good luck!

 

[MMBB]

Thanks for the tips everyone!

As you can see, several individual techniques or a combination of techniques can achieve that smack-you-in-your-face hop aroma and flavor profile; it just takes figuring out what works for you and your system. For sure, flavor and aroma come from the latter half of the boil into post-fermentation, and they generally go hand-in-hand. The aroma you get from dryhopping can actually enhance the hop flavor profile because your taste and smell senses are so closely tied together.

eric makes a good point about chilling, steeping, and changing processes, and how that affects the outcome of your beer. A perfect example of how "process" will affect your final beer profile (particularly with late addition hops).

You said that you had a beer that finished like a bowl of trix or fruity pebbles, was this a beer that you brewed or bought? If it was something that you brewed then your my advice would be to look back through your notes for that brewday to see how you went about adding your late addition hops (timing and amounts) as well as how you went about cooling and fermenting that batch of beer. Keep in mind that yeast strain will have an effect on the final hop profile. Start from there and try to incorporate some/all of the process into the centennial blonde to see if you can achieve similar results.

Good luck!

This was something that I had at a small brewery in Toronto. I emailed them for some guidance but I haven't heard back. The only ingredients listed were the hops in the first post and pale malt. Yeast listed was just a standard ale yeast.

 

[eric19312]

thanks for the tip eric! i hadn't considered that since partial chilling with a counterflow seems to be a bear, hop standing becomes more difficult when you graduate beyond an immersion chiller

I guess I am questioning whether counterflow / plate chilling is really the best step up from immersion chilling. Maybe Jamil Z's idea is a better way to go.

 

[wtfDean]

I guess I am questioning whether counterflow / plate chilling is really the best step up from immersion chilling. Maybe Jamil Z's idea is a better way to go.

i think that the counterflow/plate chiller method is a quicker way to cool beer, but this is just an example of how some gear, despite all flaws, never really becomes obsolete

 

[Ben58]

Which brewery was it? I have an inside to some of them and may be able to help.

 

[Shane5151]

I hop stand for an hour, putting the hops in a paint strainer bag. In fact the bag is in for the whole boil. Right after the hop stand is done, I pull the bag and continue to a counter flow. No clogging whatsoever.


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[adamelb]

In my tasting experience s-05 seems to brings out that fruity pebble like flavor from Centennial. I'm always asking what yeast when I taste IPA's with that flavor and the answer has always been s-05 or a proprietary house yeast. Best of luck with your brewing, cheers!

 

[drumuglyknuckles]

Thus was helpful, I'm def trying hop burst next batch

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[BreezyBrew]

Thus was helpful, I'm def trying hop burst next batch

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Do it! I love it