Whats your ethnicity?
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My pops is from Guyana which is in south america. The people there either look black ( from African slave trade) or Indian real Indian not the politically incorrect term we use here towards our native Americans. And my mom is from jamaica.. Think I have the most pigment in the thread so far lol... Anyways I know a couple black dudes that brew a bunch of Hispanic and Asian.. It's about the love of brewing as to why I do it. Not the only thing I ve done that people of my color seem to not be so into.. Buts that's never stopped me, in a way it's like a privilege, blazing a trail for others to walk upon. Cool thread
Caucasian, but probably the biggest mutt here...
English, French, French-Canadian, German, Russian, Polish, Scottish, and Sioux Native American. Our lineage in the US and Canada goes back to the early 1700s.
English, French, French-Canadian, German, Russian, Polish, Scottish, and Sioux Native American. Our lineage in the US and Canada goes back to the early 1700s.
I'm 100% Spanish, as in Spain. All my Grandparents were born in Spain, all in Andalusia as a matter of fact, and both couples ended up in the Detroit area, my mom and dad met at a Spanish dance at the local Hispanic social club. Whoever introduced them evidently did so because they were curious if their parents, being all from the same area knew each other. Which they didn't. So I am a pureblood ****.
The NYC area has plenty of active minority brewers. My club has a Mexican member and has had black members in the past. At every event, there's always been minority participants. Obviously home brewing makes us ALL minorities of the general public, and so in areas with less minorities in general, they'd be far less well represented within our hobby.
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It's no secret that stereotypes really do dictate our futures! (Dave Chapelle)
Homebrewing is definitely among the "mostly white" past-times....
Finding a dark skinned dude in a homebrew shop is as difficult as finding an African American woman at a country music concert.
Homebrewing is definitely among the "mostly white" past-times....
Finding a dark skinned dude in a homebrew shop is as difficult as finding an African American woman at a country music concert.
jerrodm
Well-Known Member
I just can't resist posting links to a few recent discussions of the "white folks claiming Native American ancestry" topic. Turns out (see the study referenced in the Slate article) that for many people who think that "way back somewhere I've got Native American blood," it may not the case.
Full disclosure: I'm a white American guy, but there's a strong family belief that somewhere back on my dad's side there is some Native American, Blackfoot to be exact. As you might suspect, I'm a little skeptical, in spite of my somewhat-darker-than-your-average-white-guy complexion and somewhat-higher-and-broader-than-average cheekbones.
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_...ican_how_many_people_have_that_heritage_.html
http://www.npr.org/2012/06/07/154519834/proving-native-american-ancestry-can-be-tricky
Full disclosure: I'm a white American guy, but there's a strong family belief that somewhere back on my dad's side there is some Native American, Blackfoot to be exact. As you might suspect, I'm a little skeptical, in spite of my somewhat-darker-than-your-average-white-guy complexion and somewhat-higher-and-broader-than-average cheekbones.
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_...ican_how_many_people_have_that_heritage_.html
http://www.npr.org/2012/06/07/154519834/proving-native-american-ancestry-can-be-tricky
You can tell that to my great grandfather born in the late 1800s. His face looked like the dude on a Buffalo nickel. He had two fullblood Sioux parents from North Dakota, whose parents' parents were also full blood Sioux. Therefore, my GG was 100% Sioux Native American. He fell in love with a French-Canadian woman to produce my Grandpa. Now this would only make me a measily 12.5% Sioux, but I'm still very proud of knowing my family history. Though it's not as if I'm claiming any reparations
I'm just a white guy.
CreamyGoodness
Well-Known Member
Firstly, discussion of race and racism are not one and the same. Racism is forming a group of assumptions about people, either individually or as a group, due to their race. Using the term "racism" in a flippant manner in an attempt to discredit those who use the term in an effort to combat it (racism itself that is, not the term) is childish and frankly, stupid. Not to mention it is a terrible rhetoric tool.
I've often found the fact that the number of people of color brewing is far lower than that of caucasian brewers something of a headscratcher. You are likely to find more white folks at a country western concert because country music sprung up out of certain cultural groups and geographical areas. You're likely to find Jamaican Americans at a Jamaican restaurant (assuming its GOOD Jamaican food). But brewing? Every culture on the planet that I can think of has or has had a cultural history of brewing fermented beverages. Why does this change in the confines of the US? Even more strangely, why are most brewers that I meet either in person or online under 50 years old? There are exceptions of course, but Id say that the mean age of brewers in the States at least is in HIS (we established most brewers are male) mid thirties to early forties...
I simply don't have a good hypothesis for this.
I've often found the fact that the number of people of color brewing is far lower than that of caucasian brewers something of a headscratcher. You are likely to find more white folks at a country western concert because country music sprung up out of certain cultural groups and geographical areas. You're likely to find Jamaican Americans at a Jamaican restaurant (assuming its GOOD Jamaican food). But brewing? Every culture on the planet that I can think of has or has had a cultural history of brewing fermented beverages. Why does this change in the confines of the US? Even more strangely, why are most brewers that I meet either in person or online under 50 years old? There are exceptions of course, but Id say that the mean age of brewers in the States at least is in HIS (we established most brewers are male) mid thirties to early forties...
I simply don't have a good hypothesis for this.
CreamyGoodness
Well-Known Member
Oh, I'm 3/4 Sicilian American and 1/4 Polish American. White aside from my cheeks, which are red due to dermatitus rosea.
If I recall correctly, according to the Census, Hispanic is indeed considered an ethnicity. It's not considered a race. And if you interpret the difference is biological vs. social/cultural, I'd say that's pretty accurate.
Edit: now that I'm thinking about it, "Caucasian" is a race, not an ethnicity.
But ultimately I think that's a semantics argument.
I think there ARE older brewers, but not online. My dear friends from Texas brew, and I didn't met them until I kayaked by their house and saw a corney on their deck, so I made sure to go meet them! It turns out that they've been brewing a long time. He's 65, she's about 62. They are well educated (retired teachers), but not online. They are not here on HBT, and they have no idea that I'm a moderator of such a forum. So I think that there are still alot of "older" brewers, but not online. That might be one reason- younger people are more likely to be online on forums and finding their knowledge on the internet.
When my Texan friends came to visit in October, I walked them through an AG batch and gave them a couple of Igloo MLTs. SHE was actually the one who wanted to brew, and learn AG, and not him. I don't know why that surprised me, but it did! She sent me a photo about a week ago of her first AG batch! When we get to Texas in January, I can't wait to try her beer! (both white as snow, by the way!)
Anyway, I think more women brew than we think because they aren't as active on forums dominated by males.
When you think about it, this forum is very geek-heavy. I mean that in the most loving way! Many of our active members are engineers or IT folks. This forum appeals to the geek/nerd type I think. I do think the Coopers/John Bull/Mr. Beer type of brewing appeals more to the rest of homebrewers.
Because the IT/engineer/geek types tend to be better employed, it's not likely that I would bump into them at places like the NHC. The stuff I do (beer travels, NHC, buying bling) is probably prohibitive cost-wise for the average homebrewer. I think that maybe is why I don't know too many "blue collar" type of brewers. I think they are out there, but not so much on the forum and not going to the NHCs and such. I think they may be buying beer kits, and making them, though!
CreamyGoodness
Well-Known Member
In my studies of world history (3.7 GPA in History and American Studies. Also, I'm reasonably intelligent :cross, the best answer to "what is the difference between the terms hispanic and latino?" is "only one of them was part of a PR campaign". Right around the time of the American Civil War, the French Second Empire invaded (or "intervened" as it has been coined in history books) Mexico, having had formed a pact with the Spanish and English (both of whom pulled out of the debacle when they realized France looked to take over the entire country, rather than a small part).
The word "Latino" was coined by the French, who sought to calm the fears of the Mexicans (particularly the Mexican nobility) that would typically follow a foreign invasion. "We all have Catholicism and Latin in common! We are all Latinos!"
This went over like a lead balloon. The French were expelled from Mexico, the papacy backed the new Mexican empire (and chastised the French). Only the term "latino" is left in Mexico to show for the ordeal.
By the way, at the time, President Lincoln issued something of a plantiff "heeeeyyyy... cut that out...." to France, but could not commit troups (he was a bit busy at the time). That's another story.
, the best answer to "what is the difference between the terms hispanic and latino?" is "only one of them was part of a PR campaign". Right around the time of the American Civil War, the French Second Empire invaded (or "intervened" as it has been coined in history books) Mexico, having had formed a pact with the Spanish and English (both of whom pulled out of the debacle when they realized France looked to take over the entire country, rather than a small part). The word "Latino" was coined by the French, who sought to calm the fears of the Mexicans (particularly the Mexican nobility) that would typically follow a foreign invasion. "We all have Catholicism and Latin in common! We are all Latinos!"
This went over like a lead balloon. The French were expelled from Mexico, the papacy backed the new Mexican empire (and chastised the French). Only the term "latino" is left in Mexico to show for the ordeal.
By the way, at the time, President Lincoln issued something of a plantiff "heeeeyyyy... cut that out...." to France, but could not commit troups (he was a bit busy at the time). That's another story.
Maybe- but here's the thing. My mother's family is originally from the south. We definitely had African and Native American (my grandma was part Shawnee). But since it was absolutely taboo for the races to mix, anybody who was dark was "French". One was "Hungarian" and she looks exactly like a Mayan from the Yucatan. Sure, there were whispers, but if you could "pass" you were fine. I remember a cousin being born, and my grandma (the white grandma), seeing the baby and saying "Oh, good. She can pass.". "Passing" meant being able to pass as a white person, of course.
I remember colored and white movie theatres, and colored and white water fountains. If you were "colored" at all, you were NOT white.
And so we were all white, but some of the darker members of my family were "French" or "Hungarian". To admit you were part Native American meant no job, except as a maid or hired hand.
CreamyGoodness
Well-Known Member
All very interesting points, Yoop. I spend most of my time in NYC, so my experiences with brewers in real time is influenced by that fact.
HoppyDaze
Well-Known Member
Irish, German and Native American (Iroquois)....the alcoholic perfect storm.
Yooper, my first partner at work who is a brother to me (different from like a brother), is adopted from Honduras and is 100% Mayan. He's very proud of his heritage and very active in Native American groups locally and nationally. I have two daughters and my wife decided she definitely does not want to go through pregnancy again, but we may adopt a son in the future, and both agreed because of my brother we would adopt a Mayan from Honduras.
cluckk
Well-Known Member
Why is any mention of race or noticing of race considered racist? This isn't meant as an attack on PackerfaninSanDiego, but a reference to something that really bothers me. Sorry, but the first thing noticed about a person is the color of their skin--it's not racist, just simple observation. The second thing noticed is gender--and it's not sexist. We humans put things and even people into categories. It is how we are wired to think. The only way we will become a post-racial society is if we can talk about our features and differences without people of any color taking offense.
English, Irish, Scottish and what Grandma called Pennsylvania Dutch (German). Apparently long line of alcohol swilling outlaws half ran to America other half sent to Australia. Great Uncle ran a still and liked to hide it on Sheriff's property.
jerrodm
Well-Known Member
As a professional economist, I hope I qualify as geeky too! Any other social scientists on the forum? How about "real" scientists--physicists, biologists, etc?
I wonder if it's really true that engineers have more representation here, or just that their particular expertise is more usually germane to the topics of discussion. For example, there are lots of discussions about brew kettle/MLT/fermenter design, experimental procedures and results or other topics that engineers would be able to speak professionally to. There aren't too many threads on here about estimating supply/demand elasticities for craft brew, or the problems of market failure as applied to brewing supplies and equipment. If there were, I'd happily chime in!
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f14/whats-your-occupation-engineer-non-engineer-135492/
There's a thread asking that same question. Engineers aren't the majority, but 40%. So I'd venture to say there's more engineers of one stripe or another than any other profession on this board.
Me, I'm one of those apparently elusive blue collar brewers.
jerrodm
Well-Known Member
That's fascinating background Yooper. I hope it was clear that I wasn't poking holes in any individual poster's claimed Native American ancestry with my previous comment, just observing that it's not uncommon for there to be claims when they might not really mean anything. For the record, I think the probability that I have Native American heritage is about the same as anyone else's, despite that fact that it's the "received wisdom" in my family that we have a Native American ancestor aways back somewhere.
I would actually be pretty interested to know my genetic makeup, since I look more or less like your average white American, but my family history (particularly on my dad's side) is almost completely unknown. It would be cool to see how the map looks. Maybe someday when genetic testing is cheaper I'll try it just for the heck of it. I wouldn't be shocked if there were some surprises in there somewhere!
OP
OP
Airplanedoc
Well-Known Member
Ancestry DNA tests are down to $180 each for maternal and paternal. Paternal tests tell you the most as far as where you are from. The newer test gives you a regional distribution.
To Yoopers earlier point
There was a show on PBS awhile back, where they ask people where their family was from, as well as why they believed that. They then DNA tested them and gave the them the results. The belief that there was Native American (Asian in DNA testing) blood in the family ran equally among Caucasian and African American participants shown. In many cases it was not the case. There also had a couple people who believed to be full blooded Native American, who tested not to be.
It just goes to show that what has been passed down thru the generations of a family was selective, not necessarily the whole truth.
I encourage everybody to explore their family history thru both DNA and records. For me it was a fascinating journey sorting fact from fiction, and learning interesting facts about history and family along the way.
To Yoopers earlier point
There was a show on PBS awhile back, where they ask people where their family was from, as well as why they believed that. They then DNA tested them and gave the them the results. The belief that there was Native American (Asian in DNA testing) blood in the family ran equally among Caucasian and African American participants shown. In many cases it was not the case. There also had a couple people who believed to be full blooded Native American, who tested not to be.
It just goes to show that what has been passed down thru the generations of a family was selective, not necessarily the whole truth.
I encourage everybody to explore their family history thru both DNA and records. For me it was a fascinating journey sorting fact from fiction, and learning interesting facts about history and family along the way.
huntingohio
Well-Known Member
PA Dutch usually means amish, which is ironic because amish dosnt mean german although they speak it. They are a mixture of german, swiss, netherlands, and eastern eroupean decent.
one of the proud few. hahaha!!
