Welch's Grape Juice Wine

[Brewbuzzard]

Couple of questions:

1.) @Yooper says to bottle when clear.
I’m unclear on what clear looks like for wine? I took this photo, does that look clear?

2.) i moved to secondary after 30 days but then it’s been sitting on that yeast cake (see photo) for an additional 2 months, is that ok?

3.) It’s been fermenting for a total of 3 months, do you think it ready to bottle?

4.) I just had a taste of it and it was HOT! I was shocked. It wasn’t as hot tasting as whisky or something like that but it was hot and not wine like. So do I need to water it down or will it mellow a lot in the bottle?

We're you able to get your wine bright?

 

[Kalaloch]

We're you able to get your wine bright?

Yep finally broke down and bought some clarifying agent (forgot the name) it is now very clear and ready to bottle, i snuck a taste and it is really delicious

 

[Whitney Enlow]

Hi all! New to the forum.

I have a question in regards to back sweetening. I plan to do this in a day or two (I have already added the campden and sorbate). My dilemma is this.. my primary is 1.4 gal and my secondary is 1 gal. I will need to rack the wine back into my primary in order to have the space to back sweeten. Is it going to be ok that I have some headspace for a day or two? Or would it be best if I just go ahead and bottle rather than waiting a day or two in order to ensure fermentation doesn't start back up? Thanks in advance for any feedback!

 

[z-bob]

Hi all! New to the forum.

I have a question in regards to back sweetening. I plan to do this in a day or two (I have already added the campden and sorbate). My dilemma is this.. my primary is 1.4 gal and my secondary is 1 gal. I will need to rack the wine back into my primary in order to have the space to back sweeten. Is it going to be ok that I have some headspace for a day or two? Or would it be best if I just go ahead and bottle rather than waiting a day or two in order to ensure fermentation doesn't start back up? Thanks in advance for any feedback!

How much wine do you have? Do you have any canning jars (for the overflow)? You can also just drink the excess.

 

[Kalaloch]

@wjenlow have you tasted it yet? I just did 1 Gallon and did NOT back sweeten. I have aged it for 3 months and it is really sweet for a wine, definitely not a dry wine. Maybe it was the yeast I used but you may like it unsweetened?

 

[Whitney Enlow]

@wjenlow have you tasted it yet? I just did 1 Gallon and did NOT back sweeten. I have aged it for 3 months and it is really sweet for a wine, definitely not a dry wine. Maybe it was the yeast I used but you may like it unsweetened?

It is definitely sweeter than I thought it was going to be.. I think I might end up leaving it as-is after all. Thanks for responding!

 

[mmb]

Hi all! New to the forum.

I have a question in regards to back sweetening. I plan to do this in a day or two (I have already added the campden and sorbate). My dilemma is this.. my primary is 1.4 gal and my secondary is 1 gal. I will need to rack the wine back into my primary in order to have the space to back sweeten. Is it going to be ok that I have some headspace for a day or two? Or would it be best if I just go ahead and bottle rather than waiting a day or two in order to ensure fermentation doesn't start back up? Thanks in advance for any feedback!

I backsweeten at bottling with a can of concentrate per 5G. Makes a nice table wine.

 

[Kalaloch]

Thanks Yooper just finished drinking my last bottle of this. Very happy for with the results for my first time making wine.

One question...
I’m not a wine connoisseur by any means but this wine did seem very *thin* or not a lot of *body*, not sure how to exactly explain it in wine speak, but is there a way to add more body to this next time?

 

[NeverDie]

@ Yooper: What a great thread this is!

I've started making my first wine fermentation using bread yeast and the OP instructions. From some googling I've read that the ideal fermentation temperature for bread yeast is 95F (but the same question applies--see below--about Premier Cuvee wine yeast). Being impatient, I want this fermentation to go as quickly as possible. Is there anything wrong with fermenting the wine at 95F? I'm able to control the "must" temperature to within 1F, and I can dial in any temperature that I want to. That's because I have the fermentation vessel sitting in a water bath, and I can control the water bath temperature to within 1 degree with a thermostat control and a temperature probe. I just wanted to be crystal clear that I'm *not* talking about ambient air temperature, but rather the temperature of the "must" itself.

Please advise, and thank you again for such a wonderful thread!

[Edit:
Here's the link about the optimal temperature for bread yeast (from its perspective) being 95F: (... sorry the forum software won't let me post the link because it thinks it may be spam). It also graphs how fermentation speed increases with temperature.

Of course, wine isn't bread, but wouldn't the yeast be happiest at the same 95F regardless of what the growth medium is? Well, I can only guess, which is why I'm asking.

When I've read forum posts about wine fermenting temperatures, the answers that typically get posted are of the form "Well, *I* like to ferment at X temperature, and so that's what I recommend for you." The trouble with that is that it's just some unknown guy's opinion, and for all I know he never tried a different temperature, or else maybe arrived at that conclusion from noisy data. So, what I'm looking for here is some science in the answer, not just a string of anecdotes.

The problem with looking at the spec sheet for a wine yeast (which I'll try in the next batch) is that it gives a fermentation *range*. It doesn't come out and say what the most optimal temperature is in that range. So, for example, the Premier Cuvee wine yeast (and I was going to post a link here to the specsheet, but again was prevented) has a temperature range of 45F-95F. But does that mean anything in that range is perfectly fine (in which case, why go slow when you can go fast), or is optimal near the midpoint, or....? ]

 

[Blacksmith1]

If you paste the links inline we can copy/paste them into the browser to get there.
Oh, and I cannot answer any of your questions

 

[NeverDie]

If you paste the links inline we can copy/paste them into the browser to get there.
Oh, and I cannot answer any of your questions

Well, that's the trouble. It won't let me paste a url without it setting off its spam alarm. It literally will *not* let me post it. I'm guessing that's because I'm a brand new forum member and not yet included in the circle of trust.

However, for anyone who wants to read the source material, I think we can work around this by me giving you enough info that by typing it into google it will be the #1 search result. Then just click on that link.
1.
Yeast Treatise - Dough Fermentation & Temperature - The Artisan

and
2. "premier cuvee datasheet"

 

[Blacksmith1]

Have you tried the little chain looking emblem in the post box. the one without the x is to add a link the one with is to remove it. Highlighting text allows one to put the link where you want it.
EDIT: interesting info, and I see what you mean. I believe the difference is that baking requires the dough to rise so they give the best temp to achieve this in the shortest time, whereas with fermenting wine/mead/cider the timeframe is much longer and conditions vary enough that they give the range in which the yeasts stay viable and do not produce unwanted effects. Not sure if there is any data on best temp for this purpose.

 

[ModlrMike]

I was cleaning up my brewing area the other day, and stumbled across a batch of Welch's white that I made in March 2012, or at least that's when it went into bulk aging. I have to say that it tasted pretty darn good. I did need to add some sweetness, as we tend to favour sweeter Reisling type wines, but still darn good after aging almost seven years.

I'm encouraged to make another batch, as I have a whole bunch of cans of frozen concentrate. This time I think I'll use D47. My recipe will be slightly modified from the original. I might decrease the amount of dextrose by the value of the peach punch... but then again maybe not.

2 cans (11.5 oz) Welch's 100% frozen grape concentrate
1 can (295ml) Minute Maid frozen peach punch
500g dextrose (corn sugar)
1 tsp acid blend
1 tsp pectic enzyme
1 tsp yeast nutrient
water to make 1 gallon
D47 wine yeast

 

[NeverDie]

I was cleaning up my brewing area the other day, and stumbled across a batch of Welch's white that I made in March 2012, or at least that's when it went into bulk aging. I have to say that it tasted pretty darn good. I did need to add some sweetness, as we tend to favour sweeter Reisling type wines, but still darn good after aging almost seven years.

I'm encouraged to make another batch, as I have a whole bunch of cans of frozen concentrate. This time I think I'll use D47. My recipe will be slightly modified from the original. I might decrease the amount of dextrose by the value of the peach punch... but then again maybe not.

2 cans (11.5 oz) Welch's 100% frozen grape concentrate
1 can (295ml) Minute Maid frozen peach punch
500g dextrose (corn sugar)
1 tsp acid blend
1 tsp pectic enzyme
1 tsp yeast nutrient
water to make 1 gallon
D47 wine yeast

I'm curious: did you arrive at the 1 tsp acid blend figure as the result of using an acid test kit, or is it instead based on your prior experience?

 

[ModlrMike]

I'm curious: did you arrive at the 1 tsp acid blend figure as the result of using an acid test kit, or is it instead based on your prior experience?

TBH, I'm guessing. I think that the peach is going to be particularly sweet, so the acid is to add some balance. That being said, the punch has Vit C (ascorbic acid), so in the end I may not need to add anything. I'm going to make it without any additional acid, and see where it goes.

 

[MiBeerMan]

im going to attemp my first wine tonight but had a question. Can I substitute 1 can of concentrate for some organic 100% grape juice? Ingredients say juice from ripe whole organic concord grapes

 

[z-bob]

im going to attemp my first wine tonight but had a question. Can I substitute 1 can of concentrate for some organic 100% grape juice? Ingredients say juice from ripe whole organic concord grapes

You're talking about bottled grape juice? That works fine if it has no preservatives (vitamin C is okay.) You'll leave out the water, obviously.

 

[MiBeerMan]

yes, that is correct. Just making sure. Brand name is R.W. Knudsen. I added an entire 32 ounce bottle. 1 can of grape concentrate and about 1.5 lbs sugar. I finally got it up to 1.110 for starters. Im going to add the yeast Premier Classique tomorrow. I also did this same recipe but with strawberry concentrate

 

[MiBeerMan]

just did a hydro check and its sitting right around 1.024 (10%). Trying to get it down near 13%. But had a sip from the reading and its going to be hard to wait the secondary time.
This is my first attempt at wine. But do people generally not cold crash wine. I noticed people just campden tablet and potassium sorbate it

 

[NeverDie]

In terms of cost, the frozen juice concentrate from the OP may make it a win. If, on the other hand, you're using bottled grape juice, I'm just now realizing it may actually work out to be less expensive to buy a gallon of Gallo wine (or equivalent). Probably the main reason to do this though is as an introduction to fermentation, and for that the tuition fee is pretty low.

 

[z-bob]

IIRC, a gallon of Aldi grape juice is about $5.30. The other ingredient costs are negligible. I don't think there's any wine even close to that price. The closest thing I've seen is 5L box wines at about $18 for decent ones (like Peter Vella burgundy.)

 

[NeverDie]

OK, I stand corrected. Looking into it, it's about $11 for a 4L bottle of Carlo Rossi, which may (?) be one of the least expensive. I had thought it was closer to $7.

 

[Blacksmith1]

Rossi 3L bottles are $11 or more here in FL we can't the get 4L bottles.

 

[z-bob]

Use the cheapest bottled juice that doesn't have preservatives. Reconstituted frozen juice concentrate is okay too. I would not add frozen concentrate (undiluted) to juice to boost the flavor and alcohol, because Concord grape juice has too much flavor already (that's why I cut it with Niagara juice; the first time I was trying to make a rose, but I ended up with a nice red) Add sugar to bring the OG up to (if I remember right) 1.095 or 1.100, and add nutrients. Pitch your yeast. When it looks done but not crystal clear yet, rack to another jug to get rid of the sediment, add whatever the recommended rate of Campden tablet is, and top up the jug with juice or water (or marbles.) You can rack it one more time when it's totally clear, or bottle it at that point.

The Campden is to keep it from oxidizing; you can leave it out but the wine won't age very well without it. I found that out with the first couple of [3 or 4 gallon] batches that I made. If you're going to drink it all within a month or if you're making sparkling wine, don't worry about it. Sorbate is just for sweet wines. I like my wine dry, but not "bone dry", and I get that by not using champagne yeast.

 

[RockyMtnGT]

The Campden is to keep it from oxidizing; you can leave it out but the wine won't age very well without it. I found that out with the first couple of [3 or 4 gallon] batches that I made. If you're going to drink it all within a month or if you're making sparkling wine, don't worry about it. Sorbate is just for sweet wines. I like my wine dry, but not "bone dry", and I get that by not using champagne yeast.

You could also just purge the secondary vessel with CO2 couldn't you?

 

[MiBeerMan]

z-bob, so what is your favorite recipe you like? I tried googling the Niagara juice but Welchs doesn't sell it here where i live. Any suggestions on this

 

[NeverDie]

I get that by not using champagne yeast.

Which yeast do you use?

 

[z-bob]

You could also just purge the secondary vessel with CO2 couldn't you?

It's oxidation in the bottles that I'm concerned about. I add the sulfites before then so I get some benefit in the secondary as well.

z-bob, so what is your favorite recipe you like? I tried googling the Niagara juice but Welchs doesn't sell it here where i live. Any suggestions on this

They don't sell white grape juice?

Which yeast do you use?

I don't remember. I mostly make beer and cider, and just do wine occasionally. I think I've used Cote des Blancs, D47, and K1V-1116.

 

[NeverDie]

They don't sell white grape juice?

I think the issue may be that not all white grapes are Niagra. Last time I checked, Welsh's was rather coy about naming the grape type it was using in its white grape juice.

 

[Davedrinksbeer]

just did a hydro check and its sitting right around 1.024 (10%). Trying to get it down near 13%. But had a sip from the reading and its going to be hard to wait the secondary time.
This is my first attempt at wine. But do people generally not cold crash wine. I noticed people just campden tablet and potassium sorbate it

Don’t cold crash wine,, to get wine to clear you let it sit or use something like super kleer.
I use potassium metabisulphite and potassium sorbate.