Water Analysis

[bruhaha]

Now that I have experience under my belt with extracts and AG, I have learned that small details make differences in beers. I used city tap water for many batches and knew the analysis the city offered. I switched to bottled water from a water cooler company and use this same water for all coolers in my business.

I asked the supplier for an analysis and he just shrugged his shoulders and said its distilled water and totally pure. Ok, this tells me absolutely zero. So, how do I find out more of the water I am using and can I have testing done locally to see what adjustments I may need?

Thanks to all.

 

[douglasbarbin]

If it is distilled water, then there aren't any ions in it, or at least not an appreciable amount of anything. The only thing you would need to know is the pH, which is usually neutral or slightly acidic in the case of distilled water.

 

[bruhaha]

If it is distilled water, then there aren't any ions in it, or at least not an appreciable amount of anything. The only thing you would need to know is the pH, which is usually neutral or slightly acidic in the case of distilled water.

Well, now that I am thinking deeper into this, I looked at a bottle of the water he told me was distilled. I don't think he is correct as the label states in small letters, "reverse osmosis". Does this change anything? I did a ph test before I started looking into this water and the ph was 7.2.

 

[douglasbarbin]

Reverse Osmosis is essentially the same as distilled water. The only difference is in the way the ions are removed (reverse osmosis filtering instead of distillation).

I am a little surprised to hear that the pH of reverse osmosis water is above 7, although I suppose it's possible or within the margin of error for your meter.

 

[bruhaha]

Reverse Osmosis is essentially the same as distilled water. The only difference is in the way the ions are removed (reverse osmosis filtering instead of distillation).

I am a little surprised to hear that the pH of reverse osmosis water is above 7, although I suppose it's possible or within the margin of error for your meter.

I have an inexpensive ph meter (under $25) but its new and I calibrated it several times with the dissolved solutions included and it came right back with the same reading each time. Then I tested my water. In this regard the meter seems accurate, but if the price is an indication, I don't really know.

 

[dsniegocki]

reverse osmosis (RO water) is virtually neutral, just like distilled. Several folks (myself included) use it as a "blank slate" to which desired minerals are added to match a certain flavor profile. It's a "good" thing, in that you can create what you like.

You should be able to get it tested locally at a pool supply store, but don't be surprised if most all levels come out close to zero for RO water. If you'd like to be more precise for brewing, I strongly recommend having it tested by Ward Laboratories online, they do an analysis specifically for brewers. I had them do mine and they are great:

https://producers.wardlab.com/brewerskitorder.php

Important note is that the MASH pH is what is important... several factors there, including of course your water but also your grain bill. If you're starting with RO water you'll likely be adding a tad bit of acid (ie phosphoric or lactic) to your lighter beers to bring the pH down to where it needs to be.

Slightly off topic, but FYI you can make certain mineral additions to a finished glass of beer to see what the flavor effects are, rather than just experimenting with your strike water. Martin Brungard (creator of the excellent Bru'n water spreadsheet) has got some comments around here along those lines, I think. Something I wish I'd known earlier in the process.

Good luck!

 

[bruhaha]

reverse osmosis (RO water) is virtually neutral, just like distilled. Several folks (myself included) use it as a "blank slate" to which desired minerals are added to match a certain flavor profile. It's a "good" thing, in that you can create what you like.

You should be able to get it tested locally at a pool supply store, but don't be surprised if most all levels come out close to zero for RO water. If you'd like to be more precise for brewing, I strongly recommend having it tested by Ward Laboratories online, they do an analysis specifically for brewers. I had them do mine and they are great:

https://producers.wardlab.com/brewerskitorder.php

Important note is that the MASH pH is what is important... several factors there, including of course your water but also your grain bill. If you're starting with RO water you'll likely be adding a tad bit of acid (ie phosphoric or lactic) to your lighter beers to bring the pH down to where it needs to be.

Slightly off topic, but FYI you can make certain mineral additions to a finished glass of beer to see what the flavor effects are, rather than just experimenting with your strike water. Martin Brungard (creator of the excellent Bru'n water spreadsheet) has got some comments around here along those lines, I think. Something I wish I'd known earlier in the process.

Good luck!

Glad you mentioned this. Assuming I have a "blank slate" of a water profile to work with, I tested my ph at 7.2. What would I want my strike water to test prior to mashing?

I make a good many Pilsner beers, and really pay strict attention to all details like ferm temps, lagering times, etc. My beers are good but I think I need to adjust my "blank slate" a bit to get to the award winning category.

Any suggestions are more than appreciated!!

 

[douglasbarbin]

Glad you mentioned this. Assuming I have a "blank slate" of a water profile to work with, I tested my ph at 7.2. What would I want my strike water to test prior to mashing?

I make a good many Pilsner beers, and really pay strict attention to all details like ferm temps, lagering times, etc. My beers are good but I think I need to adjust my "blank slate" a bit to get to the award winning category.

Any suggestions are more than appreciated!!

Doesn't matter what it is prior to mashing. What matters is the pH during (and after) the mash.

 

[dsniegocki]

If you are making a pilsner with distilled water and no extra acid, your pH might be a bit high. It depends on the water volumes and grain bill, as much as the strike water pH. A spreadsheet such as Brun Water takes these parameters and helps with what additions to make.

 

[bruhaha]

I was discussing with an online friend that I enjoyed Munich Helles brews when I was in Germany. He gave me the grain and hop bill and said add 1/2 teaspoon of Epson salts and 1/2 teaspoon CaCl to your water before mashing.

If I am on the right track, this addition will slightly lower the ph balance of my water from 7.2. And I assume this is what I need, but he never asked what my water's ph was at to begin. I am only assuming he was trying to emulate the water chemistry Hofbrauhaus is using. Trying to learn!!

 

[dsniegocki]

You are definitely on the right track. It is a combination of the water and the grains (and their respective amounts) that determines the final mash pH; if the grains don't put you in the correct range, then acid is often used. You are not targeting a water pH, you are targeting a mash pH (around 5.2) for optimum conversion.

Your friend didn't ask about your water pH because those are mainly flavor additions he suggested. They are interrelated, but I have found it helpful to think of target mash pH and flavor profiles as two separate things.

Water chemistry is complicated and I certainly don't even know the half of it. But take solace in the fact that you are already making great beer, these are nuances that just make it even better and more enjoyable!

 

[bruhaha]

I am trying to get up to speed with water chemistry for general brewing, plus I am aiming to make my first sour (gose style) this summer. My plan is to bring my wort ph down to 4.5ish with lactic acid before pitching lacto for the souring process. I then will sour the wort to 3.4ish before I boil prior to yeast pitch for fermentation. I was one of the rare ones who enjoyed chemistry in college so this is interesting to me. I truly believe understanding water chemistry management will add a strong dimension to my brewing enjoyment.

 

[dsniegocki]

If you enjoy chemistry then you are going to have a blast with this stuff, and will absolutely make better, more consistent beer. Also interesting to you will likely be the elimination of oxygen in the process (definitely post-fermentation, and there is lively debate as to the effects during the mash and boil as well). It has been said that as little as a shot glass size of ambient air introduced to the beer after fermentation can significantly affect its flavor.