US-05 fermentation in mid to high 70s? (Or other yeast suggestions)

[KepowOb]

I have a keezer that I'll up the temperature on and use for temp control for fermentation. Not a big deal at all.

But I was wondering if at times I could skip that step from time to time. The room I ferment in is ~68F this time of year. I usually chill to ~65, pitch, and then put it into the keezer set to whatever temp I need.

Current batch is using US-05 and I set the controller to 68. Once fermentation kicks off, it'll get up to 71 pretty fast, and then my controller will kick in and keep it in that 68-71 window.

I have no idea how high it would go without the temp control.

I have heard US-05 will throw off more esters at lower temps, but fermentis says it's working range goes up to 82 (!). Seems high to me, and I'm wondering what would happen at those temps?

I enjoy Saison and plan to do some once things heat up, but I feel like it's too low right now to get the esters I enjoy out of Saison yeast, and I don't have any way of heating for something like a kviet yeast that enjoys high temperatures as well.

Most ale yeasts seem to like a pretty narrow window. I know a lot of people say US-05 is the same as wlp001 and wyeast 1056, but they have much narrower windows for temperature.

I've looked around for info on us-05 at the higher end of its listed range, but most info I'm finding is about the lower end. Any insights or suggestions would be great.

 

[Miraculix]

I brewed with us05 at room temperature a lot, in recent times not so often any more, because I'm more into character at the moment.

But anyway, 05 is probably the most forgiving yeast there is, you should be fine without controlling it. My beers turned out fine without.

 

[thehaze]

US-05 will do fine at 80-82F, but there are plenty of Kveik yeast you can use.

I've used Nottingham, Windsor, K-97 and S-33 with succes, at room temperature - this means room temperature was 68-70F and fermentation temperature was likely 76-80F, as it is exothermic. All of them behaved well. But all of them have character, and will produce esters.

 

[palmtrees]

I get a lot of fusel alcohols with us05 at room temperature. I would try kveik instead. Lutra is a great option if you're going for a clean ale profile. It will ferment clean at almost any temp. It's extremely forgiving.

 

[kh54s10]

I've never tried letting US-05 get warm. I have often heard "Don't let it get over 70 degrees. I aim for 65. I would not suggest getting anywhere near 82.

Kveik yeasts are popular at present and I believe they tolerate quite high temperatures,

 

[Miraculix]

Problem with kveik is, they taste like kveik. If you like that, it's a really good choice. If not, then this won't work. Also Lutra.

 

[KepowOb]

Thanks for the input everyone.
Found a LHBS that's a bit further out than my regular one that has Lutra... I almost feel like finding a way to do a 2-gallon split batch on a simple APA or something to see what happens.

 

[easttex]

Thanks for the input everyone.
Found a LHBS that's a bit further out than my regular one that has Lutra... I almost feel like finding a way to do a 2-gallon split batch on a simple APA or something to see what happens.

Pre-temp control, I brewed with US-05 almost exclusively. Since I began using Lutra though, I've all but stopped using US-05.

They say Lutra ferments out cleanly at temps up to the 90's but I've never bothered to find out. I use Lutra at whatever temperature the guest bathroom is and it ferments very cleanly for me 65°F-76°F. It also drops cleanly and make a clear beer. I wish this yeast had been available when I started brewing a decade ago.

 

[dmtaylor]

I made a very lager-like blonde ale in mid 70s F using good old S-04. Not fruity, very clean and clear as crystal.

 

[DuncB]

I have heard US-05 will throw off more esters at lower temps, but fermentis says it's working range goes up to 82 (!). Seems high to me, and I'm wondering what would happen at those temps?

I don't have any way of heating for something like a kviet yeast that enjoys high temperatures as well.

I think it throws off more esters at higher temps.

I can get the kviek hot with a sleeping bag over the top. Raised off the ground and bottles of hot water around it, I change these morning and evening. You probably will get more yeast expression with hot kveik that isn't under pressure. Under pressure and hot it seems super clean to me for lagers and stouts and keg ales. I wouldn't use it for a cask style bitter though.
Great thing about kveik is drying the residue and just repitch some dried flakes you have kept in the freezer. It's too easy really and shouldn't be allowed.

 

[Snark_Wolf_Brewing]

Lutra is probably one of the cleanest kveik strains out there. I recently used it to brew a pseudo-lager.

 

[jerrylotto]

A 5 gallon batch on average probably releases between 15W - 20W during active fermentation with termp control. It can easily raise the temperature by 15F above ambient without active cooling at this stage, which in turn speeds up fermentation and releases energy even more rapidly. Probably the best thing you could do if you want to brew without active temp control is scale down.

 

[KepowOb]

A 5 gallon batch on average probably releases between 15W - 20W during active fermentation with termp control. It can easily raise the temperature by 15F above ambient without active cooling at this stage, which in turn speeds up fermentation and releases energy even more rapidly. Probably the best thing you could do if you want to brew without active temp control is scale down.

Thanks. I was always curious how high it could get if left to its own devices.

For most batches I plan to use temp control still, but was wondering about options for different scenarios, but obviously the last thing I want is to have to dump a batch because of a bunch of fusels or other off flavors.

That said, I've been doing a lot more reading on Lutra and I'm definitely going to give it a go to see what happens. With it claiming to come out clean into the 90s, and tons of anecdotal evidence repeating that here and elsewhere on the web, it's at least worth trying out

Probably going to give it a shot next week. I'll actively track the fermentation temps anyway and see what it does. I'll try to remember to follow up in this thread with results once it's on tap.

 

[Miraculix]

A 5 gallon batch on average probably releases between 15W - 20W during active fermentation with termp control. It can easily raise the temperature by 15F above ambient without active cooling at this stage, which in turn speeds up fermentation and releases energy even more rapidly. Probably the best thing you could do if you want to brew without active temp control is scale down.

Don't know about the scaling down part. The more beer, the more water, the more energy to take up. So basically the amount of energy needed to heat it up and the energy produced are always at the same relation, no matter if one gallon or ten.

What helps is to put the fermenter into a water bath for the first few days. Doesn't even have to be cold. This adds thermal mass and this will result in lower peak temperature.

 

[jerrylotto]

Scaling down just produces less heat overall (both water and sugar scale) allowing ambient cooling to be more effective (greater surface area). I completely agree about the water bath suggestion. Before I built out my keezer, I put my conical into a plastic garbage bin and filled it with water until the conical was just short of floating until fermentation slowed. Kept temp swings to around 5 degrees.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

Probably the best thing you could do if you want to brew without active temp control is scale down.

... or find a different hobby.

FWIW, with "very small" batches ("small" is 2.5 gal), I've measured fermentation temperature "at ambient" (no active temperature control) a couple of times. It ferments maybe 1-2F above room temperature.

eta: increase in temperature may also be strain dependent.

 

[stealthfixr]

It is far from a Cure-All, but situations like this where a clean yeast signature is desired is where pressurized fermentation really shines, in my opinion. Pressurization allows a warmer fermentation temp without the associated byproducts of that higher temp. From having pressurized US-05 before (which performs very well under pressure), I am going to guess that 70-75F with 10psi would be indistinguishable from 65F without pressure.