Toppling Goliath pseudoSue - Can you clone it?

[WIexile]

Snagged some 10 day old Zeelander the other day. I believe first time in cans? Wow that is lovely beer! Really really really good Nelson hops. TG is one of my favorite hoppy beer breweries in the US. Their beers are such a great showcase of the specific hops, soft and full with enough bitterness to keep you wanting more. They’re rarely thick, sweet, muddled like so so so many modern hoppy beers these days. And they’re insanely shelf stable.

And I still find it hard to believe they use S04 or even 007... I’m planning on harvesting from these fresh cans, interested to see how the yeast acts.

Also had to make the drive for Zee. Went home with two cases, well worth it. One of my favorites from them, also Clark's "favorite" beer. But I think he changed to FSM now.

S04 is their normal for there regular 4 packs, I have heard now that due to 007 being shorted earlier this year has led TG to experiment with their main yeast for the higher tier but not always to good results, so you never know at this point what you might be seeing. I do think they have remained in the 007 camp tho.

 

[Rothbard69]

So I’ve never used S-04 before for hazy. Always used 1318 with great result. How should I do temperature with S-04

 

[WIexile]

Haven't brewed in a while but will be starting up again soon. Anyone still trying to clone this? Anyone try anything new? Try this years Citra?

 

[skibb]

So I’ve never used S-04 before for hazy. Always used 1318 with great result. How should I do temperature with S-04

Back when I first started brewing Hazies I did all SO4 - it definitely makes a solid hazy beer, especially with a near-terminal dry hop (and it floccs so well you can harvest before hand!).

I moved away from it because of the overwhelming bubblegum character/ester I got from the yeast. It eventually became all I could taste when making beers with this yeast. To reduce its impact, I would ferment cool at 64 F and raise for a D rest when I DH on day 3 (fermentation maybe lasted 5 days).

I eventually moved on to doing an even split of SO4/K-97 and really enjoyed that ester profile when fermenting in the lower 60s

 

[hopfenstopfen]

I eventually moved on to doing an even split of SO4/K-97 and really enjoyed that ester profile when fermenting in the lower 60s

I’ve been wanting to try this combo. Can you say more about the ester profile? And does the S04 help K97 flocc better. K97 is supposed to be a poor floccer when used with kolsch styles I understand.

 

[skibb]

I do not believe it helps it flocc any better - I would tend to notice a drift towards SO4 after about 3 repitches/generations so I would only use it a few times before restarting (which is fine cuz dry yeast is cheap).

The ester profile was more stone fruit and less bubblegum - honestly a bit hard to tell given all the hops I throw in my hazes. This combo did exhibit a slight and pleasant twang (not quite acidity) that complimented the fruity profiles of the hops quite nicely.

 

[5SonsBrewing]

I know there was an article where they interviewed the owner Clark back in 2014 and he said that they don't have a house strain, that they use White Labs exclusively but I'm sure a lot has changed since 2014.

Today, all of Toppling Goliath’s yeast is flown in next day air from California from White Labs. Clark says they tend to use different yeasts for their unique components so the beers will taste differently. “I don’t want a house yeast – we will never have a house yeast – we’ll always have different variants,” he said.

 

[rivetcatcher]

Hi

Did this recipe and the King Sue ever get to a point where it was a full on clone? Ive read through the thread and it seems it makes a great beer just not the same

Rivet