Too hoppy for me

[puttster]

I made a 5 gal batch last week of BIAB 2-row, adding 1oz of Cascade hops (7%) and 1oz German Hersbrucker (2%) at the beginning and end of the boil. Then pitched Safale US-05 and some orange peel. Now, SG at 1.008, I gave it a taste and (to me) it is too much like IPA. I don't like it.

How can I tell what the problem is? too much bittering hops or too much aroma hops? Or the wrong kind, or just let it sit a bit, etc. Looking for some advice so I don't do it again.

 

[LLBeanJ]

Is it the bitterness or the flavor/aroma that you don't like? Or is it both?

If it's bitterness, you're SOL, as bitterness may fade some, but not much over time. Flavor/aroma, on the other hand will fade rather quickly.

To reduce bitterness, use less or lower AA% hops during the early additions. To reduce flavor/aroma, use less or lower AA% hops at the end of the boil.

Using brewing software is a great way to control the bitterness/hoppiness of your recipes, amongst other things.

 

[Citizen86]

I would still bottle or keg it up. Although tasting from the fermenter gives you a good idea how it'll turn out, a warm uncarbonated beer will still be different than the cold carbonated version. You may find that it's not as bad as you think once it's ready to drink.

LLBeanJ's questions are also good, if it's the bitterness or flavor you're not enjoying. 1oz of Cascade doesn't sound like a crazy amount for bittering, but if it's a very light beer (which if you only used 2-row and mashed low, it very well might be), and if you don't like a very bitter beer, then I suppose it might have been too much.

I've never used Hersbrucker, but perhaps that also has a flavor you don't like?

 

[puttster]

I'm new at this and I don't know if it's the bitterness or the flavor. Is there a way of knowing which is which? It smelled okay but did not taste okay, so maybe too bitter was the problem?

 

[LLBeanJ]

Bitterness hits you on the back of the tongue. Flavor/aroma is taste/smell (as in tastes like hops/smells like hops).

 

[Citizen86]

If you're new to this then are you even sure if's the hops? Hard to say, it could even be the flavor of the Hersbrucker or Cascade specifically you don't like.

 

[Magnus314]

Dis you get the white part - pith- of the orange peel in the boil? That stuff is bitter and horrible tasting.

 

[puttster]

it was a small bag of dried peel I got at the Local brew store.

 

[chickypad]

That recipe is not near the realm of an IPA for either bittering or hop aroma/flavor, I think you are experiencing some other off flavor or issue. What exactly is it that you don't like about the beer? The orange peel/pith was a good thought if you had added it fresh, still could be the problem though.

 

[puttster]

Ok, I'll withhold final judgement till it's finished. Maybe I was just surprised, after drinking Bud Lite all month.

 

[rhys333]

I made a 5 gal batch last week of BIAB 2-row, adding 1oz of Cascade hops (7%) and 1oz German Hersbrucker (2%) at the beginning and end of the boil. Then pitched Safale US-05 and some orange peel. Now, SG at 1.008, I gave it a taste and (to me) it is too much like IPA. I don't like it.

How can I tell what the problem is? too much bittering hops or too much aroma hops? Or the wrong kind, or just let it sit a bit, etc. Looking for some advice so I don't do it again.

You don't have a lot of hops in there so it should have an average bittering level... say somewhere around 35 IBUs, or about to the level of a milder pale ale. It could be that you prefer low bitterness, but often astringency is mistaken for bitterness and I'm wondering if this is what you're experiencing here. If you're not adjusting the pH on your mash, it can cause tannin extraction from the grain which produces a harsh astringent flavor. It's kinda like that drying sensation you get from overbrewed coffee or tea and can completely overwhelm the malt and hop flavors.

 

[Gameface]

I perceive bitterness MUCH more strongly in my pre-carbonated samples than I do once I get the beer carb'd up. Maybe it's just me?

 

[puttster]

You don't have a lot of hops in there so it should have an average bittering level... say somewhere around 35 IBUs, or about to the level of a milder pale ale. It could be that you prefer low bitterness, but often astringency is mistaken for bitterness and I'm wondering if this is what you're experiencing here. If you're not adjusting the pH on your mash, it can cause tannin extraction from the grain which produces a harsh astringent flavor. It's kinda like that drying sensation you get from overbrewed coffee or tea and can completely overwhelm the malt and hop flavors.

I did not mention that I used straight Houston tap water, with no salts. Also, the malted grain has been sitting in the garage since about last summer.

 

[jjeffers09]

try adding a bit of canning salt. Sodium Chloride, it will promote the roundness and full sweetness from the malts and might calm down the bitterness. Did you check the pH through the mash/boil/pre-pitch? It could be astringent or low pH bitterness. There are little tweaks you can make now, but they are not going to give you GREAT beer, but they may make the beer enjoyable vs what you have in front of you... plus, never trash it. give it time, it may mellow out too. but if it doesn't I would say maybe better process next time. without more info you may not know for sure.

I would start by looking at pH, Water, Ferm temps, sanitizer - did you cold crash? did you remove the sani-water before you did? starsan? or iodophor?

 

[beskone]

I perceive bitterness MUCH more strongly in my pre-carbonated samples than I do once I get the beer carb'd up. Maybe it's just me?

Fresh out of the fermenter my beers always taste extra harsh and bitter.

I think some of it is some of the yeast still in suspension. after it's carbed up it goes away for me as well.

 

[VApatriot]

When I brew a batch either from a kit, or when working on a new recipe I use these two things. The first is the IBU calculator found here: http://www.brewersfriend.com/ibu-calculator/

And the second is this IBU vs OG chart.



I find that I can customize the bittering and aroma hops to my liking and adjust my hop schedule according to how hoppy I want my beer to be after it's been aged for 2-4 weeks. I find that by using these two tools, my beer comes out as desired. Give it a try, couldn't hurt.

 

[tagz]

I did not mention that I used straight Houston tap water, with no salts. Also, the malted grain has been sitting in the garage since about last summer.

Sounds less than ideal. If you used straight tap water and didn't do anything to address chlorine, that's your problem.

 

[rhys333]

I did not mention that I used straight Houston tap water, with no salts. Also, the malted grain has been sitting in the garage since about last summer.

A quick search tells me that Houston water is VERY high in bicarbonates. Basically this means that for most of your beers, certainly the lighter ones, your mash pH is going to be WAY too high. This causes tannin extraction from the grain and harsh astringency. Assuming the water info I'm reading for your areas is accurate, its almost certain that astringency from too high pH is the problem here. I'm pretty sure it's not a hopping issue.

You have a couple options. Adjust the water you have with lactic acid (using Bru'n Water or EZ Water calculators) or start with reverse osmosis water and build a suitable mineral profile with salts and acid. I do the RO water thing because its easy, effective, and gives me maximum control. The guys in the brew science section can give you a lot of great advice on the topic. The water primer sticky at the top of that section is a great place to start.

 

[chickypad]

A quick search tells me that Houston water is VERY high in bicarbonates. Basically this means that for most of your beers, certainly the lighter ones, your mash pH is going to be way too high. This causes tannin extraction from the grain and harsh astringency. Assuming the water info I'm reading for your areas is accurate, its almost certain that astringency from too high pH is the problem here.

This sounds like a much more likely explanation than being overbittered from a single oz of cascade. Looks like you have some investigation to do on your water.

 

[puttster]

Game and Besk, I hope you are on to something! Rhys, the local Houston place usually tosses salts in with a malt purchase so I expect you are right about the local water here. I was planning on adding 2 oz lactic acid to try to make a sour, so you have convinced me to go forward with that. VA I love that site, calculators I can really use. They tell me what most folks here say, the hoppy taste probably was not the alpha level. That's comforting, I'm thinking it is fixable.
What a great forum.

 

[tagz]

Are you thinking of adding lactic acid to your astringent beer to turn it into a sour? I'll see you in the "Don't do that" thread.