to Starter or not to Starter

[Skelator]

So im in the position in my brewing experience where i want to try a starter. My next brew planned is a pale ale. OG 1.049. Batch size 3.25 gallons. MR Malty says i need 112 billion cells. I'm looking for 78% attenuation to hit 5% abv using WLP001. I'm borrowing a stir plate, so according to northernbrewer.com, i only need a .5L starter. However, every thing i read says .5L starters wont do anything. Mr Malty never goes below a 1L starter size. So..

1. Do i make a 1L starter netting me 250 billion cells with stir plate and risk over pitching?
2. Do i make a 1L starter netting me 180 billion cells with shaking and risk over pitching?
3. Pitch the vial directly risk underpitching.

 

[oakbarn]

Assume you are using a liquid yeast. The stir plate method will work well. I have made small ones to 1 gallon ones and they all work tons better than just pitching. 78% seems high.

 

[Skelator]

WLP001, edited into original post.

I've been getting 78-79 with us04 consistently.

 

[zacster]

I would just pitch the vial into the wort. You'll be fine that way. These vials are advertised as being enough for a 5 gallon batch but are not quite enough for that but a smaller batch and you'll be ok. I generally use Wyeast because that's what my LHBS has and these have more cells per pack. I make a starter for lagers but not usually for ales.

 

[Skelator]

And you want cell growth while fermenting, correct? So why does everyone say "pitch the right amount according to mr malty" yet you want growth... so should you slightly under pitch so the growth that happens within fermentation will net you enough cells... or am i talking out of both side of my mouth?

 

[thegerm]

http://www.yeastcalc.com/index.html

 

[DSmith]

I'd make the 1L stirred yeast starter for a 1.049 OG, 3.25 gallon end of boil, decant and add the majority of the starter, maybe not all. I did that a week ago with Wyeast 1056 and a 152F mash and got 85% attenuation, slightly overpitching based on the calculators. I think attenuation has more to do with the mash and grain bill than than overpitching vs. pitiching the calculated amount.

I only do 3.5 gallon end-of-boil all grain batches and normally do a yeast starter (1L minimum, stirred, chilled & decanted). That volume of starter is overpitching by about 50% for 1.060 beers, mostly what I brew. No starter is underpitching by about 50%. The beer has been good and I've justified to myself that some overpitching is ok from the Mr Malty Proper Yeast Pitching Rates article:

"Yes, you can wait longer and completely ferment it out so you don't have to pitch the liquid, but if you're going to do that, you should use a larger starter and allow the fermentation to go complete cycle over several days, chill, decant the beer and pitch just the yeast."

 

[martinator35]

underpitching will result in more esters and phenols. overpitching will result in less yeast character, or autoloays flavors if it is in the extreme. if you've got a good fresh vial that should be 100 billion cells, which i think is a pretty good pitch. if your yeast is older, make a starter. either way just be careful not to stress the yeast with temperature extremes and you should be fine.

 

[martinator35]

under-pitching will result in more esters and phenols. over-pitching will result in less yeast character, or autolysis flavors if it is in the extreme. if you've got a good fresh vial that should be 100 billion cells, which i think is a pretty good pitch. if your yeast is older, make a starter. either way just be careful not to stress the yeast with temperature extremes and you should be fine.

 

[klnosaj]

The single best thing I did for my beer making was to start using starters. I brewed a Kolsch yesterday, pitched the slurry from my starter at 6PM and by 9 the air-lock was off and running; when I checked this morning the krausen was already blasting through that air-lock. Quick starts mean less stress on the yeast; proper pitching rates mean less stress on the yeast; less stress on the yeast means better tasting beer.

 

[DrinkNoH2O]

You're making a lower gravity beer with in a batch significantly smaller than 5 gallons. As long as the vial is somewhat fresh I'd just pitch it.

Theoretically you should be able to pitch that vial into a 5 gallon batch as well, but at that size I'd do a starter.

 

[rexbanner]

You don't need a starter.

 

[Yooper]

underpitching will result in more esters and phenols. overpitching will result in less yeast character, or autoloays flavors if it is in the extreme. if you've got a good fresh vial that should be 100 billion cells, which i think is a pretty good pitch. if your yeast is older, make a starter. either way just be careful not to stress the yeast with temperature extremes and you should be fine.

under-pitching will result in more esters and phenols. over-pitching will result in less yeast character, or autolysis flavors if it is in the extreme. if you've got a good fresh vial that should be 100 billion cells, which i think is a pretty good pitch. if your yeast is older, make a starter. either way just be careful not to stress the yeast with temperature extremes and you should be fine.

You can say that again.

I'd pitch according to the mrmalty.com calculator. If he says "112 billion cells", make a .5 liter starter and you should hit it.

 

[TarheelBrew13]

I am a huge fan of starters. However, under pitching by 12 billion cells with WLP001, that's not a big deal. That's not much of an under pitch and that's a really clean yeast. I wouldn't worry about it. On the other hand, it won't hurt to make a 0.5 liter starter.

 

[biestie]

I am a huge fan of starters. However, under pitching by 12 billion cells with WLP001, that's not a big deal. That's not much of an under pitch and that's a really clean yeast. I wouldn't worry about it. On the other hand, it won't hurt to make a 0.5 liter starter.

That's kind of where I'm at. I'm not religious about making the size starter mrmalty says, but on the other hand, I wont brew a 5 gallon batch without doing something. 3 gallon batch? Meh, you're fine

 

[Skelator]

Cool guys, thanks for all the input.

 

[Brewham]

Look at it this way:

A starter can't hurt
No starter can hurt

Take your pick

 

[webgodhog]

I am a huge fan of starters. However, under pitching by 12 billion cells with WLP001, that's not a big deal. That's not much of an under pitch and that's a really clean yeast. I wouldn't worry about it. On the other hand, it won't hurt to make a 0.5 liter starter.

A stack of 1 billion dollar bills would be about 67 miles high. 12 billion = 804 miles high. Underpitching homebrew by 12 BILLION yeast cells.......meh

I agree it's not a big deal, just putting it in perspective