American IPA The New West Coast IPA

[tdf]

I’ve used the Cellar Science ALDC that More Beer has been selling. The directions for 5 gal /19L batches is “one dropper full” which is roughly 5 ml. My batch size into the fermenter is usually 6.75 gallons, so I measured out 7 ml in a pipette at yeast pitch.

Did you get the 8oz package?

I'm asking because the instructions on the product page say there are ~35 doses in a 1oz bottle, which comes out to a little less than 1ml. I just checked and I was unable to get even 1ml in the dropper.

 

[mrcastellino]

I’ve used the Cellar Science ALDC that More Beer has been selling. The directions for 5 gal /19L batches is “one dropper full” which is roughly 5 ml. My batch size into the fermenter is usually 6.75 gallons, so I measured out 7 ml in a pipette at yeast pitch.

It’s a bit pricey (ahem), and the jury’s still out as to whether it works or is worth the price. I’ve also brewed with the DKO yeast from Omega (German Augustiner strain), and frankly I don’t detect any difference. I don’t think I’m sensitive to diacytl but I always do a d-rest just in case.

The only time I’ve had an issue with diacytl was in a competition where a newly anointed judge marked me waaay down for what I think was non-existent, ‘looking’ for a flaw to prove his chops. The other judges didn’t see it either.

The beer I used the ALDC in is a WCIPA that just started cold crashing. The FG ended much higher than I had estimated (1.017 vs 1.011 est.). Not sure why it quit, but it never budged for 3 days, even when the temperature was raised to 73F for d-rest. I had two pounds of rice solids

to boost ABV and dry out the finish. But even with all the simple sugars, the ALDC didn’t stimulate all the dextrin to get consumed. The final sample tasted nicely hopped, though a bit unbalanced sweet nonetheless. ABV was 5.6%, so it’s ’acceptable’ even though my target was 6.4%

We’ll see after it’s cleared and carbed if the residual sweetness fades, or if the ALDC does a late kick-in to ferment dextrins.

You may be misunderstanding what ALDC does…it isnt intended to break down unfermentable dextrins into fermentable sugars. It only acts on the precursor to diacetyl.

If you want an enzyme to break down dextrins during fermentation, use Gluco-Amylase.

 

[Tony B]

I’ve brewed a couple of batches like this recently. Very nice light color, fruity hop aromas and flavors. Really delicious.

I still yearn for some of the IPA’s that were more prevalent 10-15 years ago. Very bitter and dank. Color somewhere between straw and golden. Sometimes darker.

I’m planning to brew a batch this weekend that is loosely based on Stone’s Ruination. I want a punch of bitter with some fruit and dank.

 

[Broothru]

I’ve brewed a couple of batches like this recently. Very nice light color, fruity hop aromas and flavors. Really delicious.

I still yearn for some of the IPA’s that were more prevalent 10-15 years ago. Very bitter and dank. Color somewhere between straw and golden. Sometimes darker.

I’m planning to brew a batch this weekend that is loosely based on Stone’s Ruination. I want a punch of bitter with some fruit and dank.

Got my vote!

Stone Ruination, as well as the Original Stone IPA. Just about anything from Ballast Point. And of course the champ: Pliny the Elder.

But is it all just “fond remembering”? I was in Total Wine last week (non-beer drinking SWMBO’d needed Pinot), and I ran across some retro Green Flash IPA. I remember being in a San Diego bar in the late 90s/early 00s shortly after Green Flash debuted. I thought it was great!

So traveling down memory lane, I picked up a six pack along with the wine. Honestly, it was a letdown. Way too much caramel. The dank hops were there for sure, but the clean taste we’ve evolved into along with balance was noticeably missing.

My IPAs today have the same hops and IBUs of the Millennium beers, but the grist is a mix of Pilsner + 2-row with Munich/Vienna in place of loads of C-40. Today my Go-To when in SoCal is Salty Crew instead of the beers of my younger self. Times change. Tastes evolve.

 

[Tony B]

Got my vote!

Stone Ruination, as well as the Original Stone IPA. Just about anything from Ballast Point. And of course the champ: Pliny the Elder.

But is it all just “fond remembering”? I was in Total Wine last week (non-beer drinking SWMBO’d needed Pinot), and I ran across some retro Green Flash IPA. I remember being in a San Diego bar in the late 90s/early 00s shortly after Green Flash debuted. I thought it was great!

So traveling down memory lane, I picked up a six pack along with the wine. Honestly, it was a letdown. Way too much caramel. The dank hops were there for sure, but the clean taste we’ve evolved into along with balance was noticeably missing.

My IPAs today have the same hops and IBUs of the Millennium beers, but the grist is a mix of Pilsner + 2-row with Munich/Vienna in place of loads of C-40. Today my Go-To when in SoCal is Salty Crew instead of the beers of my younger self. Times change. Tastes evolve.

Keeping my grain bill pretty simple for this one.
93% Briess brewers malt
7% C-20
I also remember some of those IPA’s having too much of the caramel.

 

[Dgallo]

Keeping my grain bill pretty simple for this one.
93% Briess brewers malt
7% C-20
I also remember some of those IPA’s having too much of the caramel.

You can even go 100% pale malt. I do all mine with 100% Pilsner or two row. Really lets the hops shine

 

[Broothru]

Keeping my grain bill pretty simple for this one.
93% Briess brewers malt
7% C-20
I also remember some of those IPA’s having too much of the caramel.

7% C-20 is virtually the same thing as using Munich II (11L), except less sweet and a bit more “grainy.” For a while I used C-10 in American IPAs and Pales, but it’s sometimes hard to find, and I have come to prefer Munich or Vienna over crystal (though technically I guess they are considered ’crystal’).

Now I’m pretty much 50/50 with pale and pils (Rahr Northstar is great), a little carapils and acidulated, and Munich/Vienna for color and taste. It’s been at least 2 years since I bought any American crystal, though Briess Bonlander Munich bridges that gap a bit.

I hadn’t realized how much styles and taste in American craft beers had changed until I bought that sixer of Green Flash. Still can’t adapt to hazies, however. Give me dank and piney. And clear, dammit!

 

[Broothru]

Keeping my grain bill pretty simple for this one.
93% Briess brewers malt
7% C-20
I also remember some of those IPA’s having too much of the caramel.

Funny thing is that back then I genuinely liked all that crystal. Now it just comes across as cloyingly sweet. I remember when Vinnie released his Pliny homebrew recipe to the interwebs. He had a pound or two of dextrose to help “dry it out”. Or was it to reduce the residual sweetness. It also was massively hopped, with several hop shots and a ton of whole leaf Cascade.

I tried to mimic the King but was only a Court Jester. I really loved the real iteration when I had it in the Russian River bar, and cherished the case I dragged back home on the East Coast, sharing it only with friends and connoisseurs who would truly understand and appreciate the nuances.

Of course the recipe today is not the one that America fell in beer love with two decades ago. I probably would not like that original beer if I had one today (heresy; don’t stand too close to me, lest the lightning bolt strike you also). It also had a “theoretical” IBU of 120, which Vinnie said was impossible to actually achieve, but that’s what we all went with.

Yeah, a hop bomb. Maybe it did need all that crystal just to make the hops bearable. Sure was a remarkable beer for the times.

 

[Tony B]

Funny thing is that back then I genuinely liked all that crystal. Now it just comes across as cloyingly sweet. I remember when Vinnie released his Pliny homebrew recipe to the interwebs. He had a pound or two of dextrose to help “dry it out”. Or was it to reduce the residual sweetness. It also was massively hopped, with several hop shots and a ton of whole leaf Cascade.

I tried to mimic the King but was only a Court Jester. I really loved the real iteration when I had it in the Russian River bar, and cherished the case I dragged back home on the East Coast, sharing it only with friends and connoisseurs who would truly understand and appreciate the nuances.

Of course the recipe today is not the one that America fell in beer love with two decades ago. I probably would not like that original beer if I had one today (heresy; don’t stand too close to me, lest the lightning bolt strike you also). It also had a “theoretical” IBU of 120, which Vinnie said was impossible to actually achieve, but that’s what we all went with.

Yeah, a hop bomb. Maybe it did need all that crystal just to make the hops bearable. Sure was a remarkable beer for the times.

Predicted IBU for my recipe is 128.

 

[secretlevel]

Predicted IBU for my recipe is 128.

My beers can often end up with 100-110 and are in a pretty good place. Brewfather decides that I'm getting like 30 added IBU from whirlpool, idk if that adds much bitterness tho.

 

[secretlevel]

I brewed another modern WC IPA with Nelson and Mosaic that came out awesome. The color looks way darker than it should, despite using 100% pils. I think my heating element is a little running a little hot, I'll turn it down for the next brew.

100% Rahr Pils
69 IBU Pekko
Mosaic Incognito and Simcoe WP
2x Nelson, 1x Nelson CGX and 1x Mosaic DH
275:100 SO4:Cl

I racked this beer on top of Omega's Mexican Lager slurry (from an American Lager) and got some pretty great attenuation (84%) and went from 1.072 > 1.010 gravity.
I was hoping to ferment this beer at 50F, but I was only able to chill to 65F, racked into fermenter (with the yeast), and tried to do the rest of the chilling overnight, but it was bubbling like crazy the next morning at 57F so I just kept it there. Came out pretty clean in the end and I'm happy with the results.

 

[ihavenonickname]

Yeah dark for 100% pils! But still looks great. With those big bittering additions what are you doing for WP and DH rates?

 

[secretlevel]

Yeah dark for 100% pils! But still looks great. With those big bittering additions what are you doing for WP and DH rates?

Without chill haze and now that it dropped a little clearer, it certainly looks a little lighter.
I usually go for 1oz/gal WP and 2oz/gal DH, but given this came out at 8%, I added a little more. I think about 2.5oz/gal in DH.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

This may be relevant for anyone who can access CBB :
https://beerandbrewing.com/21st-century-ipas-20th-century-hops/

 

[ihavenonickname]

Here’s another. Tried to incorporate some more classic flavor elements in this one. 7% vienna the rest split two row and pils. Chinook for bittering 40 IBUs. Total calculated IBUs 70. WP mosaic, simcoe, chinook. 1.064 -> 1.010.

But still lots of modern technique: 34/70. Dip hop incognito mosaic, spectrum citra at yeast pitch. Only 6oz dry hop per 5 gal. Half was mosaic chinook, other half citra Columbus cryo. Dry hop with ALDC at 65 24 hrs. Gelatin but it’s not dropping crystal clear 34/70 does this to me sometimes.

 

[DuncB]

Sometimes a few ml of clarity ferm can help for the final polish to get rid of chill haze.

 

[Broothru]

View attachment 858165
Here’s another. Tried to incorporate some more classic flavor elements in this one. 7% vienna the rest split two row and pils. Chinook for bittering 40 IBUs. Total calculated IBUs 70. WP mosaic, simcoe, chinook. 1.064 -> 1.010.

But still lots of modern technique: 34/70. Dip hop incognito mosaic, spectrum citra at yeast pitch. Only 6oz dry hop per 5 gal. Half was mosaic chinook, other half citra Columbus cryo. Dry hop with ALDC at 65 24 hrs. Gelatin but it’s not dropping crystal clear 34/70 does this to me sometimes.

I think ALDC is best used at yeast pitch. The primary use is to eliminate diacetyl being produced during fermentation, but it supposedly aids in faster clarification when you reach FG. Silicon dioxide clarifiers (Silica Gel, etc.) do an amazing job of helping finished beer drop clear in 48 hours or less.

I add ~50 ml to a brite tank or serving keg after chilling and prior to pressure transferring from the fermenter. Pair that with a floating dip tube and you’ll have sparkling clear beer from your first pour.

 

[DuncB]

I have heard on craft beer brew podcasts the pros use the ALDC at yeast pitch and a further dose with the dry hop.

 

[Broothru]

I have heard on craft beer brew podcasts the pros use the ALDC at yeast pitch and a further dose with the dry hop.

Yeah, I recall that now. Something about stopping hop creep. I don’t do much dry hopping anymore, and focus on late hopping, whirlpool and hop stands for flavor and aroma.

 

[ihavenonickname]

Regarding clarity… I mean it’s not bad at all. Heres’s another photo.

 

[tdf]

View attachment 858319
Regarding clarity… I mean it’s not bad at all. Heres’s another photo.

Great looking beer. The first picture looks like it could be chill haze.

 

[Dgallo]

View attachment 858319
Regarding clarity… I mean it’s not bad at all. Heres’s another photo.

Looks great. Nice and clear. I will say the shape of the glass impacts the “perceived” clarity too. In your first picture there’s a lot of condensation on the glass and it has that fish eye shape. I feel these glasses affect the way the light passes through and they don’t look as clear as they should. I have a few glasses with a similar shape and they do the same thing to my clear beers

 

[ihavenonickname]

This is the most tropical fruit punch ipa I've had in a long time.

1060->1010. Barke Pils and 10% flaked wheat.
KOLN yeast, Aromazyme at yeast pitch in combination really pushes the tropical punch vibes
35 IBUs from mosaic at 60
WP cascade and mosaic 1oz per gal total
DH all mosaic cryo "only" 4oz. Really getting great aroma and less astringency at these slightly lower DH rates. Thought I might miss having some t90 in the DH but I really don't. I think the cascade and enough hot side ibus really help keep upfront hoppy flavor bold.

Took some inspiration green cheek for the grist and hop regimen. Got the kolsch idea from pinthouse. Got the aromazyme idea from alvarado st. Throw it all together and its definately a nice way to push thiols, fruity esters but keep it all lean, clean, and bitter.

Cheers!

 

[smcinco]

Here’s another. Tried to incorporate some more classic flavor elements in this one. 7% vienna the rest split two row and pils. Chinook for bittering 40 IBUs. Total calculated IBUs 70. WP mosaic, simcoe, chinook. 1.064 -> 1.010.

But still lots of modern technique: 34/70. Dip hop incognito mosaic, spectrum citra at yeast pitch. Only 6oz dry hop per 5 gal. Half was mosaic chinook, other half citra Columbus cryo. Dry hop with ALDC at 65 24 hrs. Gelatin but it’s not dropping crystal clear 34/70 does this to me sometimes.

Would you care to expand on your thoughts on 34/70 and modern technique? I love the Vienna addition. Great looking beer!

 

[ihavenonickname]

Would you care to expand on your thoughts on 34/70 and modern technique? I love the Vienna addition. Great looking beer!

Sure! I've done WCIPA with a bunch of difference versions of chico and with 34/70 (or similar) and generally I just like the clear malt and hop flavor with the lager yeast. Its just a little more in your face. To do it well I think you should ferment warmer, (60's) so you get minimal sulfur by the end of the ferment, as that can interfear with hop flavor.

I've enjoyed using incognito and spectrum in the fermenter. I thnk it adds another layer of hop flavor in addition to what you get from more typical WP and DH additions. I'm a believer in layering in hop flavor all along the brewing process to get the biggest flavor and aroma impacts. You certainly dont' have to use the modern flowable products to make great beer, but it does add something extra.

 

[Dgallo]

I’ll be brewing one of these this weekend but going to use a more traditional grainbill.

Modern west/oldschool GB;
75 %- 2row
15% - Vienna
5% - crystal 40L
5% - dextrose
OG: 1.075
FG: 1.012
IBU: 75-85
Yeast - US05 at 65*f

Boil hops
60ibu from Columbus & strata at 60, 15, 5

Whirlpool
1:1 strata/mosiac at 1oz per gallon at true volume.

Dryhop:
2:1:1 cryo & t90 Mosiac/ lupomax Columbus/ cgx & t90 strata

I may be adding blackberry kush terpenes to the keg but haven’t fully decided

 

[ihavenonickname]

Crystal 40L?? what on earth??

Jk sounds fantastic, would love to try it.

 

[DrGMG]

I’ll be brewing one of these this weekend but going to use a more traditional grainbill.

Modern west/oldschool GB;
75 %- 2row
15% - Vienna
5% - crystal 40L
5% - dextrose
OG: 1.075
FG: 1.012
IBU: 75-85
Yeast - US05 at 65*f

Boil hops
60ibu from Columbus & strata at 60, 15, 5

Whirlpool
1:1 strata/mosiac at 1oz per gallon at true volume.

Dryhop:
2:1:1 cryo & t90 Mosiac/ lupomax Columbus/ cgx & t90 strata

I may be adding blackberry kush terpenes to the keg but haven’t fully decided

Looks solid.

 

[Fergal]

Doesn't crystal inherently increase the chances of oxidation? I'm sure I read/heard that somewhere a while back and just took it as gospel!

 

[Dgallo]

Doesn't crystal inherently increase the chances of oxidation? I'm sure I read/heard that somewhere a while back and just took it as gospel!

You’re correct, Crystal is more susceptible to oxidation but I’m not concerned at all. My process is sound