The 1.020 Curse

[solbergg]

Are you using liquid extract? The thing to remember is that it is usually better to add that towards the end of the brew since it is already brewed once. I think that BYO had an article on it a few years ago.

Some used liquid, some used dry, some used both. The LHBS Scotch Ale used specialty grains and liquid extract and their recipe had me add the extract during the last 15 minutes of the boil.

 

[solbergg]

Couple things:

1. You need to calibrate your hydrometer in distilled water.

2. Try to let the temperature raise to around 70F and give the primary a swirl. You may just need to "wake" up the yeast some.

3. What you need to calculate is attenuation. You can calculate attenuation with [(OG - FG) / (OG - 1)] * 100. Yeast manufacturers will give a yeast strain a certain range that they will attenuate to. Most yeasts attenuate between 70% and 85%.

4. If you want a yeast that makes a super dry beer try Nottinghams. I don't like it because I think it attenuates too much, but that's just personal preference.

5. If you just want more alcohol then make your OG higher. Don't try to use amalyze after the fact, you'll just get watered down alcohol.

And most importantly.

6. Never dump a beer! The cotton mouth feeling on your IPA was probably because it was over hopped. Let that bitterness mellow for 6 to 9 months and it would have been great.

1. Interesting. I will admit that I tested the hydrometer in tap water. I'm not sure what you mean by "calibrate" though. What do I do to it in order to calibrate it?

2. My current batch is a lager, will that hurt it if I let it get that warm? I think I pitched my yeast at 60 degrees.

3. The OG of my current batch is 1.050, so assuming a 75% attenuation rate, I should expect an FG around 1.012

4. Hmm, nottinghams, I think that's the yeast that my friend used and his first batch did get down to 1.008

5. Too late, as I already added it. But it's all in the name of science for me at this point.

6. I'm starting to think that cottonmouth feeling is something else than hops bitterness. I took a taste of my dunkel the last time I did a hydro test, and it had that same cottonmouth feeling to it. Perhaps this is what people call yeast bite? Anyway, I would never throw out a beer just because it didn't hit it's FG, as some of my previous brews have been rather tasty (my AHS Amber Ale was very popular with my friends at a bbq we had yesterday). The IPA I threw out because after waiting a significant amount of time, the cottonmouth effect hadn't mellowed out by even a little bit. Oh well, perhaps I was wrong to throw it out.

 

[boo boo]

Some brands of extract ferment to lower final gravities than others.

 

[SeaMonster]

1. Interesting. I will admit that I tested the hydrometer in tap water. I'm not sure what you mean by "calibrate" though. What do I do to it in order to calibrate it?

All calibrating means is reading your hydrometer reading in distilled water @60F. If it reads 1.002 then you know your hydrometer is .002 off. You can then add those gravity points to every reading you take.

 

[WBC]

I pitch directly most of the time, though I think I rehydrated one of them before pitching. I don't know what proofing is.

Proofing yeast is prooving that it is viable by pitching it into boiled/cooled to 90F water for 15 minutes (note if it foams up) and then swirl if it foamed up, wait another 5 minutes and then imediately pitching the yeast. The water get's into the yeast cells easier than wort and gets them ready for an easy transition to wort. It also lets you know they are still viable by the foaming action. Always use enough yeast for the volume you are fermenting.

 

[doublegun]

At my LHBS there's this stuff called "Amylaze Enzyme". If a fermentation sticks at 1.020, put in a tablespoon of that stuff and swish the carboy. Magically that beer will be at 1.012 within a couple days. Amylaze is an enzyme that will break down some of the complex sugars so that the yeast can eat them. Don't over-do it as it's possible to break most of the residual sugar down..... and there goes all your malty flavouring. The next best option is to switch to a different DME/LME supplier.

I was reading along and was waiting to see someone post this, or post it myself. This and another pitch w/ champagne yeast will get that gravity down. You'll end up very dry, I'll bet.

 

[Cheeto]

I too have suffered the 1.020 curse.

My answer was this problem was very different
I set my carboys on top of the Dryer for 3-5 days,
the gentle vibration ( I think) helped "rouse" the yeast
now I do this with every batch.

I have hit my F.G. on the last 10 batches,
but I also let my brews sit in primary for at least 2 weeks.

This my not be right but it has worked for me.

 

[adx]

Also double check your hydrometer. The hydrometer that I have is suppose to be read at 68F.

 

[capn]

I've had the 1.024 curse.... the lhbs suggested that I pitch a propegator batch of yeast in when I rack to secondary. I had a deadguy clone that took 6 weeks to go from 1.066 to 1.024. I racked it last night it had a green cider smell and taste when I sampled the sg. hopefully it will clean out and the sg will drop to where it should be. as a side question should i put it in a tertiary to clear out the brew?

 

[grasshopper1917]

Cool this is an interesting topic. I had the same problem about 3 batches ago. Made a wheat ale and ended up getting stuck at 1019 - its not too bad - a little sweeter then I would have liked though. Luckilly it hasnt happened again since last 2 batches I have bottled reached 1012 from around 1050.

If I get stuck again atleast I have some good tips - cheers

 

[s3n8]

How are you aerating?

I have had similar issues, and have just tried an o2 system on the latest batch. Hoping to have one finish below 1.016 (my lowest yet).

I have tried a number of different things, liquid yeast (always with a starter), Dry (Safale 04, 05, Nottinghams), shaking, whisking, aquarium pump and stone, and have always finished about 4 or 5 points high. Temps have been fairly constant in the high 60s to low 70s.

I just checked my Rye IPA (first one shot with o2), OG on the 24th was 1.056, today it is 1.012 and still working. Krausen has nearly disappeared, but if it stops there I will still be thrilled.

Woohoo for o2!

Im sold

 

[Chris_Dog]

Under-pitching my contribute to the lack of attenuation. Check Jamil's pitching calculator http://www.mrmalty.com/calc/calc.html.

 

[Blackhawkbrew]

I just went to rack my BB Altbier into secondary for some dry hopping and when I checked my FG it was at the magic 1.020 level after 8 days! There was very little Krausen and ther were, what looked like, little yeast gobs foating (almost looked like flaked fish food). Has anyone else had this? My LHBS did not have the BB kit so he checked the recipe online and used ingredients he had in-house to fill the order. I have brewed three other BB kits, all with great success. I have some yeast activater, would that help? What about the Amylaze Enzyme that Shafferpiolet mentioned? Can I add that to the primary still?

By the way, I used Nottingham dry yeast pitched dry at about 75 degrees.

I'll leave it go and check it again in another week.

 

[shafferpilot]

I just went to rack my BB Altbier into secondary for some dry hopping and when I checked my FG it was at the magic 1.020 level after 8 days! There was very little Krausen and ther were, what looked like, little yeast gobs foating (almost looked like flaked fish food). Has anyone else had this? My LHBS did not have the BB kit so he checked the recipe online and used ingredients he had in-house to fill the order. I have brewed three other BB kits, all with great success. I have some yeast activater, would that help? What about the Amylaze Enzyme that Shafferpiolet mentioned? Can I add that to the primary still?

By the way, I used Nottingham dry yeast pitched dry at about 75 degrees.

I'll leave it go and check it again in another week.

I think 8 days is a little early to start doing anything. Leave it alone for a while and make sure that it won't take care of itself, then start looking for alternatives. BTW little floating colonies of yeast are quite normal.

 

[Blackhawkbrew]

I just checked my BB Altbier and the gravity dropped to 1.012! I went ahead and added my extra .5 oz of Vanguard on top in the primary. I stirred gently and tried to submerge the hops a bit, but I didn't want to add to much O2. I was surprised of the minimal amount of krausen compared to my last batch. Should that tell me something or does the amount of krausen depend on the yeast attenuation?

Thanks for all your help!

 

[nathan]

I've had some success beating this in different ways (this weekend I'll start a batch with all three together as a PM).

1) aeration - I'm using a stone now and an oxygen can (will switch to pump soon, can is too expensive in hind-sight)

2) not putting yeast through a rigorous starter program (now I start days ahead of time and do a pint then a quart additions of starter wort to them and grow them up. I am trying a stirplate to do it more quickly now)

3) switching extract sources. My LHBS store has their own "store brand" which I'm sure is whatever they get in bulk. The LME has good flavor, but I think it may be the culprit as well. I ordered name brand through the mail and will also add late in the boil.

Aeration and yeast startering worked on two of my batches. My last one used the bulk extract again and got stuck, but had no yeast startering (did aerate, though). I'm doing one of those recipes again on Sunday and will try to remember to report back if I beat this. It's all academic for me anyway, though, since I'm basically goofing off making some "drinkin' beers" while I pool funds for a nice AG system.

 

[milracing]

This has probably been beaten into the ground but I too seem to keep running into 1.020 as well. I just have the gut feeling that theres something about ending at this gravity. Inadvertently mashing to hot or *something* with the mashing.

 

[rico567]

When I started brewing this fall, my second season (I don't brew in June, July, and August), I, too became a member of the 1.020 club. My first season, I brewed a dozen MW extract kits, all different- ales, porters, wheats, and they all attenuated right down to the specified FG in a week or so (I always use the Wyeast Activator packs). To my surprise, when I started brewing in September with MW kits, two of the first three batches got stuck (or became very slow) around 1.020. The wheat batch fermented out very cleanly in a week, but the batch of porter and a batch of ale both got stuck. I made the mistake of racking the porter anyway, and it's been sitting in the secondary for three weeks, with a bubble maybe every minute, not changing SG much, despite the fact that I agitate the carboy often. The ale I left in the primary for an additional week, and it reached the upper end of the specified FG range (1.014), so I racked it. I've decided that what I've got left in the porter is basically unfermentable, so I'm going to bottle it along with the ale this week.
After reviewing my methods, the one thing I was doing last season that I forgot to start up again was the "drop of olive oil" adjunct to æration. I've started doing that again.
Interesting times....you learn more when things don't go as expected.

 

[Pi Kapp Beer Guy]

Yeah I'm actually suprised this has not come up more but i'm thinking you should try a starter. I have had this problem with a batch and i am planning on doing it again the same way except with a much larger starter. Matter of fact i am using the same Yeast that i just racked from the top. Anyways good luck and i will be following this thread and hope to hear of your future results.

 

[Col224]

Can anyone explain what the drop of olive oil thing means? I haven't had this problem myself(my first beer is still in primary) but I like to learn what could go wrong so when it does I can fix it(or keep it from happening)

 

[Anbrew]

In my extract days I used to have this exact same problem. I will tell you what I did, but it may or may not be appicable to you:

1) I only used liquid yeasts, but as soon as I started MAKING STARTERS my FGs began getting much lower. Better yet, when I pitched a new beer onto the old primary yeast cake, I got even lower FG. NOTE: it is not recommended to make starters with dry yeast, as it could do more harm than good.

2) I started shaking the sh*t out of my carboys.

That's pretty much it, I never aerated with O2 or anything fancy. I found my problem was that I was underpitching yeast. I would suggest trying two packets of yeast, and see if that helps. IMHO, you can never really overpitch.

 

[nathan]

I just thought of something else, please forgive me if it's been in the thread already...

Have you gotten a new hydrometer and tried that out instead of your current? Also, if you have one or can borrow or buy one, try a refractometer. The paper with the lines on it inside the hydrometer can sometimes slide and give you off readings, particularly if it is shaken hard.

 

[nathan]

Col224,
it has been discovered that an addition of a very tiny amount of olive oil to the starter when you are growing a yeast starter will serve as an alternative to aerating the wort with similar results.
The process is to sterilize a loop of wire with flame, dip that wire into a puddle of oil you have poured onto a sanitized dish, and then swish the loop through your starter solution, then cap or airlock it and run your starter as normal (with a stir plate or just however you do it).
The olive oil is utilized by the yeast in a way that satisfies what they would get from aeration of the wort before pitching (the actual wort you want for the beer, not the starter aeration).


Also, folks with 1.020, calibrate your thermometers and stir your mashes well, and check in several places to make sure you are getting accurate mash temp readings. Then if your brews show 1.020 again, and your hydrometer is also working well (check in distilled water and compare with additional hydrometer) you can adjust temperatures of your mash carefully and slowly over time.

 

[MadDwarf]

Your cottonmouth feel could be tannins from the specialty grains, if the steep is too hot. What temp are you steeping your grains at, and for how long?

 

[Col224]

thanks for the reply nathan.

 

[starrfish]

just a thought, have you been using the same brand/strain of yeast? change your yeast (try a notty) and I'm sure you'll break the 1020 curse. Safale US 05 should get you below 1020 too

Y005 Danstar Nottingham Ale Yeast

The Nottingham strain was selected for its highly flocculent (precipitating) and relatively full attenuation (transforming sugar into alcohol) properties. It produces low concentrations of fruity and estery aromas and has been described as neutral for an ale yeast, allowing the full natural flavor of malt to develop. Good tolerance to low fermentation temperatures, 14°C (57°F), allow this strain to brew lager-style beer. Optimum temp: 57°-70° F

 

[mwhc22]

hmmm... i have never heard of this. after 2.5 years of brewing i only had one get stuck around 1.02...i just chalked it up to having done something different than i normally did. it was on a hefe. it still turned out ok. but the carbonation never really built up too high even after conditioning for over 3 months. and the head was none existent after the pour was finished. it also tasted extremely malty for a hef. dunno... i just drank it and went on brewing more beer knowing that i already made that recipe twice before without that happening. i would be interested to know if something i had purchased had caused it to get stuck like that.

 

[syd138]

I had the same thing with mine. I just bottled my first batch which is a weissbier, it's ending OG was supposed to be between 1.010 - 1.015 mine ended up at 1.020.

I kept checking it for a couple days and it didn't change.

It tasted ok though.. and Im hoping its alright after sitting in the bottles for a few weeks.

 

[shafferpilot]

with heffy's the most common problem that leads to under-attenuation is temperature. They really need to be at and stay at 75F to get down as low as they advertise.

 

[Eastside Brewer]

Keys to attenuation for AG:

1. Proper ph of mash (5.2)
2. Mash temp/time (lower temp and longer mashes equals more fermentables)
3. Aereate wort (oxygen)
4. Pitch proper amount of yeast (do a starter)
5. Control ferm temps (temp swings bad)

These principles have given me consistantly good attenuation and great tasting beer.

Eastside