Talk to me about seltzer...

[FloppyKnockers]

So my wife finally talked me into making some hard seltzer. I read a few things and sourced a few ingredients, but still have a couple questions. So far I've got some crystalized lime, a bunch of corn sugar, and decided on Origin seltzer yeast instead of EC-118.

So my unknowns are a) has anyone used this yeast before? The temp range is 65* - 80*. Should I shoot for the higher, lower, middle, or doesn't matter of this range? And b) is back-sweetening a common practice with seltzers or do we want to lean on tart? Or is the sweetness all down to personal taste?

Any other tidbits of knowledge you want to share would be helpful.

 

[Hoochin'Fool]

My $0.02 is that trying to get a sugar wash to ferment is SO frustrating compared to beer wort. But I used ec-1118, not Origin seltzer yeast, which looks intriguing! The 1040 sugar wash I made six weeks ago (plus Fermaid K and rehydrated ec-1118) slowly fermented down to 1030. Next I added more Fermaid K (at 2 grams per gallon), and the wash dropped to 1025, where it's been stuck for 2 weeks now, at 68F. About ready to dump it down the drain, cuz I need the fermenter to make more beer!

Next time, I'll just pre-make some flavor syrups, and set them next to a case of club soda, a bucket of ice, and a bottle of vodka, so the party-goer can pick whatever flavor they want. Bonus: any flavor mixes can have all the preservatives they want without worrying about yeast being able to still bottle-carb!

But that said, please post any updates if you go with that Origin seltzer yeast!

 

[wdavis2003]

I cheat and make Vodka Seltzer. No fermentation needed!

 

[VTX1300]

I have been working on Seltzers for about 2 years now and feel that my process works well. As for yeast, I haver never used EC-118. I have tried WLP-001 and US-05 without much success. I have had very good luck with Mangrove Jack's Hard Seltzer Yeast and Nutrient. No need for additional nutrient as it's already in with the yeast, but I have added some at about half way through just to make sure the yeast didn't stall, but saw no significant gains. I ferment at 72-75F but I am not sure if the temp matters as long as you stay in the range on the package. I always shoot for the middle of the range listed.
A 5 gallon batch will ferment out in about 2 weeks. Once gravity hits 1.000 or even a little lower I cold crash for a day or two then use a finning agent. I have never had much luck with gelatin, but have had good success Super Kleer. I takes a few days to get crystal clear but does the job.
I have used straight Corn Sugar, half corn sugar and table sugar mix, and straight table sugar. Other than a slight difference in OG, the results were the same. I can not detect a difference in the finished product.
I don't flavor the entire butch but by the glass or bottle. When I did the whole batch, by the end of 5 gallons I was tired of that flavor. I now have a few to choose from and use a dosing syringe to add what I want. Oh, and I don't back sweeten. I think Seltzers are suppose to be more dry or tart.
Hope this helps. I have a batch cold crashing right now and can't wait to tap this keg on these hot days.

 

[FloppyKnockers]

I cheat and make Vodka Seltzer. No fermentation needed!

I just feel like I should do it the same way our ancestorial forefathers did when their wives complained that they never make them anything good to drink and why is IPA, or brown, or whatever you like is always on ye olde tap. But yeah, I gotta go the cheater route if I can't get this right.

 

[FloppyKnockers]

I have been working on Seltzers for about 2 years now and feel that my process works well. As for yeast, I haver never used EC-118. I have tried WLP-001 and US-05 without much success. I have had very good luck with Mangrove Jack's Hard Seltzer Yeast and Nutrient. No need for additional nutrient as it's already in with the yeast, but I have added some at about half way through just to make sure the yeast didn't stall, but saw no significant gains. I ferment at 72-75F but I am not sure if the temp matters as long as you stay in the range on the package. I always shoot for the middle of the range listed.
A 5 gallon batch will ferment out in about 2 weeks. Once gravity hits 1.000 or even a little lower I cold crash for a day or two then use a finning agent. I have never had much luck with gelatin, but have had good success Super Kleer. I takes a few days to get crystal clear but does the job.
I have used straight Corn Sugar, half corn sugar and table sugar mix, and straight table sugar. Other than a slight difference in OG, the results were the same. I can not detect a difference in the finished product.
I don't flavor the entire butch but by the glass or bottle. When I did the whole batch, by the end of 5 gallons I was tired of that flavor. I now have a few to choose from and use a dosing syringe to add what I want. Oh, and I don't back sweeten. I think Seltzers are suppose to be more dry or tart.
Hope this helps. I have a batch cold crashing right now and can't wait to tap this keg on these hot days.

This is what I was hoping for! Thanks for sharing your experience - very helpful. Especially good to hear about the Super Kleer. I am eager to try Origin and post up the results.

 

[redrocker652002]

I will add what has already been said. I tried it and used a Morebeer kit that included two packets of EC yeast. I followed the instructions to the T and it took forever to ferment. It was pretty much stuck, so I added the second packet of yeast, added more of the additive they included. I want to say it was the fermaid, but I don't remember. It tasted ok, but not worth the time and hassle in my opinion. With that said, I did it so that my wife and kids would try it. My mom liked it, but being nothing but sugar and water, she does not drink much of it.

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

I did what @VTX1300 suggested, as he instructed me several months ago. I had good success with mine and we are getting ready to do a second batch this weekend. My wife forced me to try it and I liked it much better then any of the crap in the cans haha. We got a couple different flavorings and add it to each glass as desired.

 

[VTX1300]

This is what I was hoping for! Thanks for sharing your experience - very helpful. Especially good to hear about the Super Kleer. I am eager to try Origin and post up the results.

I would like to know how your seltzer turns out using the Origin yeast. Using ale yeast I got a LOT of sulfur and had a hard time scrubbing it out. Hopping you have good results.

 

[FloppyKnockers]

I would like to know how your seltzer turns out using the Origin yeast. Using ale yeast I got a LOT of sulfur and had a hard time scrubbing it out. Hopping you have good results.

I plan on making it in the next week or two. I will definitely post here how it goes.

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

I believe if you get Sulphur you can swirl a copper wire in the beer and it will react with the Sulphur and remove or lessen the Sulphur.

 

[FloppyKnockers]

Day 1 is in the books and everything went as expected. Now we wait...

 

[beren]

I cheat and make Vodka Seltzer. No fermentation needed!

It’s not cheating! That’s what the commercial guys would do in a second if they were allowed to.

Check out skeeter pee recipes! It’s really good. I also made the dragons blood variant, and am about to rack a tart cherry limeade.

 

[beren]

Sulfur comes from stressed yeast. Put your recipe into meadtools.com and it’ll show you the nutrients you need to keep your yeast strain happy and healthy.

 

[mack6866]

I was disappointed to see that there was no end result….then saw you did this today haha. I did too!

6 gallons RO
7 lb table sugar
125g of origin yeast

Tilt says 1.048

Setting fermenter at 71 degrees

I’ve done this before with yeast nutrient and lutra with good results

I usually use super Kleer with good results.

How much origin yeast did you use?

 

[mack6866]

I was disappointed to see that there was no end result….then saw you did this today haha. I did too!

6 gallons RO
7 lb table sugar
125g of origin yeast

Tilt says 1.048

Setting fermenter at 71 degrees

I’ve done this before with yeast nutrient and lutra with good results

I usually use super Kleer with good results.

How much origin yeast did you use?

I have ZERO activity. Is this stuff actually yeast?

 

[beren]

I have ZERO activity. Is this stuff actually yeast?

Gert it out of the fridge and warm it up. Try 90 to start.

 

[JAReeves]

Day 1 is in the books and everything went as expected. Now we wait...
View attachment 852310

How did it go?

 

[FloppyKnockers]

I was disappointed to see that there was no end result….then saw you did this today haha. I did too!

6 gallons RO
7 lb table sugar
125g of origin yeast

Tilt says 1.048

Setting fermenter at 71 degrees

I’ve done this before with yeast nutrient and lutra with good results

I usually use super Kleer with good results.

How much origin yeast did you use?

I used the 75g packet for 5 gallons @ 65° on the InkBird.
5 gallons of distilled water (read that Super Kleer won't touch cloudiness from hard water)
4 lbs. corn sugar
Refracto said ~1.039 OG

I have ZERO activity. Is this stuff actually yeast?

Mine started bubbling away the next day. The smell was very neutral - almost bread-like.

How did it go?

It's still going. It still looks the same as day one. Maybe a little cake on the bottom. I left it alone for all this time because I couldn't find anywhere, anything about this yeast. Not sure if It was done in two days, if I should expect any clearing, but I figure 2.5 weeks should be fine. I'm going to do the Super Kleer this weekend and see how long that takes. I've heard anywhere from 24 hours to two weeks. I'll follow up with pics, for sure.

 

[JAReeves]

I used the 75g packet for 5 gallons @ 65° on the InkBird.
5 gallons of distilled water (read that Super Kleer won't touch cloudiness from hard water)
4 lbs. corn sugar
Refracto said ~1.039 OG


Mine started bubbling away the next day. The smell was very neutral - almost bread-like.


It's still going. It still looks the same as day one. Maybe a little cake on the bottom. I left it alone for all this time because I couldn't find anywhere, anything about this yeast. Not sure if It was done in two days, if I should expect any clearing, but I figure 2.5 weeks should be fine. I'm going to do the Super Kleer this weekend and see how long that takes. I've heard anywhere from 24 hours to two weeks. I'll follow up with pics, for sure.

Would bentonite work like in wine/mead-making?

 

[FloppyKnockers]

Would bentonite work like in wine/mead-making?

I don't see why not. I heard it has to be done pre-fermentation though - not sure. Never used it.

 

[mack6866]

Congrats! I guess I’ll get myself a fresh batch of yeast. Enjoy your seltzer!

 

[FloppyKnockers]

Starting on the 20th, over a week stretch, I added SuperKleer per the instructions. I'm not super impressed, but that's likely because the fining didn't have a lot to work with from the start. It was already pretty clear before adding. You can see a difference in clarity throughout the week. The jury is still out on this yeast. It smelled like bread when adding the SuperKleer. Not sure what smell I was expecting, but it wasn't bread.

I would totally try this again on cider or wine.

I will keg this coming up weekend and add some crystalized lime. We'll see how that goes...

 

[FloppyKnockers]

Alright. I didn't get around to kegging last weekend, but I did the other day. That SuperKleer did it's job better than I thought it would - no complaints there.

I added 18g of crystalized lime at kegging and had a taste. The lime aroma is there, but so is bread. Lots of it. It even tastes like bread. I really hope it settles out.

 

[FloppyKnockers]

@mack6866 How is yours getting along? Do you have a strong bread smell, or is mine just broken?

 

[Ambrozie]

@FloppyKnockers
Thanks to your thread, I acted and created my account after lurking for some time
Did you ever get to the bottom of what resulted in the strong taste/smell of bread?

 

[madscientist451]

I cheat and make Vodka Seltzer. No fermentation needed!

Even with cheap vodka, making your own with commercial spirits is about the same price of buying commercial seltzer.

 

[FloppyKnockers]

@FloppyKnockers
Thanks to your thread, I acted and created my account after lurking for some time
Did you ever get to the bottom of what resulted in the strong taste/smell of bread?

Hey, and welcome to the forum! Although I do not know for sure what caused the bread aroma/taste, it is going away. Almost totally gone now. Next time, I will add some nutrient to make the yeast vey healthy and happy and hope to mitigate the breadiness.

 

[Ambrozie]

Hey, and welcome to the forum! Although I do not know for sure what caused the bread aroma/taste, it is going away. Almost totally gone now. Next time, I will add some nutrient to make the yeast vey healthy and happy and hope to mitigate the breadiness.

Glad to hear!
I just brewed my 4th batch (ever) earlier this week. It's sitting pretty in the carboy, so we will see what comes of it.
I went with a combination of Ec-1118, Go-ferm, and Fermaid K as primary ingredients.
Some gypsum, citric acid, and sodium citrate to get the pH at a level conducive to proper yeast fermentation.

My 3rd was definitely the least "breadiest" I've had so far; zero filtration (for the moment) of course. I think because of the addition of more nutrient, a better pH balance, and a longer duration cold crashing.

 

[duelerx]

What are you guys using for flavoring?, Apex, Amoretti? Just read Colby's Hard Seltzer book I highly recommend. I also read some recommendation of Lutra-Dextrose-Omega's Proper Yeast Nutrition

 

[bwible]

What are you guys using for flavoring?, Apex, Amoretti? Just read Colby's Hard Seltzer book I highly recommend. I also read some recommendation of Lutra-Dextrose-Omega's Proper Yeast Nutrition

I’ve used Apex for a few things. Only made hard seltzer once and I did it the easy way. Didn’t ferment anything, just used an alcohol dilution calculator to mix enough vodka with enough water to get to about 5%. Flavored with their green apple flavor because thats what the wife was into at the time. Put it in a keg and shot it full of co2.

The smallest size they sell is a 2 oz bottle. Their recommended usage is .1 to .3%. For seltzer I’d probably go .3%.

5 gallons x 128 ounces = 640 oz x .3% = 1.92 oz The 2 oz should be just about perfect

 

[FloppyKnockers]

Take two...

I'm taking another stab at this. This time around I'm going to make a smaller batch (only because the 6 gal carboy has wine in it), increase the gravity, and change out the yeast for EC-118.

Day 1 - 4 lbs of corn sugar in three gallons of water, pitched at 70°. OG = 1.043. The sugar water was Crystal clear. The yeast went ahead and fixed that for me.

Here we go!

 

[Rish]

Don't want to be a nitpicker but are you sure about your OG? 42 ppg of corn sugar should be about 1.056 if I did my math right. Not that it really matters, just kinda jumped out at me. Hope it turns out great!

 

[FloppyKnockers]

I mean, I wouldn't bet the farm on it because the calculator said the same as you. That's just what my refracto came up with. Maybe my few drops could have been diluted?

I might just have to use the tipsy-o-meter after it's done to know for sure.

 

[FloppyKnockers]

Welp. This was a bust. It's sitting here so many weeks later and has stalled at 1.025. I tried adding some US-05 to kick it into gear, but it just won't budge. Not sure what went wrong, but I'm gonna dump it and give it one more go.

 

[beren]

How are you measuring it? Not a refractometer I hope?

 

[FloppyKnockers]

How are you measuring it? Not a refractometer I hope?

Hydrometer.

 

[Chalkyt]

If it is only sugar and water and it has stalled, the yeast might have used all the nutrients. I suggest try adding a bit of DAP ( for some yeast assimilable nitrogen) or similar to see if it kicks along again.

 

[FloppyKnockers]

If it is only sugar and water and it has stalled, the yeast might have used all the nutrients. I suggest try adding a bit of DAP ( for some yeast assimilable nitrogen) or similar to see if it kicks along again.

I did add nutrient early on, but not DAP. I'll have to give that a try. Nothing to lose. It was drain bound anyway.

 

[jdubdvdt]

I have had great success using the expensive route to make hard seltzer at home. I don't really mind spending more money to make it - a 12 pack of seltzer is about $20-30 around me. I can do a whole 6.5 gallons (including new flavoring drams), for about $21. Also it is 4 days from pitching to glass. Fermentation was done in 24-30 hours.

Omega has their process on their website. https://omegayeast.com/4-day-lutra-hard-seltzer-recipe

Omega Lutra Kviek ($6.79 at ritebrew)
Omega Propper Seltzer Nutrient ($6.09 at ritebrew)
RO water and Dextrose to bring it up to your desired OG (6.5 gallons at 1.032 for me)
Next time I might treat the water with some minerals to give it a more rounded flavor, but it is clean, clear, and tastes like crappy sprite, almost like a less flavorful white wine. I add raspberry or blackberry flavoring drops to the glass before pouring. It has been very well received at my house when guests come over.

Buy your Omega stuff from Ritebrew and you'll save money.
I also have Mangrove Jack's yeast and seltzer nutrient I plan to check out this summer.
And I will be making a triple berry seltzer in a few days where I will ferment 8lbs of frozen berries in with the dextrose/water solution.