Stout - carbing in bottle - suggestions!

[Zippox]

Hey all, made my first stout finally and I would like opinions on how to carb this on bottles.

Please take a look at my stout recipe in the attached image and then check out my questions.

1. Should I use DME? That gives a creamier mouthfeel right, since the bubbles are normally smaller (from what I've read)? Or should I just stick with plain old corn sugar.
2. What volume of carbonation do most recommend? I've been seeing that between 1.6 and 2.0 is typically recommended for the style, but I want opinions on what you think works best.

 

[BigMack]

I use corn sugar for all of my priming, and I have had good results with my oatmeal stout. I carb it to about 2 volumes and it turns out great.

 

[Zippox]

I use corn sugar for all of my priming, and I have had good results with my oatmeal stout. I carb it to about 2 volumes and it turns out great.

That's good to hear someone has had success with 2 volumes using corn sugar.

 

[ol-hazza]

I would aim for 1.8-2 volumes, I find high carbonation and malty goodness don't go together.

I always used corn sugar and never had problems with my bubble size

 

[m00ps]

The type of sugar doesnt really effect the final beer as long as its an equivalent amount of sugar to prime. Some claim you can taste molasses or maple syrup primed beers, but I havent really been able to. Corn sugar is considered "best" because it is THE easiest thing for sacch yeast to metabolize (slightly easier than table sugar). This results, theoretically, in faster carbed bottles

the bubble size would be a factor of the gas used to carb it, right? Like any naturally carbed beer would have to be CO2. Force carbing you can use nitro or a combination of the two

 

[Grinder12000]

What is the temp of the beer before you bottle - pretty important before you add anything to it.

If it's 68 degrees 2 vols would be a snitch over 3 oz of priming sugar. If it's 65 you want to go less then 3 oz.

I think the malted oats will give you some pretty nice mouthfeel!

I've tried DME and never really liked what it did (not that priming sugar is all that great but . . . )

 

[iijakii]

And just to be clear it's the highest the beer has gotten once active fermentation was over, not just the temp it's currently at.

 

[Grinder12000]

And just to be clear it's the highest the beer has gotten once active fermentation was over, not just the temp it's currently at.

ahh - good point! Since this is normally the case for me I had forgotten about that!

 

[TasunkaWitko]

Try maple syrup - I did it with my oatmeal cookie stout (as well as chocolate maple porter, smoked wheat etc.) and really enjoyed it.

 

[hanuswalrus]

Also, make sure you know what your total bottling volume is going to be (volume of ACTUAL beer, minus the trub), and base your amount of sugar for the priming solution on that volume.

 

[ol-hazza]

And just to be clear it's the highest the beer has gotten once active fermentation was over, not just the temp it's currently at.

With a large headspace during cold crash it can still reabsorb CO2, always safest to bottle at warm temperatures.

 

[Yooper]

It doesn't matter what you use to prime- table sugar, corn sugar, DME, honey, etc- it will end up the same. Carbonation is carbonation- DME doesn't make smaller bubbles than corn sugar as it's all carbonation from yeast fermenting the sugar in the priming solution.

As far as carb levels, I like my bottled beer to all be about the same carbonation level, generally 2.2-2.5 volumes of c02. Most people who are accustomed to buying bottled beer also expect a certain amount of carbonation.

1.5-1.8 volumes is pretty flat, while 2.0 is very low to me. I'd go with 2.2 volumes at least, just because I don't like flat beer. I like cask ales, drawn with a beer engine, or real ales, but that's a different experience.

 

[Yooper]

With a large headspace during cold crash it can still reabsorb CO2, always safest to bottle at warm temperatures.

I read that like four times, and I still have no idea what that means.

A carboy has same volume whether it's at 40 degrees or 90 degrees, and so you don't have to allow the beer to warm before bottling. You can bottle it cold, no problem. Just make sure to use enough priming sugar (generally 3.5-5 ounces of corn sugar or so for 5 gallons depending on desired carb level) for carbonation and not rely on those priming calculators that take temperature into consideration.

 

[ol-hazza]

I read that like four times, and I still have no idea what that means.

A carboy has same volume whether it's at 40 degrees or 90 degrees, and so you don't have to allow the beer to warm before bottling. You can bottle it cold, no problem. Just make sure to use enough priming sugar (generally 3.5-5 ounces of corn sugar or so for 5 gallons depending on desired carb level) for carbonation and not rely on those priming calculators that take temperature into consideration.

If you cold crash in a vessel that has a large headspace full of co2, then the co2 is absorbed into the beer and affects carbonation levels.

I read on here repeatedly that cold crashing doesn't affect carbonation levels but that is just incorrect. If there is co2 in the headspace when you cold crash it is at the very least partially absorbed, and if you have a large headspace enough is absorbed to justify reducing the amount of sugar used when bottling cold, or warming the beer to degass it.

 

[iijakii]

I think youre overestimating how much that CO2 really stays as a blanket. Sure it's heavier than air but it isn't static. Add in taking off the bung and reaching down in there for a gravity sample etc and you don't have such a nice layer there.

 

[ol-hazza]

I have a tap at the bottom so no need to reach in.

My headspace is usually about the half that of my brew size (30 ishl fermenter with 19-25l brews). That leaves potential for 0.5 atmospheres of co2 to get into my beer. Im not saying it all does get absorbed but enough was to over carb my beers.

I might be an extreme example of this, but it was a real problem for me. ( I now keg).

Warming the beer before bottling removes the problem entirely, whether it was significant enough to worry about to begin with or not.

 

[Yooper]

If you cold crash in a vessel that has a large headspace full of co2, then the co2 is absorbed into the beer and affects carbonation levels.

I read on here repeatedly that cold crashing doesn't affect carbonation levels but that is just incorrect. If there is co2 in the headspace when you cold crash it is at the very least partially absorbed, and if you have a large headspace enough is absorbed to justify reducing the amount of sugar used when bottling cold, or warming the beer to degass it.

I see what you're saying, but from a scientific standpoint, that's just not so. The Ideal Gas Law and Boyle's Law really are some of the laws of physics, and they do apply.

headspace is never 100% c02, and after fermentation ends it's pretty much room air, as gasses seek equilibrium. The whole "c02 blanket" is a myth, and will not be found in any science textbook. If it was real, we'd all die in our sleep every night. Plus, whatever air is in the headspace is air in the beer (or wine, or whatever), it doesn't stratify and not absorb into the beer.

If the beers were overcarbed it wasn't because of the temperature of the beer in the carboy.

 

[ol-hazza]

I see what you're saying, but from a scientific standpoint, that's just not so. The Ideal Gas Law and Boyle's Law really are some of the laws of physics, and they do apply.

headspace is never 100% c02, and after fermentation ends it's pretty much room air, as gasses seek equilibrium. The whole "c02 blanket" is a myth, and will not be found in any science textbook. If it was real, we'd all die in our sleep every night. Plus, whatever air is in the headspace is air in the beer (or wine, or whatever), it doesn't stratify and not absorb into the beer.

If the beers were overcarbed it wasn't because of the temperature of the beer in the carboy.

I agree with everything but the timeframe for reaching equilibrium (and by proxy to this the overcarbing). I cold crashed a pale ale yesterday which was at day 10 after pitching yeast, had a sniff of it before dropping the temp and it wasn't room air stinging my nose.

There was a great article I read some time back that you may have posted yooper about gas movements through airlocks and bungs which I can't find which may shed some light here as to the timings of the gas movements.

As for my overcarbing, if it wasn't due to cold crashing then it is an incredible coincidence that it only happened when I cold crashed and didn't adjust the sugar amounts or bottling temperature.

 

[ol-hazza]

Found it