Spike Conical- observations and best practices

[Frazeart]

I bought two CF10 units gas manifolds for pressure fermentation and made a homemade glycol chilling unit with an air conditioner and a cooler. All in all, the units are awesome. Such a massive improvement in ease and quality of brewing. My only two complaints are: 1. The gasket for the lid does not fit well and falls out into the wort when trying to install the lid. 2. I wish the herms coil had some way to easily attach valves. The barbs are fine but when you remove the lines, glycol goes everywhere. on/off valves on the end would be great... or at least 1/4 NPT threads.

 

[mongoose33]

I bought two CF10 units gas manifolds for pressure fermentation and made a homemade glycol chilling unit with an air conditioner and a cooler. All in all, the units are awesome. Such a massive improvement in ease and quality of brewing. My only two complaints are: 1. The gasket for the lid does not fit well and falls out into the wort when trying to install the lid. 2. I wish the herms coil had some way to easily attach valves. The barbs are fine but when you remove the lines, glycol goes everywhere. on/off valves on the end would be great... or at least 1/4 NPT threads.
View attachment 590807 View attachment 590808

1. Are you sure you don't have the gasket upside down? The flat part goes up into the lid; the "pointing" side goes down against the bottom.

If you have it the right orientation, you could try some keg lube on the flat part that fits up into the lid. It would, I'm sure, help it stay up in the lid. I have the same setup, and mine doesn't come out unless I have it inverted.

2. Here's what I'm using as disconnects for the glycol lines; @Morrey put me on to them:

https://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=118169

and

https://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=118171

 

[Frazeart]

1. Are you sure you don't have the gasket upside down? The flat part goes up into the lid; the "pointing" side goes down against the bottom.

If you have it the right orientation, you could try some keg lube on the flat part that fits up into the lid. It would, I'm sure, help it stay up in the lid. I have the same setup, and mine doesn't come out unless I have it inverted.

2. Here's what I'm using as disconnects for the glycol lines; @Morrey put me on to them:

https://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=118169

and

https://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=118171

View attachment 590814

Hey, thanks for the info. I do have the gasket in there correctly, it is just sized odd. One of my two gaskets fits quite well but one is too big. I tried keg lube but it didn't have enough grip. Ended up using a bit of superglue but wish I didn't have to. As to the disconnects you posted: do they fit perfectly or did you have to bend the herms barbs? Are the connectors auto shut off? Do they not leak when you disconnect them?

 

[mongoose33]

Hey, thanks for the info. I do have the gasket in there correctly, it is just sized odd. One of my two gaskets fits quite well but one is too big. I tried keg lube but it didn't have enough grip. Ended up using a bit of superglue but wish I didn't have to. As to the disconnects you posted: do they fit perfectly or did you have to bend the herms barbs? Are the connectors auto shut off? Do they not leak when you disconnect them?

If the gasket is wrong, contact spike about it. I bought a spare gasket but I've never used it; you've motivated me to put it in and see how it does.

Not sure what you mean about the HERMS barbs. The chilling coil stainless tubing comes out of the top of the unit, but no barbs. Mine came with 90-degree-angle John Guest fittings into which fit the tubes from the neoprene-covered glycol tubes supplied by Spike. BTW, I found the same diameter fittings at Menards, my local home store.

As far as the disconnects, yes, they are auto shut off. I disconnect them and hang the one side up on a hook, leaving just a small bit of tubing and the disconnects on the chilling coil.

 

[CodeSection]

...I do have the gasket in there correctly, it is just sized odd. One of my two gaskets fits quite well but one is too big. I tried keg lube but it didn't have enough grip. Ended up using a bit of superglue but wish I didn't have to...

Try putting the gasket in the freezer for about 30-60 minutes. No matter what the gasket was that I was using, it always shrunk to size and eliminated the extra slop. I have used this procedure on the CF10 gasket as well. Works great.

 

[Frazeart]

If the gasket is wrong, contact spike about it. I bought a spare gasket but I've never used it; you've motivated me to put it in and see how it does.

Not sure what you mean about the HERMS barbs. The chilling coil stainless tubing comes out of the top of the unit, but no barbs. Mine came with 90-degree-angle John Guest fittings into which fit the tubes from the neoprene-covered glycol tubes supplied by Spike. BTW, I found the same diameter fittings at Menards, my local home store.

As far as the disconnects, yes, they are auto shut off. I disconnect them and hang the one side up on a hook, leaving just a small bit of tubing and the disconnects on the chilling coil.

Hello. Sorry for the confusion. I was referring to the in and out for the chilling coil. You are correct, they arent barbs just straight pipe. Thanks for the link to the fittings. I am going to order some and try it out. Cheers!

 

[Frazeart]

Try putting the gasket in the freezer for about 30-60 minutes. No matter what the gasket was that I was using, it always shrunk to size and eliminated the extra slop. I have used this procedure on the CF10 gasket as well. Works great.

Thanks. I will try and report back.

 

[metaltim]

I am strongly considering getting a CF10. I currently have a more beer cooled fermenter, but being in Colorado, I hardly need the cooling, I need heating. (I brew and ferment in garage)

But something is baffling me. So many people are going through such great lengths to use this spike chilling coil with glycol, pumps, hoses, reservoirs, chillers and/or freezers for reservoirs.. it seems like a lot of work and $. Am I missing something when I think to myself, why not just throw this conical in an upright freezer with a temp controller on it?

I think I only saw one person post a pic showing it this way. This seems like a WAAAY better option. If my current more beer conical would fit in a freezer, I would keep it and do that, but it's 15 years old and much bigger than these newer designs. Not only width wise, but my conical has permanent leg extensions, so it's like 4.5' tall.

So to anyone with this conical in an upright freezer, is it this easy? Set your freezer to the temp you want and leave it alone? If I'm too cold, I'll put a ceramic bulb heater type thing (very inexpensive) in order to heat it up. When it comes time to cold crash, I'd imagine it could go quickly by using freezer temps.

It seems an upright freezer is not much of a bigger footprint than the conical itself, so no issue there. For mobility, I anticipate putting my upright freezer on wheels, so I can roll it to where I am brewing across the garage, fill the conical (already placed inside the freezer), then roll the whole unit back to it's spot and plug it in. Pressure transfer when done, then I can easily take the conical out to clean in the driveway.

Here is the only one I saw after a quick scroll through all the pages

Random spike conical pic from the other night. Carb stone works greatView attachment 568662

Blazinlow86, how is this working for you?

 

[mongoose33]

I am strongly considering getting a CF10. I currently have a more beer cooled fermenter, but being in Colorado, I hardly need the cooling, I need heating. (I brew and ferment in garage)

But something is baffling me. So many people are going through such great lengths to use this spike chilling coil with glycol, pumps, hoses, reservoirs, chillers and/or freezers for reservoirs.. it seems like a lot of work and $. Am I missing something when I think to myself, why not just throw this conical in an upright freezer with a temp controller on it?

I think I only saw one person post a pic showing it this way. This seems like a WAAAY better option. If my current more beer conical would fit in a freezer, I would keep it and do that, but it's 15 years old and much bigger than these newer designs. Not only width wise, but my conical has permanent leg extensions, so it's like 4.5' tall.

So to anyone with this conical in an upright freezer, is it this easy? Set your freezer to the temp you want and leave it alone? If I'm too cold, I'll put a ceramic bulb heater type thing (very inexpensive) in order to heat it up. When it comes time to cold crash, I'd imagine it could go quickly by using freezer temps.

It seems an upright freezer is not much of a bigger footprint than the conical itself, so no issue there. For mobility, I anticipate putting my upright freezer on wheels, so I can roll it to where I am brewing across the garage, fill the conical (already placed inside the freezer), then roll the whole unit back to it's spot and plug it in. Pressure transfer when done, then I can easily take the conical out to clean in the driveway.

Here is the only one I saw after a quick scroll through all the pages

Blazinlow86, how is this working for you?

I have two ferm chambers for plastic fermenters; I always felt they were great at controlling temps.

My first thought was to get a refrigerator or freezer for the CF10 I have, but there are a few issues with that. One is that the upright freezers I've seen typically have the freezing coils in the shelves, which can't be removed. Another is that the CF10 has a largish diameter. You have to account for the 3 legs plus the ports. A lot of freezers don't appear to be deep enough to accommodate something like that.

And if you get something that is...well, the price goes up.

I like the idea of having it on wheels, if you can make that work. What I like about mine is I can roll it right next to my sink and spray it out.

So it's not that keeping it in a freezer or a fridge is a bad idea, it's finding a reasonably-priced option into which it will fit.

 

[metaltim]

Mongoose, I have def. noticed the limitation with cooling coils in the shelves, however it seems the newer models now have removable shelves, and the coiled shelves are a thing of the past.

I didn't mention, but I was def. considering getting a used one. Otherwise a new one is $500-$700, so it being a 'cheaper' option gets tossed out the window. I've seen several used ones with removable shelves under $200, some even at $100.

 

[stevehaun]

I used an upright freezer to control fermentation temps with a 40 gallon Stout conical. No problems over 5 years and 50+ batches. I bought a CF 10 last spring and I am using a slightly smaller upright freezer. You do have to buy one without the cooling coils in the shelves and you may have to modify the shelves on the door slightly. I mostly make lagers and have been quite happy with the performance of the upright freezer. Obviously 11 gallons of beer chills much more rapidly than 33 gallons even with a smaller upright freezer. I bought my upright freezer new but it was a scratch & dent. I think I paid about $300. I have also used a light bulb to heat in the winter.

 

[metaltim]

I used an upright freezer to control fermentation temps with a 40 gallon Stout conical. No problems over 5 years and 50+ batches. I bought a CF 10 last spring and I am using a slightly smaller upright freezer. You do have to buy one without the cooling coils in the shelves and you may have to modify the shelves on the door slightly. I mostly make lagers and have been quite happy with the performance of the upright freezer. Obviously 11 gallons of beer chills much more rapidly than 33 gallons even with a smaller upright freezer. I bought my upright freezer new but it was a scratch & dent. I think I paid about $300. I have also used a light bulb to heat in the winter.

View attachment 596641

That fits like a glove! two questions, what are the interior dimensions on that one so I can insure what I find will fit the CF10, also what is the brand, cuft and exterior dimensions of that freezer so I can look for that one in particular?

 

[stevehaun]

It is a Frigidaire. I think it is 14 cu ft.
external dimensions: 62" high x 30.25" deep x 29.5" wide
internal dimensions: 45" high x 23.75" deep x 23.25" wide
The depth at the level of the "hump" is 20.75" - this is probably the most important dimension.
Here is the tag on the inside of the freezer:

 

[jturman35]

Is there any trick to dumping the yeast? I never had any trub build up 24/48 after brew day. I dumped about 2 quarts of yeast after 5 days. The yeast seems to have settled on the bottom and just beer comes over the top of it.

Also, just an observation but using the supplied temp controller with the thermowell I am seeing actual beer temp 1 degree warmer than its reading. I always measure my hydro samples to confirm this.

 

[augiedoggy]

Is there any trick to dumping the yeast? I never had any trub build up 24/48 after brew day. I dumped about 2 quarts of yeast after 5 days. The yeast seems to have settled on the bottom and just beer comes over the top of it.

View attachment 596694View attachment 596695


Also, just an observation but using the supplied temp controller with the thermowell I am seeing actual beer temp 1 degree warmer than its reading. I always measure my hydro samples to confirm this.

I would suggest putting the butterfly valve before the sight glass to stop the issue of the yeast sitting at the bottom of the horizontal portion of the drain pipe. this is just a limitation of horizontal pipe instead of vertical where gravity would aid in purging the yeast. if you could extend the legs and mount it vertically (or at least mount the sightglass vertically) it would also perform better.

as far as the 1 degree difference there may be a way to adjust the temp offset readout on the inkbird but maybe not... I think the key thing to consider is its an economical temp controller and 1 degree will not matter from a practical standpoint.

 

[mongoose33]

I think his issue w/ the sight glass is it's not vertical. Looking at the pic i don't know if he can get the sight glass on the fermenter first, then the butterfly valve, then the 90-degree tube.

That's how I'd do it. That way the yeast/trub settle in the bottom of the sight tube, just above the butterfly valve, and there's no way for the beer to bypass that trub on the top of a horizontal sight glass.

Might need to raise the fermenter a bit to do that. Probably 4 inch "stilts" under the feet would be enough.

 

[tll77]

I think his issue w/ the sight glass is it's not vertical. Looking at the pic i don't know if he can get the sight glass on the fermenter first, then the butterfly valve, then the 90-degree tube.

I experienced just this with the cf10 assembled with the sight glass horizontal. There was always some beer above the trub/yeast in the glass. It didn't quite fit vertically so I bought the leg extensions.
I've got the sight glass on the bottom port then the 90 then butterfly valve. I'm much happier with this arrangement.

 

[tll77]

Sight glass porn

 

[metaltim]

It is a Frigidaire. I think it is 14 cu ft.
external dimensions: 62" high x 30.25" deep x 29.5" wide
internal dimensions: 45" high x 23.75" deep x 23.25" wide
The depth at the level of the "hump" is 20.75" - this is probably the most important dimension.
Here is the tag on the inside of the freezer:

View attachment 596665

Just to confirm, you're giving me measurements to the freezer with the spike CF10 in it? (Want to make sure you weren't talking about the one with the stout 40gal in it)

I see you don't have the shelves removed from the door.. you can fully close the door with unit inside without removing those shelves?

I see this freezer on sale for $400, so I really think this is what I want. Different model number but 13.8 cuft and exterior dimensions match up.

I don't even see the hump in your pic, do you have a bit of a raised floor with that plywood?

 

[stevehaun]

The dimensions are for the cf 10. I used a 20+ cu ft freezer for my 40 gallon fermenter. The hump is on the back wall which shortens the depth dimension but not the height. I was able to close the door without modifying the door if the fermenter was positioned perfectly. I ended up modifying the door to give a little more room. I will take a pic of the door when I get home tonight.

 

[stevehaun]

Here is the "hump" I am describing:

Here is the door with the fronts of the shelves removed and modification:

Close up of modification:

 

[Blazinlow86]

I am strongly considering getting a CF10. I currently have a more beer cooled fermenter, but being in Colorado, I hardly need the cooling, I need heating. (I brew and ferment in garage)

But something is baffling me. So many people are going through such great lengths to use this spike chilling coil with glycol, pumps, hoses, reservoirs, chillers and/or freezers for reservoirs.. it seems like a lot of work and $. Am I missing something when I think to myself, why not just throw this conical in an upright freezer with a temp controller on it?

I think I only saw one person post a pic showing it this way. This seems like a WAAAY better option. If my current more beer conical would fit in a freezer, I would keep it and do that, but it's 15 years old and much bigger than these newer designs. Not only width wise, but my conical has permanent leg extensions, so it's like 4.5' tall.

So to anyone with this conical in an upright freezer, is it this easy? Set your freezer to the temp you want and leave it alone? If I'm too cold, I'll put a ceramic bulb heater type thing (very inexpensive) in order to heat it up. When it comes time to cold crash, I'd imagine it could go quickly by using freezer temps.

It seems an upright freezer is not much of a bigger footprint than the conical itself, so no issue there. For mobility, I anticipate putting my upright freezer on wheels, so I can roll it to where I am brewing across the garage, fill the conical (already placed inside the freezer), then roll the whole unit back to it's spot and plug it in. Pressure transfer when done, then I can easily take the conical out to clean in the driveway.

Here is the only one I saw after a quick scroll through all the pages


Blazinlow86, how is this working for you?

Sorry I missed your question earlier on. I got lucky and got the fridge/freezer from a member of my homebrew club for 70$. It works fantastic. I added wheels to the fridge and brew in my basement on a smooth concrete floor so I just roll it over to fill. When I first bought the conical I didn't really think about the cooling 100% and was VERY much regretting the purchase after realizing how much extra stuff was gonna be needed to cool it using glycol compared to my previous method of carboys and chest freezer. Few days later I came across the fridge and the rest is history. I also have a light bulb in a paint can to heat but haven't really used it. I'd say if your process allows it (fridge) you would be foolish to overthink cooling 15g of liquid. Not anti glycol if it works for you however. Cheers

 

[metaltim]

I'd say if your process allows it (fridge) you would be foolish to overthink cooling 15g of liquid. Not anti glycol if it works for you however. CheersView attachment 597516

Oh yeh, I didn't mean to imply I was considering not having cooling.
my current conical is a thermoelectrically cooled unit, it can cool wort to about 20 degrees below ambient. Problem is, there is no heating, and I brewed a belgian dubbel back in late october, and it only had a few days at mid 60s, then dropped down to high 50s cause a front came in and my garage was cold.


So I just found a True GDM10 on facebook market place for $400,so I'm gonna jump all over that. I was gonna buy the frigidaire mentioned above at $400, but if I can get a used True fridge and glass door to boot for same price it's a no brainer for me.

 

[Blazinlow86]

Oh yeh, I didn't mean to imply I was considering not having cooling.
my current conical is a thermoelectrically cooled unit, it can cool wort to about 20 degrees below ambient. Problem is, there is no heating, and I brewed a belgian dubbel back in late october, and it only had a few days at mid 60s, then dropped down to high 50s cause a front came in and my garage was cold.


So I just found a True GDM10 on facebook market place for $400,so I'm gonna jump all over that. I was gonna buy the frigidaire mentioned above at $400, but if I can get a used True fridge and glass door to boot for same price it's a no brainer for me.

The true brand with glass would be great. To clarify I was meaning that *if* a fridge works with anyone's process to get a glycol setup anyway (usually to show off the conical in this case) is nuts. Cheers

 

[jturman35]

When are you guys dumping the yeast? Seems this process varies from person to person but seems most think dumping the yeast after fermentation has ended 10-14days.

 

[Nagorg]

When are you guys dumping the yeast? Seems this process varies from person to person but seems most think dumping the yeast after fermentation has ended 10-14days.

I typically do it once after ~7 days and then again around ~14 days before I cold crash.

 

[itsnotrequired]

i dump at the end of fermentation, along with most of the dry hops. a bit of a guessing game, i'm just trying to get the level of trub, yeast, hops, etc. below the racking port level. this is so i don't suck all that stuff into the keg when transferring. i could dump all the way down to the sight glass to ensure i got everything but then i leave a decent amount of clear beer behind between the racking port and the sight glass.

i do not dump again after cold crash, concerns with kicking up some of the material that has already settled.

 

[kevink]

Sorry I missed your question earlier on. I got lucky and got the fridge/freezer from a member of my homebrew club for 70$. It works fantastic. I added wheels to the fridge and brew in my basement on a smooth concrete floor so I just roll it over to fill. When I first bought the conical I didn't really think about the cooling 100% and was VERY much regretting the purchase after realizing how much extra stuff was gonna be needed to cool it using glycol compared to my previous method of carboys and chest freezer. Few days later I came across the fridge and the rest is history. I also have a light bulb in a paint can to heat but haven't really used it. I'd say if your process allows it (fridge) you would be foolish to overthink cooling 15g of liquid. Not anti glycol if it works for you however. Cheers

Not only that, but with a fridge you can easily use BrewPi which is AMAZING. Like life-altering amazing!

 

[cozmogeek]

I finally got around to starting a batch in my new CF15. It's probably a good thing they won't accept returns for used items because this goddamn POS lid gasket makes me so mad I'd probably send the whole damn thing back. Yes it is installed the correct direction. That doesn't really matter though since nothing actually holds it in place. as soon as I rotate the lid past 90 degrees (straight up and down) the gasket flies right off. Everything else about the cf15 is fantastic, but this gasket ruins the entire thing.

 

[CadiBrewer]

I finally got around to starting a batch in my new CF15. It's probably a good thing they won't accept returns for used items because this goddamn POS lid gasket makes me so mad I'd probably send the whole damn thing back. Yes it is installed the correct direction. That doesn't really matter though since nothing actually holds it in place. as soon as I rotate the lid past 90 degrees (straight up and down) the gasket flies right off. Everything else about the cf15 is fantastic, but this gasket ruins the entire thing.

I ran into this, too, and had the same frustrated, send it back reaction. Then when I dumped my yeast the first time, transferred the beer under pressure without a racking cane and siphon, and cleaned up the stainless steel instead of scrubbing plastic buckets, everything about the gasket was forgotten. Until my second batch, when I had the same frustration.

I found that cleaning the lid and gasket well, then drying them off, and then seating the gasket dry was the ticket. I then spray it all down well with a spray bottle of star san. It holds in place without problem that way.

I'm back to hearting my conical 100%.

 

[cozmogeek]

Has anybody tried pinching the gasket in place by bending the lip on the lid?

 

[cozmogeek]

I ran into this, too, and had the same frustrated, send it back reaction. Then when I dumped my yeast the first time, transferred the beer under pressure without a racking cane and siphon, and cleaned up the stainless steel instead of scrubbing plastic buckets, everything about the gasket was forgotten. Until my second batch, when I had the same frustration.

I found that cleaning the lid and gasket well, then drying them off, and then seating the gasket dry was the ticket. I then spray it all down well with a spray bottle of star san. It holds in place without problem that way.

I'm back to hearting my conical 100%.

Thanks for talking me down.

 

[Blazinlow86]

Not that it helps people having issues with the gasket but fwiw mine sits pretty tightly. Possibly some have a slightly larger gap the gadget sits in and can be bent slightly to tighten it up? Cheers

 

[itsnotrequired]

i've also seems some complaints about the gasket but (maybe) knock on wood, no issues here. i can put it in and shake the lid with the gasket facing down, no issues. if you have issues, contract spike, they have been super responsive/accommodating in my experience.

 

[cozmogeek]

Not that it helps people having issues with the gasket but fwiw mine sits pretty tightly. Possibly some have a slightly larger gap the gadget sits in and can be bent slightly to tighten it up? Cheers

I just tried squeezing it tighter in a few places around the lid. It seems like it may help, but of course the lid and gasket are dry now so it's hard to say if it actually did anything.

 

[PowerSchlitz]

My CF 5 in a Kenmore upright freezer using an Inbird 308 external thermostat. I also use a small space heater and a computer fan for increased air flow. Other than having to bypass the internal thermostat, my system works perfectly for me.

 

[Sbe2]

My wife ordered a CF5 for me. Can’t wait to use it.

Any tips/tricks for first time users?

 

[itsnotrequired]

Any tips/tricks for first time users?

make sure the butterfly valves are closed before you start filling it

 

[Blazinlow86]

My wife ordered a CF5 for me. Can’t wait to use it.

Any tips/tricks for first time users?

Don't attempt to use the lower dump valve without a hose of some sort or your gonna have a spectacular mess. I have a 3/8 diameter barbed tri clamp I use with the silicon brew hose to direct it into a container

 

[cozmogeek]

My wife ordered a CF5 for me. Can’t wait to use it.

Any tips/tricks for first time users?

I got a 2" to 1.5" Tri clamp adapter so that I can use my regular hose that has 1.5" connections on it on that bottom valve too. It is handy for sanitizing. I put the 2" drain outlet into my pump and the output of my pump into the CIP ball and let it run for a few minutes.