Sour beer

[ruskii]

Hi,

Let me first say, I am an intermediate brewer with some experience. I do all mash brewing with kegging in the end. Recently I've been having a weird problem. About 3 batches in a row had a sour taste in the beer. Here is my setup:
- Converted cooler to a mash tun. It has cooper tubes on the bottom slightly precut to imitate false bottom with proper coverage of the whole cooler. Cooper piping comes outside cooler through brass adapters. I also silicone tubes for transferring liquid.

- Boiling occurs in regular stockpot outside in the backyard.

- Fermentation occurs in Blichmann Fermenator in the basement.

- After that I keg the batch in 5 gallon soda keg and after adding a bit sugar for natural carbonation and letting it sit for 9 days, I place the keg in kegarator.

Like I said, in last couple of batches I had relatively too sour beer which is drinkable but not enjoyable. I've been using this setup for some time now without any issues.

Here is my ideas what the problem is:

1. I have bought grains in 55 lbs bags which I used in most of my batches. They are uncracked and have been sitting in my dry basement for more than a year already. I read online that as long as grains are properly stored, they can survive that long. Plus you can test the grain by cracking one and see how strong it is. I've also tried using small amount of these in one batch. Same result.

2. Can cooper pipes after some time cause the off flavor? Maybe Brass adapters? Not sure about this but something tells me that it is not the case.

3. Most likely reason for off flavor is the yeast. As I read only, yeast can produce sour flavor if it is fermenting in wrong temperature range. This would make a lot of sense since it is not as cold as it should be in my basement. BUT I did not have this problem before. I mean it happened a few times, but not 3 batches in a row.

Anybody has any idea?

Sorry for long post.

Thanks.

 

[beeber]

Your grain is fine and the copper pipes/brass are fine. I don't know if you are using liquid yeast or dry, or if you are using a starter. I would recommend using a starter.

Sour beer is most likely the result of an infection. The offending organisms have taken up residence in your brewing equipment. I would clean absolutely everything that touches your beer. I would bleach bomb everything except the stainless steel, and give it another try. Use a starter, it gives you the best chance for good results.

 

[ruskii]

I use liquid yeasts (Wyeast and White Labs). I do not use a starter. My yeast seems to work great. I mean it does its job.

Good point about infection. I didnt think of this. Do you know if I can bleach my plastic cooler? Or simple wash will do?
How long should I bleach for? and what is the appropriate way of getting rid of bleach?

Thanks for your help.

 

[beeber]

ruskii, you can bleach everything. But be careful, bleach will harm stainless steel if left to soak too long. Be safe and don't bleach stainless steel.

This is from John Palmer...(though I generally soak overnight). Make sure to rinse completely, you do not want bleach residue!

The cheapest and most readily available sanitizing solution is made by adding 1 tablespoon of bleach to 1 gallon of water (4 ml per liter). Let the items soak for 20 minutes, and then drain. Rinsing is supposedly not necessary at this concentration, but many brewers, myself included, rinse with some boiled water anyway to be sure of no off-flavors from the chlorine.

 

[ktblunden]

When it comes to infection you're looking at anything that touches your beer post - boil. Anything introduced in your mash tun will not survive the boil, so don't worry about that. Look at transfer hoses, auto-siphons, your fermentor, your kegs, etc. How are you cleaning and sanitizing your fermentor, kegs, etc?

 

[carton132]

The cooler won't cause any problems because it's pre-boil, so no need to worry about bleaching it. How are you transferring the beer to the fermenator and keg? Plastic syphon and lines? Maybe replace those if so.

Do you do anything to sanitize the sugar, like dissolving it in boiled first? Maybe try carbonating with gas rather than natural carbonation next time. It's worth a shot.

 

[ruskii]

I use cleaning solution called easy-clean cleaner. It says to dissolve 1 table spoon in 1 gallon of water. I also have PBW. I am going to give it a shot and use it instead of bleach.

I guess last couple of batches I was not as good about sanitizing.

It sounds like my problem is infection/bacteria for sure.

I will clean all of my post-boil equipment with PBW and sanitize it thoroughly.

Thank you everyone

 

[krahm]

The previous posts are giving good advice, but I'm just going to complicate things slightly, if you all don't mind. If you're getting a "tart" note to the beer, it could be something else. I've gotten tart flavors from particular yeasts and particular hops. Nottingham yeast can, every once in a while, impart a tart quality to the beer, for instance, as can certain other strains like Wyeast British Ale (1098). I've only used Notty once, and it made the beer notably tart and really not very enjoyable. Not everyone gets this result from it, but some folks do (I guess I'm just one of the lucky ones). I've also gotten a tart note from hopbursting with certain American hops, like Cascade and Centennial. If you're getting a gooey film on the surface of your beer after fermentation is done (aka a "pellicle), that may indicate bacterial infection. If the tart flavor develops over time in the keg, that may be a bacterial infection developing from residual bacteria in the keg. If there's no visible sign of a pellicle, and the flavor is there immediately upon transferring it from primary, and you've already nuked all your equipment with bleach, then you might want to consider your ingredients. 'Just another possibility. 'Hope you figure it out.

 

[ktblunden]

I use cleaning solution called easy-clean cleaner. It says to dissolve 1 table spoon in 1 gallon of water. I also have PBW. I am going to give it a shot and use it instead of bleach.

I guess last couple of batches I was not as good about sanitizing.

It sounds like my problem is infection/bacteria for sure.

I will clean all of my post-boil equipment with PBW and sanitize it thoroughly.

Thank you everyone

You mention Easy Clean and PBW. Both are cleaners, not sanitizers. Get some StarSan and use that on all racking equipment, fermenters, and kegs just before they come in contact with your beer.