Single Vessel, All Electric, NS, NC Brewery

[beerocd]

So you're sayin' you have a valid excuse and I don't...

 

[ScubaSteve]

So you're sayin' you have a valid excuse and I don't...

Well....I COULD brew beer here (believe me, I've considered it). But it's not worth losing my career over So, until I get back I'll just obsess and watch Ebay like a hawk

 

[OEHokie]

Awesome thread! Read the whole thing. Going to let it steep in the brain for a while, but plan on trying something similar myself. Good luck to all

OE

 

[ScubaSteve]

Hey guys, just a quick update....i've been amassing tools, and I still need to get several parts for this thing. I was thinking about doing a scaled down 115v 4 gallon version but since I bought the sprayball and several other parts I think i'm committed to the 220v version. Planning on using a 14g Italian kettle I already own and inserting the 44 qt basket. If I sparge, i think i can get away with a smaller vessel and still do 10 gal batches...

 

[wyzazz]

Go with 220v, the elements/electronics are really not that much more IMHO. I'm still looking around for a 1/2bbl Plastic/Rubber coated keg for my build.

 

[ScubaSteve]

I've been thinking about ways to insulate the vessel while still keeping it looking awesome. I appreciate the reflectix and the rubber for the insulating abilities....but I want to make something that is a bit more eyecatching. I think I'm going to go with 2" vertical wood slats around the perimeter, all held in place by 2 leather or metal bands. I think it'll look classy with some nice finish on the wood. I figure I could up the "R" factor by still putting a layer of reflectix around the vessel under the wood.

 

[wyzazz]

While I think it would look nice, I don't know about how easy to clean that would be. I'm a messy brewer!

 

[ScubaSteve]

Well, this will be clean in place....and I use fermcap religiously so I haven't had a boilover in a few years. That stuff is great!

 

[wyzazz]

Lol, I use it too but like I said I'm a messy brewer!

 

[jeffmeh]

Good to see you back here Steve. I'm hoping that you will build this thing and report on it so I can learn from your mistakes rather than my own. :cross:

Actually, I have done my first two BIAB batches, both still in the fermentors, so I am starting to learn what will be feasible for the single-vessel, electric, recirculating, no-sparge, no-chill, clean-in-place version. Well, at least I am learning a few things that will not work.

For example, it is now obvious to me that without a rigid basket the recirculation is not going to result in clear wort, because the shifting of the grain bed when pulling out the bag releases a bunch of particulates.

Additionally, I found that there were hot and cold spots in the folds of the bag material. I probably did not stir enough in the first batch to get an accurate temperature reading, and ending up mashing high. Another argument for a rigid basket.

I also think that I will need both a traditional lower-side valve with a pickup tube for draining the wort, and a dead-center bottom valve to get complete draining for clean-in-place. The amount of break material with these BIAB batches would either clog a filter, or result in a filter that is a bear to clean. I think whirlpooling with a side pickup tube will be a better approach for draining wort. Of course this means that the clean-in-place line will have to be teed off to both feed the spray ball at the top and feed through the valve and pickup tube, draining through the dead-center bottom valve.

I am still wondering for the recirculation whether the grain bed filtering will be adequate with a basket with holes on the sides and bottom, or will require holes only on the bottom. I do not think I can figure that one out without trying it, or hearing from someone who has done so.

All that said, I am finding that BIAB is a perfectly feasible method without the bells and whistles. Planning and building this thing is for my own entertainment rather than necessity. It will be great to end up with a shiny, new system for 10 gallon batches, though.

 

[ScubaSteve]

So, I already had one of these:

It's ~14 gallons...and I like it because it doesn't have handles. I just want a straight sided stainless tank for aesthetics.

and I just bought one of these:

It's the 62 qt version......

It is SO on......

 

[wyzazz]

So how do you plan to modify the basket? Are you just going to line it with SS Mesh?

 

[ScubaSteve]

I'm not completely sure yet. I purchased the mesh a while back, and I recently got an oxyacetylene welding set. I don't know if I have the skill yet to weld something like this in....especially the screen. I'd be more likely to wreck the basket.

I DO have a propane soldering torch......maybe I'll just get some good silver solder and some solar flux.

Or, I could just give the nylon mesh bag a try.....but I still think it'd be a lot slicker to have a permanent "dump n' spray" kind of basket.

 

[wyzazz]

I agree about the "Dump N Spray", I'd like to see about making 12" diameter SS Mesh Basket for the BAIB'ers. That should fit inside a keggle with little to no issues, if I can ever find a rubber/plastic coated keg I'll see what I can come up with!

 

[ScubaSteve]

So I'm putting together stuff for my rig and I've already sunk quite a bit of cash into it just buying parts. I'd really like to do 1.5" square SS tube, but I think it will be pretty pricey (>$100) even for my ultra-small stand (24x24x18). I don't think I can weld it satisfactorily and I don't want to have to pay a guy in addition to the very high cost of SS.

I've got a few other options in mind:
1. Build it out of wood but make it look nice...it'll be all electric so flame isn't a concern. It's one 14gal vessel so weight isn't a big worry either. I can see shiny tri-clovers and rich wood looking really classy...

2. I have bedframes I can cut and weld, the mild steel should be way easier to work with. I guess I could buy a metal cutting blade for my combo miter saw.

2a. Anyone got advice on a way to paint a stand and still make it look top-notch? I see some guys using that hammered finish spray paint, and many say it gives a very durable finish with a cool industrial look.

Just wondering what you guys might think

 

[wyzazz]

If you want a rugged look you could always Line-X it!

I've got this in my truck bed, and have seen it on all sorts of things lately.

 

[ScubaSteve]

That's a pretty good idea! I wonder what something like that would cost. I think it was WortMonger on this forum who Rhino Lined his kegs......

 

[wyzazz]

I'm sure it's not super cheap but you know it'd be durable for sure!

 

[bakins]

I agree about the "Dump N Spray", I'd like to see about making 12" diameter SS Mesh Basket for the BAIB'ers.

I'm wondering can you use nylon mesh? Not as pretty, but easy to rinse, is food safe, etc.

 

[wyzazz]

I'm sure it would work, as the paint strainer bags lots of us use are nylon. I'd just like to see something rigid, maybe if there was a stainless or copper frame built, with the nylon then stretched over it? This way it's easily removable?

Or maybe just a Lil Sparky Hop Sock with a really big bag and really wide mouth? Anyone have a source for 12" SS Rigid rings?

 

[bakins]

I'm sure it would work, as the paint strainer bags lots of us use are nylon. I'd just like to see something rigid, maybe if there was a stainless or copper frame built, with the nylon then stretched over it? This way it's easily removable?

You can get nylon rigid mesh.

See mcmaster: http://www.mcmaster.com/#catalog/116/403/=6yy9mx
They have more, but a quick search turned up that.

 

[wyzazz]

Hmmm, rigid nylon may be harder to bind together then SS mesh. Any ideas how well a seam that is welded with heat may hold up with the nylon?

 

[ScubaSteve]

I saw that rigid nylon on there...pretty cool stuff. Really, I could just do what Harkin does and use the bag in a basket. I may focus on other parts of the build until I get it up and running....then I can decide how bad I need the SS mesh installed. I guess I just figured on doing the tricked out basket because I wanted to keep things stainless.

The basket is supposed to arrive in the mail today/tomorrow....still have to order the solar flux and silver solder. In the meantime, I will continue to accrue the parts needed to make this thing awesome. I really hope this next Ebay purchase pans out....I can't wait to post it!

 

[ScubaSteve]

You can get nylon rigid mesh.

See mcmaster: http://www.mcmaster.com/#catalog/116/403/=6yy9mx
They have more, but a quick search turned up that.

Hard to believe rigid nylon could actually be more expensive than 316ss, isn't it? If you had to go this route, I'm sure JB weld would do a fine job of keeping it together....the trick would be to not get it everywhere...that stuff is sticky!

 

[wyzazz]

Hard to believe rigid nylon could actually be more expensive than 316ss, isn't it? If you had to go this route, I'm sure JB weld would do a fine job of keeping it together....the trick would be to not get it everywhere...that stuff is sticky!

I was thinking the same thing, for the price I would probably just go with SS.

 

[ScubaSteve]

So I got the basket, and here's how it all fits together......

 

[jeffmeh]

So I got the basket, and here's how it all fits together......

Excellent. Does the basket fit exactly on the rim of the kettle, or do you need to rig something up to keep it off the bottom? If it rests on the rim, how well does the cover fit?

 

[wyzazz]

Nice fit! 10 char

 

[ScubaSteve]

It sits right on the rim of the kettle; there might be a centimeter of overlap, if that.

I really like it because the basket fills the maximum amount of the kettle with very little extra space....meaning that my "mash tun" is as big as possible. Does that make sense?

I think I will modify the basket to be able to drop down into the kettle. I want it an inch or so above the element so I can potentially do sub-5 gallon batches and still be able to submerge the grain.

 

[wyzazz]

Huh, sub-5 gallons?!! Blasphemy!!!