Reviews on Millar's Barley Mill?

[one-L]

Oh, I agree completely, and dont plan on going ultra top of the line either, but 140 (what they are going for on his site right now) is still a lot of dough, and I would expect him to stand behind his product more for all that he touts its superiority and durability. Everybody has to make up their own mind, just wanted to put the warranty info up there since it was mentioned earlier and its not on the site.

 

[funnycreature]

I hear what you're saying, but trust me - I spun the roller pretty quick and you could clearly see a "shift". The driven roller doesn't do this. I agree that it probably isn't really a big deal, but it sure makes setting the gap a total pain in the arse...

I'd use an old toothbrush to dust out the rollers. We never throw away toothbrushes...

I did my first crush - realized I couldn't use my power drill because it's a one-speed-fits-all at 1200 rpm. Probably a good way to make some smoked malt though... :cross: I compared it to the crush from my LHBS and it sure looks good to me - lots of endosperm visible, but still plenty of (empty) husks for the grain bed. I was actually thinking of tossing it in my sifter to get some of the flour out - I'm sure that's not necessary though. To be safe however I did run it through a second time just to make sure that I got everything. Even with the hand crank, it eats a pound of grain pretty quick.

I did my second crush yesterday and I noticed the same problem that you described. It becomes very obvious at a very narrow gap that all the sudden closes when turning the roller. I sent Todd an email and he asked me to send it back since it might have been due to the cooling process or such. I wish I had your efficacy! I actually took a short video of my crushing the grain:

 

[ViperMan]

Well that's good to hear. I honestly don't feel like sending mine back - too much freakin' hassle. If it becomes a problem in the near future I'll bug him about it, but I'm actually thinking of opening up my gap a little, as I got a LOT of flour and couldn't filter it all out. I'll sacrifice a little efficiency if it means a clearer, better tasting beer.

I'll be curious to see if the replacement mill he sends you is any better/different.

 

[funnycreature]

Well that's good to hear. I honestly don't feel like sending mine back - too much freakin' hassle. If it becomes a problem in the near future I'll bug him about it, but I'm actually thinking of opening up my gap a little, as I got a LOT of flour and couldn't filter it all out. I'll sacrifice a little efficiency if it means a clearer, better tasting beer.

I'll be curious to see if the replacement mill he sends you is any better/different.

Yeah, I had too much flour too and ended up with ~1-5+ gal of cold break Some got into the fermenter but oh well.... I'll send it back since I don't get permission to brew for another 4 weeks or so anyway; that way I'm not even tempted

 

[mblanks2]

For those that have not purchased a mill yet, I just want to make you aware of the response I got back from Todd on a request for information on the B3. I visited the site and was very interested in the B3 pre-order. The home page had an ad with the unit at $129.99 with free shipping and a free aluminum scoop for the grains, amongst a few other freebies. When I tried to click on the link I got no response and proceeded to find the item through other means. The price was now at $139.00 and did not include the scoop. Not a huge deal, but enough to send a request for information to Todd to find out what was wrong with the link. I was told that it was a glitch that was related to the older B2 model and the $139.00 was accurate and it did not include a scoop. The ad clearly stated Pre-order of the B3 and had the above listed items as freebies. By the time I went back to check the web page the original ad had been pulled down. Imagine the surprise. I had actually copied the page to send him as a guide to what I was looking at. See the attached.
Anyway, the entire interaction really caused me to question the company and what would be their response if any warranty issues were to arise, so I will be looking at the barley crusher with lifetime warranty. I'm just amazed at all of this over $9.01 and an aluminum scoop.

View attachment Pre-order.pdf

 

[funnycreature]

For those that have not purchased a mill yet, I just want to make you aware of the response I got back from Todd on a request for information on the B3. I visited the site and was very interested in the B3 pre-order. The home page had an ad with the unit at $129.99 with free shipping and a free aluminum scoop for the grains, amongst a few other freebies. When I tried to click on the link I got no response and proceeded to find the item through other means. The price was now at $139.00 and did not include the scoop. Not a huge deal, but enough to send a request for information to Todd to find out what was wrong with the link. I was told that it was a glitch that was related to the older B2 model and the $139.00 was accurate and it did not include a scoop. The ad clearly stated Pre-order of the B3 and had the above listed items as freebies. By the time I went back to check the web page the original ad had been pulled down. Imagine the surprise. I had actually copied the page to send him as a guide to what I was looking at. See the attached.
Anyway, the entire interaction really caused me to question the company and what would be their response if any warranty issues were to arise, so I will be looking at the barley crusher with lifetime warranty. I'm just amazed at all of this over $9.01 and an aluminum scoop.

I think it's bad that they didn't update their website to reflect the newest promotions but I wouldn't necessarily condemn the entire company because of that. Everyone makes copy&paste mistakes... That said, have you checked how companies with Lifetime Warranties handle warranty claims? I haven't but I'm really intrigued to hear about it! When I hear "Lifetime Warranty" I usually think that they'll find a way to not honor it... I know I got very fast response every time I had to contact Todd. However, if the replacement rollers are also out of alignment then I consider returning the entire mill. Good luck finding the right mill! Let us know what you decided on

 

[mblanks2]

I think it's bad that they didn't update their website to reflect the newest promotions but I wouldn't necessarily condemn the entire company because of that. Everyone makes copy&paste mistakes... That said, have you checked how companies with Lifetime Warranties handle warranty claims? I haven't but I'm really intrigued to hear about it! When I hear "Lifetime Warranty" I usually think that they'll find a way to not honor it... I know I got very fast response every time I had to contact Todd. However, if the replacement rollers are also out of alignment then I consider returning the entire mill. Good luck finding the right mill! Let us know what you decided on

I fully understand the issue of making a mistake. I work in HVAC sales. When I have made mistakes in the past I have had to abide by what price I had given or advertised, not blame it on a "glitch". All that needed to be done was to tell me that it was a mistake, not try to provide a cover story and quickly eliminate the evidence. I don't condemn the entire company, I am just raising awareness to the way my particular issue was handled as well as the red flags that went off in my head.
As far as the "lifetime warranty" goes, I have not checked into it but will be looking into this further before I make a move. I was actually sold on the Millar Mill and was going to purchase tonight until this occurred.
I guess the point that I'm trying to make is that IF a company or individual is willing to respond to a customer issue that could be a potential sale in the way my issue was handled then it's not someone I really feel comfortable dealing with and wanted others to be aware so that intelligent decisions could be made based on the experiences of others. It's not just the sale, it's service after the sale and in this case it was the service before the sale that went sour for me.

On edit: I'm not saying 100% that I wouldn't still purchase this mill, but do have reservations about it now. Could've been a done deal if handled properly.

 

[AnOldUR]

Anyway, the entire interaction really caused me to question the company and what would be their response if any warranty issues were to arise, so I will be looking at the barley crusher with lifetime warranty.

Here is an old thread on the earlier Millar's Mill. I've been using mine for a while now and have no complaints with its function. However, I'd never do business with the company again and would discourage others. The shady, deceptive advertising really turned me off to them.

 

[funnycreature]

Here is an old thread on the earlier Millar's Mill. I've been using mine for a while now and have no complaints with its function. However, I'd never do business with the company again and would discourage others. The shady, deceptive advertising really turned me off to them.

As I stated earlier, I have to send the roller part of the mill back because it's out of alignment. If the replacement doesn't work right either I'll return the whole thing for a refund. Maybe their forte is coffee not making hardware... :rockin:

 

[one-L]

Or wood ovens or whatever else he has his hand in. Glad you guys linked to the older thread that I hadn't seen yet. Based on my and others interactions with them, and all that BS about the materials and construction that he was attempting to sell, probably going to steer clear, but funny please keep up posted on how he handles the return and what the replaced product looks like. Is it going back to him on his dime, or yours?

 

[funnycreature]

Or wood ovens or whatever else he has his hand in. Glad you guys linked to the older thread that I hadn't seen yet. Based on my and others interactions with them, and all that BS about the materials and construction that he was attempting to sell, probably going to steer clear, but funny please keep up posted on how he handles the return and what the replaced product looks like. Is it going back to him on his dime, or yours?

I'm paying but he'll send me some coffee for free with the new thing. Obviously cheaper for him but I'll take it! ALready looked at the Crankandstein as alternative :rockin:

EDIT: I don't think I'd pay for the final return though. That's should be covered by the company since they don't refund the initial shipping.

EDIT2: I sent an email to Todd asking what the policy for a complete return is... Waiting for a response; will post it here!

 

[funnycreature]

Here's Todd's reply regarding the return or the entire mill, not only the rollers:

What ever you want to do is fine. Just to let you know you are the only mill so far that has had a problem at all. So we are curious about why it has happened. It could be the bearing was not pressed strait but we are not sure until we see it. Did you mill any wet or damp grain? The reason why I ask is maybe it damaged the bearing to make it out of round if the roller got caked with wet grain wich would push the bearing out of round. This could also happen if the mill has cracked too hard of a grain such as popcorn or a foreign object going through the grain mill.
Best regards
Todd

I am no engineer by any means but should the bearings really be so sensitive that the rollers can get out of alignment but milling wet grain? Should that be an argument for returning the mill? I'd like to get other inputs please on how to interpret this email. He was very nice and quick but what he is saying worries me.
Thanks!

 

[mblanks2]

Quit frankly, after the response I got yesterday, that I haven't posted about I would be worried. If a bearing is out of round due to wetted grain, then what would dry grain do. It's harder.
You are correct in one thing for sure. His responses are quick however, not carefully thought out.

See the response to my e-mail regarding his misleading advertising.

My last e-mail:
Excuse my ignorance, but doesn't the ad clearly state: Pre-order NOW! The all new B3 Barley Mill - Shipment by May 31st, 2013 and goes on to list the price at $129.99 and lists the scoop as included.
WOW, very interesting that I check back on your site and it's now gone.
That's some quick web editing. I guess if that is the response to an interested customer over $9.01 and an aluminum scoop, I'll probably need to choose another company to deal with. I would be very concerned of any warranty issue that might arise.

His response:
Sorry about that my web designer made an update a few days ago and it must of partially loaded our old page updates for the less expensive b2 model.
Yes you are right I think another mill could be a better choice for you. I am very particular to whom I work with and prefer like minded people. We don't seem to match up as well as we should, so I would think its best we part ways rather than feel resentment from you that you paid too much or me feeling you paid too little. Believe it or not we do make these 100% here in the USA and due to that our very small profit must be made to keep our small family business sustainable so we can afford to build the best mills with love and care and make them available to people like your self. Sorry If I have offended you in any way and wish you the best beer!
Best regards
Todd Millar


This is just my experience. Please take it with a grain of salt and make your own decisions. I don't wish to influence anyone negatively, just present the facts of my experience.

 

[funnycreature]

Quit frankly, after the response I got yesterday, that I haven't posted about I would be worried. If a bearing is out of round due to wetted grain, then what would dry grain do. It's harder.
You are correct in one thing for sure. His responses are quick however, not carefully thought out.

See the response to my e-mail regarding his misleading advertising
...

This is just my experience. Please take it with a grain of salt and make your own decisions. I don't wish to influence anyone negatively, just present the facts of my experience.

I am very naive so I always think the best of people first. But if several pieces fall together it's harder to consider them coincidence. I appreciate your opinion and I was asking for others to chime in so thanks! I'll most likely return the whole thing and get a Crankandstein 3E instead. Unfortunately Todd didn't reply to the part of my email where I asked if the shipping will be covered then since it's manufacturer fault. And they usually charge a 15% restocking fee which I also expect to be waived. Updates coming soon I hope.

 

[mblanks2]

I am very naive so I always think the best of people first. But if several pieces fall together it's harder to consider them coincidence. I appreciate your opinion and I was asking for others to chime in so thanks! I'll most likely return the whole thing and get a Crankandstein 3E instead. Unfortunately Todd didn't reply to the part of my email where I asked if the shipping will be covered then since it's manufacturer fault. And they usually charge a 15% restocking fee which I also expect to be waived. Updates coming soon I hope.

Best of luck.

 

[one-L]

Wow. Yeah, if milling wet grain is going to force a metal bearing out of round, they need find another supplier. Its also a pretty big red flag when a manufacturer tells you "well YOU are the only one having a problem." So Funny, it must be your fault the mill is not right. If you paid for this with a credit card, and he wants to charge restocking and for all the shipping, I would just send it back to him and dispute it with the credit card company, tell them you got a defective product. I will say I really appreciate this thread, because I had been looking at them, but with all the bunk he's trying to sell, along with telling people some of the ridiculous things he has, I think I will pass. I can't imagine a company that wouldn't want to honor a web advertisement that was only for 10 dollars less, because you know that customer is going to go out and sing your praises for honoring the offer and you will gain way more than $10 in word of mouth. And it said $129.99 bigger than Dallas on the front page of the website. I saw the same offer. Instead, this guy tells mblanks basically "you're just not the customer we're looking for, kthanks." It may be an overall solid product, and I hope the folks that have them have years of trouble free use. Just too much BS overall from this guy for my comfort level.

 

[funnycreature]

Wow. Yeah, if milling wet grain is going to force a metal bearing out of round, they need find another supplier. Its also a pretty big red flag when a manufacturer tells you "well YOU are the only one having a problem." So Funny, it must be your fault the mill is not right. If you paid for this with a credit card, and he wants to charge restocking and for all the shipping, I would just send it back to him and dispute it with the credit card company, tell them you got a defective product. I will say I really appreciate this thread, because I had been looking at them, but with all the bunk he's trying to sell, along with telling people some of the ridiculous things he has, I think I will pass. I can't imagine a company that wouldn't want to honor a web advertisement that was only for 10 dollars less, because you know that customer is going to go out and sing your praises for honoring the offer and you will gain way more than $10 in word of mouth. And it said $129.99 bigger than Dallas on the front page of the website. I saw the same offer. Instead, this guy tells mblanks basically "you're just not the customer we're looking for, kthanks." It may be an overall solid product, and I hope the folks that have them have years of trouble free use. Just too much BS overall from this guy for my comfort level.

I purchased through amazon and already filed a defective product return claim. Since it's a third-party vendor he has to approve. In my email to Todd personally he still insisted that

Wet grain will stick and cake up the roller making the rollers much bigger then press the bearings outward. Did you mill wet or damp grain?

I didn't see anything stick to the rollers but the usual flour.
And of course still no word if he will refund everything or what. Yeah, I think he just lost his mask...

I'm now seriously looking at the Crankandstein options...

 

[one-L]

Wish you the best of luck in getting it resolved. Keep us posted, and if you wind up going with something else let us know what you get and what you think. I wouldn't tell him how full of you know what he is until this all gets resolved, but boy I sure would after that.

 

[Accidic]

It looks interesting for the price (which is admittedly intriguing even at the current $140) and it does look like it's improved but my concern was the 400 series stainless. The 400 series stainless I use for some other stuff around the house is rather flexible and not nearly as strong as 303/304. It's even significantly weaker than the 316 I use when I'm out of the other two.

In any event, I was tasked with picking up one for my Uncle but I think I'm going to suggest they put the extra cash in and go the Monster (I hate that the Rebel mill skyrocketed in price and of course then there are the availability issues while they look for a new manufacturer) route for now. The Millar is certainly a better priced option but the durability seems to be a real concern in this thread and with my experience with the 400 series Stainless it makes me even more nervous. I do hope they're able to work the kinks out though. Other than the few little quirks it does seem quite promising.

 

[funnycreature]

It looks interesting for the price (which is admittedly intriguing even at the current $140) and it does look like it's improved but my concern was the 400 series stainless. The 400 series stainless I use for some other stuff around the house is rather flexible and not nearly as strong as 303/304. It's even significantly weaker than the 316 I use when I'm out of the other two.

In any event, I was tasked with picking up one for my Uncle but I think I'm going to suggest they put the extra cash in and go the Monster (I hate that the Rebel mill skyrocketed in price and of course then there are the availability issues while they look for a new manufacturer) route for now. The Millar is certainly a better priced option but the durability seems to be a real concern in this thread and with my experience with the 400 series Stainless it makes me even more nervous. I do hope they're able to work the kinks out though. Other than the few little quirks it does seem quite promising.

Do you have any comment about the Crankandstein 3E? The Millar's is back on its way home. It did look very promising but if it can't handle simple grains then it's useless. Let's see how the return will be handled....

Wish you the best of luck in getting it resolved. Keep us posted, and if you wind up going with something else let us know what you get and what you think. I wouldn't tell him how full of you know what he is until this all gets resolved, but boy I sure would after that.

I usually don't do that. If he handles the return professionally then I don't have any reason to call him anything

 

[Kuhndog]

It looks interesting for the price (which is admittedly intriguing even at the current $140) and it does look like it's improved but my concern was the 400 series stainless. The 400 series stainless I use for some other stuff around the house is rather flexible and not nearly as strong as 303/304. It's even significantly weaker than the 316 I use when I'm out of the other two.

In any event, I was tasked with picking up one for my Uncle but I think I'm going to suggest they put the extra cash in and go the Monster (I hate that the Rebel mill skyrocketed in price and of course then there are the availability issues while they look for a new manufacturer) route for now. The Millar is certainly a better priced option but the durability seems to be a real concern in this thread and with my experience with the 400 series Stainless it makes me even more nervous. I do hope they're able to work the kinks out though. Other than the few little quirks it does seem quite promising.

Why are people so naive when it comes to spending money...thinking that a $130/140 mill which is virtually untested and very few reviews out there and 1/2 of what is out there is not good...is worth the money?

Compare a Barley Crusher to the Millar B3 - on the surface the Millar "should" be better right? SS stuff...better bearings...etc...yet it's the same price as the BC....BUT whose warranty is better? With the exception to a KIA, warranties are usually an indication of the manufacturer standing behind their product. It's hard to make an unlimited lifetime warranty for anything...but if the Millar mill is so superior as he makes it out to be in his video - then why not back up the words with a better warranty...longer than 1 yr??

His response to me in questioning these things were "we believe you'll make the right choice in choosing a well-made mill". What was that supposed to mean? If the mills are this cheap now and they are barely making a profit....then how is he going to be able to raise the prices - if there are issues with the product and a lousy warranty. Something has to give. For me, I'm going to bite the bullet and get a Monster Mill. I thought about the Millar Mill...the BC and even the old hand crank Victoria - which I can get under $40 new....but I would rather spend $180 and never have to worry about constantly feeding that 1 lb hopper and the fact that I can use a drill. Any good, well made mill will pay for itself. And any of the BC, Rebel, Crankenstein, Monster, and the Cereal Killer are made well enough to last many years....can't say that about this Millar mill. People with excuses regarding their products....can't be trusted.

 

[one-L]

People with excuses regarding their products....can't be trusted.

This. And I agree with you funny, in that so long as he handles the return professionally and its not a huge hassle, that should be the end of it. Case closed. If, however, this is not the case, AND with all the bumf he has said to several folks, hoo boy. In your case I hope its a non-issue.

 

[AnOldUR]

my concern was the 400 series stainless . . . Other than the few little quirks it does seem quite promising.

Actually 400 series stainless are better suited to rollers than 300 series. It's harder and can be heat treated. What you're missing is that the biggest "little quirk" is the company's smoke and mirror advertising.

The B2 model claimed, "Construction Aircraft Anodized Aluminum & knurled Hardened Steel Dual Roller Mill." The aluminum parts were not anodized after machining and the rollers were no harder than mill stock. When I questioned them they said that they never claimed HOW hard the rollers were.

The B3 model comes along with, "On our new Millar’s B3 model, we now feature something we developed called Pro-Last rollers. What makes this different is we used a unique heating-treatment system applied to 400 series stainless steel." Ambiguous language with no specifics to back up the claims or be held accountable for later. I'd love to see someone do a hardness test on these the way I tested the B2 rollers.

They advertise that the rollers won't rust, but tell funnycreature he f'ed up his mill by grinding wet. WTF! Isn't that one of the biggest reasons to buy a mill with stainless rollers?

 

[funnycreature]

They advertise that the rollers won't rust, but tell funnycreature he f'ed up his mill by grinding wet. WTF! Isn't that one of the biggest reasons to buy a mill with stainless rollers?

Damn straight! May I ask what, if any, mill you have?

 

[AnOldUR]

May I ask what, if any, mill you have?

I have the Millar's B2. I'm a machinist and wanted to build my own motorized mill someday, but never could find the time. When I saw the features on the Millar's I figured, why bother? It had everything I would do and with an Amazon coupon it only cost me 30 bucks.

I built a nice stand for it, but along the way got real discouraged finding I didn't get what I wanted. At this point I'm not going to do the, "cut off your nose to spite your face", thing. It gives me a decent crush, so I'll use it until it fails and then do what I should have done in the first place.

Just here to try to keep others from making my mistake.

 

[Accidic]

Do you have any comment about the Crankandstein 3E?

I've only had a 2 roller crank and it was a fine piece of hardware. My second (the first didn't fail, was a casualty of moving) I went with the MM only because I preferred his responses. I wanted to go 3 roller so bad I could taste it but responses here at HBT steered me away from it as, while workable, would frustrate me greatly. Ultimately I got a 2" 2 roller and may pick up a second in the future and mount them over/under with the drives linked with the same purpose as the 3 roller. I'm still not convinced it's enough gain to justify it though.

Why are people so naive when it comes to spending money...thinking that a $130/140 mill which is virtually untested and very few reviews out there and 1/2 of what is out there is not good...is worth the money?

At 40% less price, and I've seen more decent reviews of the B2s with only a few quirks I'd want to avoid, it makes you a little more lenient at dealing with small stuff. The bearing issues being the bigger issue that I've seen and the responses from the Manu iffy for my tastes. Historically I've used a Crankenstein 2 roller and a MM2 with complete satisfaction. They cost a bit more and for myself I'd just wait and go that route. As it was a request from a cousin to buy for her husband I was limited to a more restrictive budget.

Actually 400 series stainless are better suited to rollers than 300 series. It's harder and can be heat treated. What you're missing is that the biggest "little quirk" is the company's smoke and mirror advertising.

Must just be the shear strength is less because it's incredibly to snap any of the 3 that I've used compared to the 300 series. It's so much cheaper though and I tend to use a bunch.

 

[funnycreature]

Already have the MM3 with 1/2" shaft and hopper+base sitting in the shopping cart. I'm torn between pulling the trigger now or waiting until I have received the refund on the Millar's Mill...

 

[Accidic]

Personally I'm extremely happy with my MM2 with the hopper addition so it's hard for me to imagine you'd be unhappy with it but if you're overly dependent on the cash from this one to make ends meet I'd wait.

@AnOldUR, That's why I got the stainless. It's done such a great job and I get so much "requested" help that I'm still toying with picking up Hardened though. Did well over 1000lbs of grinding last year. I was kind of stunned when I read the concern over wet milling to be honest.

 

[funnycreature]

Personally I'm extremely happy with my MM2 with the hopper addition so it's hard for me to imagine you'd be unhappy with it but if you're overly dependent on the cash from this one to make ends meet I'd wait.

@AnOldUR, That's why I got the stainless. It's done such a great job and I get so much "requested" help that I'm still toying with picking up Hardened though. Did well over 1000lbs of grinding last year. I was kind of stunned when I read the concern over wet milling to be honest.

I don't need the cash that badly but it's always good to know how much something really costs in the end. I guess I'll just order and be done with it. I was brave enough to test the Millar's mill so why not get something proven? I will stick with the standard option and not go SS but I'll treat myself to the 1/2" shaft

 

[Accidic]

Isn't the MM3 (or is that the 2.0 portion) the 2" model anyway? Those came standard with 1/2" shafts when I got mine. I have the stainless model but it's probably overkill. I am still seriously considering going back and getting the hardened roller model as they'll last virtually forever. I think that particular upgrade option was pretty cheap at the time ($30 maybe?). But again, I got the 2 roller model, not the 3.