Rebuilding - Again...

[MX1]

Yes, so the 1 PID system is how I am going to go. With a $300 prebuild control for the Boil Kettle, I cant justify the extra $$ on the 2 PID Control.

So, the plan is -
1 PID/RTD monitering the mash temp at the exit of the HEX, controlling the element in the HLT.
2 pumps; 1 recirq the HLT water 1 Recirq the Mash.
2 110v outlets for the pumps
1 220 outlet for the element.

Will order the DIY Kit from eBrewSupply, and have him upgrade it to all push-button lighted switches. And will figure out how to wire it so the element can not be turned on with out the HLT Recirq pump running.

Tim

 

[MX1]

New pics of HLT, about to ship.

 

[theknub]

looking good there

 

[MX1]

looking good there

This pot has taken way longer tha nit shold have, but I am not in the States righ tnow so it is really not to big of a deal. The next 2 pots should not take near as long, or cost near as much. end of the day, this on will run me about $430 including the HEX and all the fittings to make it work. Not complaing, cnat wait to fire her up.

Sad part is there will be serious lag between getting all my toys and getting to brew, honestly, if I can brew before 2014 I will be surprised!

Tim

 

[DSorenson]

Is that a boil kettle with weldless fittings and a 50ft stainless wort chiller built in?!? Is that an electric heating element in there too?!?

 

[GrantH]

Thanks, I was more curious than anything. We sell a controller and I always check-out what else is selling. I already know about the REX-c100 - it measures in C (Celsius) only.

Who/What/Where in Huntsville?

 

[MX1]

Is that a boil kettle with weldless fittings and a 50ft stainless wort chiller built in?!? Is that an electric heating element in there too?!?

not a Boil but a HLT

15 gallon SS Kettle
50ft 1/2 HERMS Coil
240/5500 Heating Element
SS 3 piece valves
Water return for recirq


Tim

 

[theknub]

This pot has taken way longer tha nit shold have, but I am not in the States righ tnow so it is really not to big of a deal. The next 2 pots should not take near as long, or cost near as much. end of the day, this on will run me about $430 including the HEX and all the fittings to make it work. Not complaing, cnat wait to fire her up.

Sad part is there will be serious lag between getting all my toys and getting to brew, honestly, if I can brew before 2014 I will be surprised!

Tim

unfortunately.

but could biab it till you have everything...

 

[MX1]

Deployed until Nov, then have to build the HERMS controller...that is why it will be first of the year

 

[beergutbrew]

Who/What/Where in Huntsville?

www.kegkits.com Huntsville, AL

 

[MX1]

Ok, update from the desert...

I now have the HLT with HEX installed and the the BK with a sight glass installed.
The guys building my pots are on vacation for the next few weeks, so I will order some of the electronincs I need.

I already own a stand alone BK controller, so I will be basing the HLT/HEX controller based on the eBrew BiaB Kit

I am pretty sure that I can use This PID instead of the standard PID.

I say this becasue from what I remember the 1st one does not have a manual mode to control the boil.

Anyone see any issues with this idea?

Tim

 

[MX1]

New stuff about to be ordered, new stuff on order, and new stuff made it to the house.

Payday will see me order the last of the 3 kettels, the Mash Tun, should be at the house before Sept.

Just ordered the PID and Liquid tight RTD sensor, 2 in, 1/4 NPT Thread with delux cable from Auber, shold be at the house late this week or early next.

And the BK was delieverd first week of July.

It is a slow roll, but I am slowly getting there, good thing is I still have 90 days before I am in the states, so ther is no super hurry.
Will order some keg stuff next, thinking I want to wait to get the internal electronics for the control box until i get back home, that way I can inspect it when it arrives.

Tim

 

[MX1]

So, I now have all the pots at the house. 60 days or so until I can unpack them and see what is going on and what little parts I need to get it going.

Still need to finish ordering the Control Box stuff, but that will wait until I get home, as well as the kegging stuff.

I have one of those crap PID of ebay at the house, thinking I hight just install it and use it as a thermometer, so I can track the HLT temp.

Tim

 

[kal]

Old thread and your project's likely done but I thought I'd post anyway:

I have shifted to thoughts of the HERMS control box. Mainly how many PIDs I will neeed. I would like to keep temps on all 3 of the vessels, but of course only 2 will need any sort of control.

Not usre how many PIDs I will need....

That depends on the brewing process you want to use. There are many ways to do this. You can use 1 PID if you want to do BIAB, 2 PIDs if you want to control 2 kettles, or 3 PIDs if you want to control/view the temp in 3 kettles. It really depends.

Design your brewing process from start to end first, even before you start to look at or even think about equipment. Think about how you want it all to work. The list equipment you need will then (more or less) automatically fall out.

As far as how many PIDs you will need? Some on this site will argue otherwise but I believe a PID to control your boil pot is a mis-application of technology. With boil you are controlling rate of boil, not temperature. I believe something like PWM or a high powered light dimmer is a smarter solution for a boil pot.

The one issue with using PWM is that you cannot do long temperature specific hop stands in your boil.

I did one recently (complete detail & pictures in this thread) and could not have brewed this beer if I did not use a PID to control my boil kettle. As after the boil I switched from duty cycle to temperature control to hold the wort at specific temperatures for long durations as hops were added.

So it really depends on your needs.

Kal

 

[MX1]

Old thread and your project's likely done but I thought I'd post anyway:



That depends on the brewing process you want to use. There are many ways to do this. You can use 1 PID if you want to do BIAB, 2 PIDs if you want to control 2 kettles, or 3 PIDs if you want to control/view the temp in 3 kettles. It really depends.

Design your brewing process from start to end first, even before you start to look at or even think about equipment. Think about how you want it all to work. The list equipment you need will then (more or less) automatically fall out.


The one issue with using PWM is that you cannot do long temperature specific hop stands in your boil.

I did one recently (complete detail & pictures in this thread) and could not have brewed this beer if I did not use a PID to control my boil kettle. As after the boil I switched from duty cycle to temperature control to hold the wort at specific temperatures for long durations as hops were added.

So it really depends on your needs.

Kal

Kal,

This actually right on time, I have held off ordering any of the parts left for the Control Box, until I redeploy, mainly the inner workings, and enclosure.

My system is a 3 vessle eHERMS, I have 1 PID from Auber, and 1 PID from China that I am going to use a temp sensor I guess.

The plan is to have the workhourse PID control the HLT element (5500w/240v) based on the wort temp as it enters the mash tun to start the recirq. My thinking is that that will cover some of the heat lose as it moves through the tubing, and that the mash should reach a uniform temp pretty quickly.

the temp only PID will just be a pretty display for the mash temp as it exits the mash tun en-rout to the HEX in the HLT.

I have a stand alone boil controller I bought from High Gravity a few years ago, and it works, so I will keep using it.

As you are one of the Masters of eBrewing, I would value any input you have to offer.

Tim

 

[kal]

Hi Tim,

Your process sounds like it'll be somewhat similar to mine though I heat the HLT using a temp probe on the HLT output.

How do you plan on initially heating the HLT water if the HLT element is controlled by a temp probe in the MLT input? That's the only thing so far that doesn't sound right.

Kal

 

[MX1]

Hi Tim,

Your process sounds like it'll be somewhat similar to mine though I heat the HLT using a temp probe on the HLT output.

How do you plan on initially heating the HLT water if the HLT element is controlled by a temp probe in the MLT input? That's the only thing so far that doesn't sound right.

Kal

Re you trying to baffle me with your science???

Good question, let me think on that...i guess it never crossed my mind, i was always worried about maintaining the mash, never thought about the strike/sparge....might have to add a second PID, but can 1 element be controlled by 2 different PID's.

 

[kal]

Re you trying to baffle me with your science???

Good question, let me think on that...i guess it never crossed my mind, i was always worried about maintaining the mash, never thought about the strike/sparge....might have to add a second PID, but can 1 element be controlled by 2 different PID's.

Not really, or not in a manner that will work logically.

Why not just do what I do in my process? It works well for me.

Kal

 

[passedpawn]

Re you trying to baffle me with your science???

Good question, let me think on that...i guess it never crossed my mind, i was always worried about maintaining the mash, never thought about the strike/sparge....might have to add a second PID, but can 1 element be controlled by 2 different PID's.

2 diodes would do the trick. Just run the control signal from each PID through a diode. Connect the cathode of both diodes together, then to the SSR control input. You should be able to pick up a 1N4001 or similar at Radio Shack for 50 cents.

 

[kal]

Diode or switch could work.

I got it backwards before: This can work since you're using two different PIDs to control the two different systems (the PID/SSR/temperature probe/element is a 'system'). It's the other way around that couldn't work (using a single PID to control two different systems as the I/P/D values in the PID would have to be different for each system).

I would first just try using a single PID to control HLT temp. That's what most do.

Kal

 

[kal]

Yup - manual mode (as used in a boil kettle) doesn't get in the way as it's all about the duty cycle and that's it.

Kal

 

[MX1]

Ok, so..it has been along long week here in the "sandbox"....

Kal, and others....

So I have 1 element that needs to be controlled, in the HLT, but it is needed for 2 different operations.
1. Heat strike water to initail temp
2. control HLT to maintain mash temp.

1. Could be taken care of with the PID in Manual mode, then switched to PID mode
2. to control the mash

this is correct right?

I also have one oc those cheep REX-100 PID that would need to be modifies to drive an ssr, or I could use it as a pretty thermometer, and I dial therms on each of the kettels as well.

I am glad that I ahve waited to build the brains until I redeploy.....

Tim

 

[kal]

You don't need to use manual mode at all.

Here's how I do it:

Use a temp probe at the output of the HLT.
Set your HLT temp using the PID in auto mode.
Mash in and maintain the same temp.

No switching need. No special dual modes. Simple.

Kal

 

[MX1]

You don't need to use manual mode at all.

Here's how I do it:

Use a temp probe at the output of the HLT.
Set your HLT temp using the PID in auto mode.
Mash in and maintain the same temp.

No switching need. No special dual modes. Simple.

Kal

You Make it sound so simple....lol...thx

Tim

 

[MX1]

So to address the issue above.

I think I will just set my Set point at the temp I want to mash at and leave the probe at the INPUT to the Mash Tun from the HEX. My thinking , as stated before, is that that will cover some of the heat lose as it moves through the tubing, and that the mash should reach a uniform temp pretty quickly.

I have a dial thermo built into the HLT, so I will just use that to watch the strike temp. With the probe in the located at the INPUT to the MLT, and no water running to it, it should never reach the set point temp. When the strike water hits the strike temp on the dial thermo, i will start the pump and recirq.

Please let me know if there is a flaw in that plan.

As for my Control box, I have decided to use the Auber PID as the work horse for the system, and the cheap REX as just a temp readout at the OUTPUT of the MLT jsut to make sure that temps from top to bottom of the mash are not out of line.

Along with the single element it needs to run, it will drive two 110 outlets for pumps, and one 220 outlet to plug my boil kettle controller into. I want to build in a safty so that I can not have the element and the 220 outlet hot at the same time.

I have a few weeks left her ein Afghanistan, then I can start ordering the next round of parts.

Tim.

 

[MX1]

Just ordered the 30a 2 PID DIY kit from Ryan at Ebrew.

Had all the 2 way switches replaced with push buttons….

Slow, but still moving forward

Tim

 

[MX1]

Panel kit should be here today….

 

[MX1]

The Brewstand has been built. Compact 2 tier.

Now have to figure out the process flow with one pump. Right now as I look at it, the HLT and Mash Tun are on the upper tier with the boil kettle on the lower.
I only have one pump and need to work out how I am going to sparge.

Still need a few more bits and bobs, a few Tee's, some female cam locks, oh and the elements....lol

Will post up some pics tomorrow.

Tim

 

[MX1]

Brewstand about 80% done.

Control panal mock up.

Tim

 

[MX1]

Picked up some solder, 5 ft of 10awg wire in red, white, green, and black, 10 ft 10/3 cable and 25ft of 10/4 cable.
also, there was a sale on 60 pound Vittles Vaults, $28 a piece, got 3 to use a fermentors.

Wiring starts soon....

Tim