Problems with cooling wort

[jalc6927]

Living in Texas where ground water temp is quite high right now, having problems cooling my hot wort when I AG brew.

With partial I add 10lb bag of ice, pour hot wort then top off with cold water to get pitch temp below 70.

Is there way to do this when using AG method?

I'm sure this question has been posted before so if someone can guide me there or share some advice that would be great

 

[jack13]

Living in Texas where ground water temp is quite high right now, having problems cooling my hot wort when I AG brew.

With partial I add 10lb bag of ice, pour hot wort then top off with cold water to get pitch temp below 70.

Is there way to do this when using AG method?

I'm sure this question has been posted before so if someone can guide me there or share some advice that would be great

There are many options to cool wort, and I'm not sure how big your batch is or what equipment you've got, but just somethign to think about: You don't need to pitch your yeast right away.

To chill wort in the summer I get it to about 90-100 with an immersion chiller, bring it inside, drain to the fermenter, then simply pitch the yeast the following day.

Pitching the next day may not be ideal, but it eliminates the tedium of trying to get the wort down to 70 with 65 degree water.

 

[mizer67]

I live in FL, so using ground water most of the year isn't an option.

I use 30 lbs of ice in a large cooler, mixed with water. I pump this through an immersion chiller with a $50 pump and recirculate the water after I let the initial amount that's extremely hot run out.

 

[jalc6927]

Thank you I'll give them both a try

Enjoy your weekend

 

[andrewbrews]

Ground water has been a little hot lately, and I still get weary of letting it ride over night even if my sanitation is good. I recently upgraded to a stainless immersion chiller and I plan to take my old copper one and hook up a connection on the outlet. I'll then attach the stainless to the copper in series. The copper will rest in a cooler full of ice water. Essentially I'll be taking ~75-80 degree ground water, cooling it down (maybe as low as 40-50) and then using that to chill the batch. Not ideal to have two chillers, but I wanted to upgrade from my copper anyway.

 

[Shwagger]

I live in FL, so using ground water most of the year isn't an option.

I use 30 lbs of ice in a large cooler, mixed with water. I pump this through an immersion chiller with a $50 pump and recirculate the water after I let the initial amount that's extremely hot run out.

I do similar with a plate chiller and cheap fountain pump. I fill my hlt with water and all the ice from my ice maker. It will cool wort to almost pitching temp in one pass. I don't pitch until the next day after I let the tub settle out into the collection ball of my fastferment and then dump it. Helps with clear beer too. By the time I pitch its at whatever temp I need it to be at. I also use some of the wort for a starter

Harbor freight sells cheap pumps

 

[secondbase]

Ground water is very warm here in the summer. I typically use ground water for about 10 minutes, then switch to pumping ice water using a cheapo aquarium pump I got on Amazon. The pump could really use an upgrade, but it does work to get down to pitching temps when the ground water is 75º.

 

[Blackdirt_cowboy]

I'm in Texas also. My ground water is 80 degrees right now. I use it to bring the wort down to about 90 degrees. Then I use a sumbmersible pump in a bucket of ice water to finish cooling the wort to pitching temps. I did a lager a few weeks ago using this method and brought the wort down to 48 degrees in 20 minutes.

 

[BrunDog]

Ditto on southern living...

If you are using an IC, don't pre-chill - you are just effectively cooling warm groundwater, wasting heat capacity. Cool with groundwater first, then switch the IC to be fed (by a small pump) as the posters above me noted.

That said, pre-chilling is never efficient, even if you use a CFC or a PC. Always recirc back into the kettle with groundwater, then switch to ice water.

If one pass into the fermenter is your goal, use two chillers (obviously this option is only for CFC or PC's). One to cool to just above groundwater temp then the other to chill further with ice water. The second could be an old IC in a bucket of ice (wort flows through inside) but you will need to move it every few seconds to keep it cold.

I use two inline hybrid type CFC's for one pass and I can get to lager pitching temps in one pass. It's slow, don't get me wrong, but it works well (probably ~15 minutes to fill a fermenter with 5.5 gallons.)

 

[jalc6927]

Great ideas, I appreciate all the advice

 

[soccerdad]

+1 on the idea of a submersible pump ( like a fountain pump at lowes) in a 5 gallon bucket of ice water feeding your immersion chiller. Start it with no ice and get it down to 100 or so, then load it with ice or ice blocks to get it below 60

 

[dchmela]

+1 on the idea of a submersible pump ( like a fountain pump at lowes) in a 5 gallon bucket of ice water feeding your immersion chiller. Start it with no ice and get it down to 100 or so, then load it with ice or ice blocks to get it below 60

I use a very similar method. I put the kettle in a cooler with ice water and pump tap water to my chiller until it gets to about 100, then I switch to a pond pump pulling ice water from another cooler. Got it down to pitching temp yesterday in about 20 minutes.

 

[GrogNerd]

Living in Texas where ground water temp is quite high right now, having problems cooling my hot wort when I AG brew.

With partial I add 10lb bag of ice, pour hot wort then top off with cold water to get pitch temp below 70.

Is there way to do this when using AG method?

I'm sure this question has been posted before so if someone can guide me there or share some advice that would be great

I've nothing more to add, except curious why you asked about All Grain?

once your wort hits the boil kettle, whether AG or extract, from then on the process is exactly the same. boiling, hop additions, whirlpool, cooling, pitching, etc... all the same

 

[SlitheryDee]

I've got a similar problem and I've been working through different ways to solve it. I have an immersion chiller, but with 80+ degree ground water I could never get worts to pitching temp, and when the temperature delta between the wort and the water gets small enough cooling performance slows to a crawl. What I've been doing is combining the immersion chiller with an ice bath using tons of water bottles that I freeze in my brew house freezer. It gets the job done eventually, but I'm thinking I can improve on that a great deal.

My current thought is to buy a better immersion chiller (maybe a JaDed hydra or similar quality) and use my current chiller as an intermediary step between my water supply and the new chiller. I'd just put the first chiller in an ice bath and run my water through it to precool it before it gets to the better chiller that will be in the wort.

Another thought would be to continue using my current chiller, but take the water from a precooled supply using a water pump and output back into the basin to be cooled again. I feel like I'd be running into the same problem once all the basin water gets warmed though. That might be a good way to conserve water, but performance wise I think option one is better.

 

[Blackdirt_cowboy]

I've got a similar problem and I've been working through different ways to solve it. I have an immersion chiller, but with 80+ degree ground water I could never get worts to pitching temp, and when the temperature delta between the wort and the water gets small enough cooling performance slows to a crawl. What I've been doing is combining the immersion chiller with an ice bath using tons of water bottles that I freeze in my brew house freezer. It gets the job done eventually, but I'm thinking I can improve on that a great deal.

My current thought is to buy a better immersion chiller (maybe a JaDed hydra or similar quality) and use my current chiller as an intermediary step between my water supply and the new chiller. I'd just put the first chiller in an ice bath and run my water through it to precool it before it gets to the better chiller that will be in the wort.

Another thought would be to continue using my current chiller, but take the water from a precooled supply using a water pump and output back into the basin to be cooled again. I feel like I'd be running into the same problem once all the basin water gets warmed though. That might be a good way to conserve water, but performance wise I think option one is better.

I like your first idea better and believe it would work well. I use the submersible pump as I already had one on hand that I use to flush my tankless water heaters annually. I also think it may be the cheaper way to go compared to a second chiller. I home made my chiller with a 50 foot coil of 3/8" copper tubing and put garden hose fittings in each end. I'm about $80 or $90 into that one. A decent pump can be bought for less money than that and will be equally as effective. When the temp delta gets small enough that your groundwater no longer cools effectively, just switch over to a bucket of ice water. I routinely reach lager pitching temps in 20 minutes. Ales are much quicker.

 

[jalc6927]

To grog nerd

Because with partial I add 10lb bag of ice and cold water to lower temp since I only boil 2-3 gallons

With all grain I brew the whole 5 gallons so I can't add ice or extra water to lower temp

 

[GrogNerd]

ah... , I thought you were saying partial mash, when you meant partial boil

grog grok now

 

[BrunDog]

I've got a similar problem and I've been working through different ways to solve it. I have an immersion chiller, but with 80+ degree ground water I could never get worts to pitching temp, and when the temperature delta between the wort and the water gets small enough cooling performance slows to a crawl. What I've been doing is combining the immersion chiller with an ice bath using tons of water bottles that I freeze in my brew house freezer. It gets the job done eventually, but I'm thinking I can improve on that a great deal.

My current thought is to buy a better immersion chiller (maybe a JaDed hydra or similar quality) and use my current chiller as an intermediary step between my water supply and the new chiller. I'd just put the first chiller in an ice bath and run my water through it to precool it before it gets to the better chiller that will be in the wort.

Another thought would be to continue using my current chiller, but take the water from a precooled supply using a water pump and output back into the basin to be cooled again. I feel like I'd be running into the same problem once all the basin water gets warmed though. That might be a good way to conserve water, but performance wise I think option one is better.

Read above... do not precool water - it is not efficient and actually makes little sense to cool down tap water to heat it again. You'll only cool it a couple of degrees, plus that water gets dumped - so there goes your efficiency. Cool with tap water as normal, then switch to the ice bath. You do not need a second chiller - just use a small pump. Then all of your ice water absorbs actual heat from your wort.

 

[soccerdad]

I got a great south Asian guy at the corner BP 5 minutes away. $1.29 for 8 pounds of ice. He bags it himself in the back .. uses filtered water. After cooling with tapwater to 100 or so, a bag and a half of that ice will get me below 70 using the pond pump in a bucket method. Well worth the buck and three quarters .. in my oh so humble opinion.

 

[balrog]

Ditto on southern living...

Cool with groundwater first, then switch the IC to be fed (by a small pump) as the posters above me noted.

... you will need to move it every few seconds...

+1. These. Run groundwater (DeltaQ heat/DeltaT time is max with max temp diff) first, into bucket to wash with, maybe two, should be down to 100-110, then switch to recirc pond pump in cooler of ice. BIG PLUS ONE ON MOVE IT. If you stand there and swish your IC you will be amazed how quickly it works.

 

[jalc6927]

The ice bath for the water worked wonderfully

Thank you

 

[user 125772]

My water this time of year is 76...the other day I used my copper CFC with the tap water to recirc and chill the BK to 95. At that point, the CFC output thermometer said 80 ...so I pumped it in the fermenter.

So question for yall, (in the summer) Do you really think it's critical the get your wort to 68 or 70 considering your starter may be 76 ? I've read that a little higher that ideal temp is good for yeast growth/multiplication, Thoughts?

 

[BrunDog]

Higher temp is great for yeast growth and multiplication. It's also great for ester production, which may or may not be what you want.

 

[jalc6927]

4 bags of ice did the trick

 

[user 125772]

Higher temp is great for yeast growth and multiplication. It's also great for ester production, which may or may not be what you want.

Agreed, and I generally don't want easter production for most of my beers, but I have a hard time imagining the 2-3 hours of elevated temp at the beginning of primary would produce something the yeast couldn't clean up in the 2 weeks following .

 

[BrunDog]

You are probably right that a few hours elevated won't do much... but they also don't clean up esters.

I do think it is important not to temperature shock yeast. When you pitch, at whatever temp that is, your starter should be at a similar temp.