Please critique my Fair Crack recipe

[seatazzz]

The husband is at it again. Saw a beer that he thinks I should brew. It's not even out yet (Puyallup River is debuting it at the Fair September 1st). I call it Fair Crack because it's supposed to taste like a raspberry scone...man I hope this works. Let me know what y'all think.


For a 5.5 gallon batch
10lbs Maris Otter
2lbs Vienna
1lb Biscuit
Single infusion mash at 150-152, sparge as usual.

1oz Goldings at 60 minutes
2lbs thawed frozen raspberries (mushed up a bit) at 15 minutes to end of boil along with 1oz orange peel

Ferment with something clean like Safale-05 or Notty

Planning on testing at day 7 to see what kind of fruit flavor it has...may add more raspberries at that point. In the picture he found it's a brilliant red color. I'm thinking the "scone" flavor comes from the MO & the biscuit.

 

[rhys333]

The grain bill looks good, and I'm guessing you're wanting pronounced biscuit/toasted notes with the pound of biscuit. I prefer adding raspberries post-primary to get the brightest flavors.

 

[TechyDork]

I second adding the raspberries after fermentation is complete, or close to the end to get more flavor from them.

have you thought of using an english strain for the yeast? Maybe to add to the biscuit/toasted flavor? just a thought, 05 or Notty are solid and should also work very well.

 

[seatazzz]

Thanks guys. This one is still in the early planning stages (can't brew for another week or so due to out of town next weekend). I was also thinking of the later fruit addition. Whaddya think if I did both? In the boil and after primary? Or is that overkill?

 

[rhys333]

Raspberries are pretty potent, and just the fermentor addition will add a ton of flavor. Adding to the boil may result in undesirable cooked fruit flavors.

 

[Roland_deschain]

Following

 

[JimRausch]

I add 2 lb of frozen/thawed raspberries to 2-2.5 G of my American wheat style as a secondary addition. Results in a beautiful color and plenty of raspberry flavor. I would be a little worried that a kettle addition might give you a cooked flavor as well as causing a problem with pectin haze.

 

[Gravity]

Thanks guys. This one is still in the early planning stages (can't brew for another week or so due to out of town next weekend). I was also thinking of the later fruit addition. Whaddya think if I did both? In the boil and after primary? Or is that overkill?

If depends on what you're going for in profile of the beer.

Generally you want to make fruit additions during secondary. Raspberries is a fruit you don't want to much of, so I would skip the boil additions as you may get flavors that are further away from what you originally wanted.

The recommendations given are spot on, do it during fermentation for best results

 

[seatazzz]

And thanks again...gotta love everyone on HBT for keeping me from making what may be a fatal mistake! Secondary it is...although I've never used one, I really want this beer to be good so will take all precautions (also have 2 empty fermenters begging to be used). And since I am horrible at remembering anything, my wonderful husband reminded me that we are coming home from our weekend trip (off to Oregon Brewfest on Friday to celebrate my 50th year on the planet) on Saturday, this will be brewed this Sunday the 30th. Will update everyone with progress. Thank you!!

 

[rhys333]

If you're saving that yeast, then do a secondary for sure. If not, you can just add your raspberries directly to primary after fermentation is complete.

 

[Gravity]

And thanks again...gotta love everyone on HBT for keeping me from making what may be a fatal mistake! Secondary it is...although I've never used one, I really want this beer to be good so will take all precautions (also have 2 empty fermenters begging to be used). And since I am horrible at remembering anything, my wonderful husband reminded me that we are coming home from our weekend trip (off to Oregon Brewfest on Friday to celebrate my 50th year on the planet) on Saturday, this will be brewed this Sunday the 30th. Will update everyone with progress. Thank you!!

I wouldn't sweat not having a secondary, you can keep it as single stage fermentation and still make your additions as planned without racking to secondary. Matter of fact I think secondary has become debunked for the most part and not as common as it once was.

You'll still make great beer

You should think of a clever name to mark the occasion.

Brew on and Happy Birthday!

 

[seatazzz]

I wouldn't sweat not having a secondary, you can keep it as single stage fermentation and still make your additions as planned without racking to secondary. Matter of fact I think secondary has become debunked for the most part and not as common as it once was.

You'll still make great beer

You should think of a clever name to mark the occasion.

Brew on and Happy Birthday!

I did consider just adding the fruit to primary, but I want this to drop clear. I don't really need to save the yeast (still have plenty). May just reorganize the kegerator again and crash it. And I do have a clever name for it...anyone who's been to the Washington State Fair (Do the Puyallup!) knows how good the scones are. Therefore the name Fair Crack. I tried to think of something else but that's what I've got.

 

[Gravity]

I did consider just adding the fruit to primary, but I want this to drop clear. I don't really need to save the yeast (still have plenty). May just reorganize the kegerator again and crash it. And I do have a clever name for it...anyone who's been to the Washington State Fair (Do the Puyallup!) knows how good the scones are. Therefore the name Fair Crack. I tried to think of something else but that's what I've got.

Sounds like a plan
Fair crack works

 

[IslandLizard]

I agree with the others, never boil fruit, and instead, add it to the primary. Only use a secondary IF you know how to transfer properly without risk oxidizing the batch. You could use a keg as a secondary, it's easy to purge the headspace with CO2.

2 pounds of fruit is not a real lot in a 5 gallon batch. Most of it is water, while the majority, if not all the sugars, which are responsible for flavor perception, will ferment out. This will leave just color and a mere hint of the fruit's flavor behind.

If you want to prevent the fruit from fermenting out, you could add the strained pulp to a serving keg and preserve its sweetness by keeping it cold (yeast remains dormant). Most pro craft breweries use top quality fruit extracts, made from real fruit.

 

[seatazzz]

I agree with the others, never boil fruit, and instead, add it to the primary. Only use a secondary IF you know how to transfer properly without risk oxidizing the batch. You could use a keg as a secondary, it's easy to purge the headspace with CO2.

2 pounds of fruit is not a real lot in a 5 gallon batch. Most of it is water, while the majority, if not all the sugars, which are responsible for flavor perception, will ferment out This will leave just color and a mere hint of the fruit's flavor behind.

If you want to prevent the fruit from fermenting out, you could add the strained pulp to a serving keg and preserve its sweetness by keeping it cold (yeast remains dormant). Most pro craft breweries use top quality fruit extracts, made from real fruit.

Based on the feedback I'm getting, I'm going to up the fruit to 5lbs for a 5 gallon batch. Using frozen so the cell walls are already semi-broken down. I'm also going to get some Loran raspberry extract, in case I need it for more flavor.

 

[seatazzz]

Okay guys, here's an update. Bought the raspberries today (geez could only get it in a 10lb box, guess I'm brewing this again someday) and did a gravity test. Came out to 5.1%, taste is a very nice smooth blonde with a hint of breadiness, not as much as I was going for, but I'm just happy the monstrous heat this week didn't ruin it. Now I've got a dilemma - I wanted to make sure I had enough beer to end up with 5+ gallons after the fruit addition (because the raspberries will soak some of that up, right?) and I'm concerned that adding 5lbs to the primary will make it overflow. So...should I take a chance and rack to a secondary? Or just add enough fruit so the beer doesn't overflow the primary? Or, as IslandLizard suggested, rack to the keg for secondary then rack off to another serving keg when it's done? I don't have the means to push it from one keg to another with co2 (I'm sure I could MacGyver something but I don't want to mess with it). Let me know what you think!

 

[seatazzz]

And never mind, took a chance and dumped them in. Primary didn't overflow (blowoff in place in case it decides to start up again) and they fit just fine. Now it's waiting time for at least a week!!

 

[IslandLizard]

And never mind, took a chance and dumped them in. Primary didn't overflow (blowoff in place in case it decides to start up again) and they fit just fine. Now it's waiting time for at least a week!!

It's not going to ferment like crazy and kick up a lot of krausen, so you're fine. Actually, for secondary fermentations, the least amount of headspace is encouraged, preventing air oxidizing your batch. In that light, a regular air lock is better than a wide open (blow-off) tube.

Since a lot of the fruit is floating, give the fermentor a little swirl each day to keep the fruit drenched in beer (alcohol). That helps prevent nasties from growing on top.

 

[seatazzz]

Thanks Islandlizard! I decided to leave just the airlock in. 24 hours later and I'm not seeing any activity so was a good choice. I moved the fermenter (and the tub it's in) to a cooler room in the house so that will take care of the swirling around for today, will give it a gentle swirl every day for the next week. Hope to keg this one up by next weekend if the flavor is where I want it. Will post a pic then as well. I haven't opened up the fermenter but shining a flashlight on the side shows it's starting to turn a nice red color. Can't wait for this one!

 

[IslandLizard]

Thanks Islandlizard! I decided to leave just the airlock in. 24 hours later and I'm not seeing any activity so was a good choice. I moved the fermenter (and the tub it's in) to a cooler room in the house so that will take care of the swirling around for today, will give it a gentle swirl every day for the next week. Hope to keg this one up by next weekend if the flavor is where I want it. Will post a pic then as well. I haven't opened up the fermenter but shining a flashlight on the side shows it's starting to turn a nice red color. Can't wait for this one!

How cold is that area? I would try to keep it above 66F. 68-72F (or even a little higher if that so happens) is ideal for a "secondary" week on fruit. If you'd leave it for a month, 62-64F would probably be more suitable. Opinions and results vary widely about target times and temps, these are just a guide.

Just be gentle with the swirling, you don't want it to slosh around too hard, beating air into it. Just enough to keep the tops wet with beer.

Can't wait to hear about your first taste. I expect it to be very good. You're kegging this, right? That means it will be ready for drinking sooner.

 

[seatazzz]

How cold is that area? I would try to keep it above 66F. 68-72F (or even a little higher if that so happens) is ideal for a "secondary" week on fruit. If you'd leave it for a month, 62-64F would probably be more suitable. Opinions and results vary widely about target times and temps, these are just a guide.

Just be gentle with the swirling, you don't want it to slosh around too hard, beating air into it. Just enough to keep the tops wet with beer.

Can't wait to hear about your first taste. I expect it to be very good. You're kegging this, right? That means it will be ready for drinking sooner.

The room it's in now is steady at about 74...yes maybe a bit high but it won't fluctuate as much as the hot garage does. I rocked it a bit about an hour ago without sloshing too much so will do that every day this week. I was also just toying with the idea of drawing a sample now to see where it's at (yes I'm careful with sanitation when pulling samples). And yes it will be kegged...I haven't bottled in over 6 months because I'm impatient by nature and having drinkable beer 3 days after it's "done" is hella better than 3 weeks later. :rockin:

 

[seatazzz]

Aaand I just gave it a taste. After 2 days on raspberries it's a beautiful light red, plenty of fruit in the nose and nicely tangy, but with kind of a bitter aftertaste, almost like too much hops or almost like quinine (like tonic water). I'm wondering if some corn sugar 1-2 days before crashing & kegging will help wiith that latent bitterness? Lemme have it guys, I'm doing this one by the seat of my pants and the advice I'm getting from HBT!!

 

[IslandLizard]

The room it's in now is steady at about 74...yes maybe a bit high but it won't fluctuate as much as the hot garage does. I rocked it a bit about an hour ago without sloshing too much so will do that every day this week. I was also just toying with the idea of drawing a sample now to see where it's at (yes I'm careful with sanitation when pulling samples). And yes it will be kegged...I haven't bottled in over 6 months because I'm impatient by nature and having drinkable beer 3 days after it's "done" is hella better than 3 weeks later. :rockin:

Is it in a bucket? You can suck out samples through the airlock hole, after removing the airlock. Use a 2' piece of skinny 5/16" OD tubing, snake it down into the beer, then suck to start the siphon. You need to have the suck zone below the beer level, so your head is near the floor or bottom of the fermentor. Don't let it flow back (!), pull the end out of the beer to stop the siphon.

I would definitely do a taste sample after a few days, to see where it's going. A half ounce to an ounce is enough. Repeat tastings every few days until it's ready to package.

You can also peek down that hole to check for things. After taking out a significant sized sample, like 4-6 ounces for a hydrometer test, and it needs to go longer, I always follow up with a good CO2 headspace flush to reduce the amount of air that infiltrated. That's why I like using kegs for longer term secondaries, alas, the final volume will be a quart or 2 less, not that different from using a 5 gallon carboy.

You can make a jumper hose from a piece of tubing with a liquid out QD on each end. You push in CO2 into one keg and it will transfer to the 2nd with the PRV open. Liquid "out" to liquid "in." A 100% pre-purged keg for receiving is best to keep it (almost) O2 free.

 

[seatazzz]

I just might try that with my next fermentation. This one is in a bucket...I do have a 7.5 gallon carboy but rarely use it. I'll give it a few days and taste it again, may just be too soon.

 

[seatazzz]

Ok guys here it is. Flavor is off the sheet raspberries, color turned out exactly what I wanted. Just kegged it, hope to have it ready by Wednesday. Thanks to everyone who commented and offered advice!