please review my first IPA recipe design

[dawn_kiebawls]

Hey guys and gals, I'm designing my first recipe and would appreciate any bit of advice from you more seasoned vets! After several months of thinking about this recipe, I decided to compare it to some existing IPA recipes and was very please to see that many of my ideas were right on track! This recipe will be a 'Honey Ginger IPA' for 2019s 12 beers of christmas so I want to fine tune it before its time to ship it out. Thanks again!

Recipe: Honey Ginger IPA
Type: All Grain
Batch size: 6 gallons (to make up for hop/trub loss)
Boil size: 7.25
Boil time: 60 minutes
Yeast: wy1318
Starter: Yes
OG: 1.070
FG: 1.010
IBU: 75
SRM: 5.8
Primary (Time and temp): 10 days, 67F
Secondary: none

Grain bill:

10lbs - 2 row
1lb - flaked oats
.75lb - honey malt
.5lb - carapils

Additional fermentables:

2lbs - honey, pasteurized, added at high krausen

Mash guidelines:

Single infusion - 155F (to add more body to combat the dryness from the honey)

Batch sparge

Hop schedule:

1oz Warrior (16% aa) - FWH
1oz Huell Melon (6% aa) - Flameout
2oz Tahoma (5% aa) - Whirlpool at 160F
1.5oz East Kent Golding - Whirlpool at 160F

Dry hop:

2oz Tahoma (5% aa) - 24-48 hours after pitching, 6 days
2oz Huell Melon (6% aa) - 24-48 hours after pitching, 6 days
2oz Calypso (13% aa) - 24-48 hours after pitching, 6 days
.5lb grated ginger - primary

I want to achieve a more pronounced ginger flavor/aroma balanced out by a subtle honey presence. I think the combination of the ginger and honey together will play well the the floral/tropical/citrusy hop selections. The hops I chose are from my local hop farm, as is the raw honey (just kind of cool to me that the bees pollinated the hops and created the honey for this brew). I am more than willing to change hop varieties, I just thought it would be cool to be as local as possible.

I'm designing this to be almost like a NEIPA hazy juice bomb, so I hope I'm on the right track. I am open to any and all suggestions/critiques and constructive criticism. Thanks again, cheers!

 

[catdaddy66]

That looks good but .5lb is a LOT of ginger, just saying.

Also like the hops but EKG flavor and aroma will likely get lost once dry hopped.

Pretty solid I think.

 

[dawn_kiebawls]

Pretty solid I think.

Thanks for the kind words! Since I plan to brew this quite a few times this spring/summer I'll cut back to .25lb of ginger to get a base line established, eliminate the EKG and replace with one of the other selected hop varieties. Being new to recipe design I'm just glad to hear anything other than 'all wrong!'.

I will keep this post updated as much as I can since there isn't much information on here with 'concrete' results as far as honey/ginger usage goes. Who knows, maybe this experiment will result in a recipe worthy of publishing on here. Thanks again. Cheers!

 

[IslandLizard]

It looks good.
Not sure if 1/4 pound is still too much ginger. I'd add maybe 2 ounces, give it 2 days (like a dry hop) and do a taste test to see where it's going. You can always add more, but never remove if it's too much.

I'd add the honey and (grated) ginger when fermentation is definitely past its peak, and has slowed down substantially. It will kick up a bit again, but I think it retains more flavor. I do the same with sugar syrups in Belgians, and sugar additions in Tripels, etc.

The dry hops, a la NEIPA style, don't go by time after pitching, but rather by attenuation. I like to add the first dry hop now at around 50-70% attenuation, and lately never before 50% anymore. Sometimes that is 18-24 hours after pitching, sometimes after 36-48 hours or even longer. I take a 4-6 oz hydrometer/taste sample through the airlock hole with a piece of skinny tubing, or put one drop on the refractometer and use the correction formula.

 

[dawn_kiebawls]

It looks good.
Not sure if 1/4 pound is still too much ginger. I'd add maybe 2 ounces, give it 2 days (like a dry hop) and do a taste test to see where it's going. You can always add more, but never remove if it's too much.

I'll cut it back to 2 or 3 ounces and adjust from there. I've even been thinking about a tincture for the future so I agree that in this situation less is more.

I'd add the honey and (grated) ginger when fermentation is definitely past its peak, and has slowed down substantially. It will kick up a bit again, but I think it retains more flavor. I do the same with sugar syrups in Belgians, and sugar additions in Tripels, etc.

That is a good idea, thanks for the advice. Aside from drying out the beer I would like to retain as much honey flavor as I can. That may also solve the mystery for why my Caramel Amber didn't have much caramel flavor at all since I added the caramel syrup to the boil. I'll try your method from now on!

The dry hops, a la NEIPA style, don't go by time after pitching, but rather by attenuation. I like to add the first dry hop now at around 50-70% attenuation, and lately never before 50% anymore. Sometimes that is 18-24 hours after pitching, sometimes after 36-48 hours or even longer. I take a 4-6 oz hydrometer/taste sample through the airlock hole with a piece of skinny tubing, or put one drop on the refractometer and use the correction formula.

Very interesting to hear about dry hopping based on attenuation, thats new to me. Looks like I'll have to find a calculator and track attenuation more closely than I have been (definitely not a bad thing. I love brewing data!!) At what temperature do you dry hop? I've been reading that 67-70F is optimal but have no experience to look back on to cross reference my readings. Thanks again for all the encouragement and help!

 

[IslandLizard]

Very interesting to hear about dry hopping based on attenuation, thats new to me. Looks like I'll have to find a calculator and track attenuation more closely than I have been (definitely not a bad thing. I love brewing data!!) At what temperature do you dry hop? I've been reading that 67-70F is optimal but have no experience to look back on to cross reference my readings. Thanks again for all the encouragement and help!

I eyeball attenuation, it's not that critical.
For example: OG is 1.060, FG estimated at 1.012.
50% attenuation: 60 - (60-12)*0.5 = 60-24 = 36 ==> 1.036
70% attenuation: 60 - (60-12)*0.7 = 60-34 = 26 ==> 1.026

I dry hop at ferm temps, so 65-68F, and don't cold crash until at least 3-4 days after the last hop addition. Although when in a hurry, I've stirred dry hopped beer a few times a day for 2 days, then cold crashed for 24 hours. This is in a closed bucket, under CO2. Transferred to keg with a homemade hop filter over the racking cane. The beer (a NEIPA) was super young, 5 days grain to glass, and wonderful!

I'll cut it back to 2 or 3 ounces and adjust from there. I've even been thinking about a tincture for the future so I agree that in this situation less is more.

The alcohol in the beer and its sheer volume helps with good and fast flavor extraction. A tincture needs to be concentrated, which IMO is hard to do with ginger. Don't boil the ginger either, it changes flavor drastically, especially when you're after its super-fragrant high notes.

Maybe put the grated ginger in a roomy hop sack with a few marbles and tie off with a piece of unflavored floss so you can agitate it a few times a day? If using a bucket, route the floss through the airlock hole. Keep the beer's exposure to air at a minimum of course. Flush headspace with CO2 after tinkering with additions.*
Or just toss in loose and give it a swirl.

* Lately I've been using much more CO2 during fermentation than with prepurging or dispensing kegs.

 

[Gravity]

That looks good but .5lb is a LOT of ginger, just saying.

Also like the hops but EKG flavor and aroma will likely get lost once dry hopped.

Pretty solid I think.

+1

Personally I think you should cut out all the adjuncts, especially the ginger as it will conflict with the hops in this case

First time brewers should always try to make a "normal" beer first to get a feel for that style of beer first - like an IPA before trying to hit a home-run with speciality beer - just an opinion though

 

[FatDragon]

+1

Personally I think you should cut out all the adjuncts, especially the ginger as it will conflict with the hops in this case

First time brewers should always try to make a "normal" beer first to get a feel for that style of beer first - like an IPA before trying to hit a home-run with speciality beer - just an opinion though

First-time recipe designer and first-time brewer are two different things, and this is for a beer-trading event that people on this forum do every year, so OP is signed up for the Honey Ginger IPA slot and needs to brew and deliver a Honey Ginger IPA.

@dawn_kiebawls - I thought the 12 Beers of Christmas thing was based on 12 established recipes, though I might be wrong with that. Have you confirmed that you're supposed to design your own recipe and not brew an existing recipe? Either way, you could look at previous 12 Beers threads and consult with people who have done the Honey Ginger IPA before.

 

[Gravity]

First-time recipe designer and first-time brewer are two different things, and this is for a beer-trading event that people on this forum do every year, so OP is signed up for the Honey Ginger IPA slot and needs to brew and deliver a Honey Ginger IPA.

@dawn_kiebawls - I thought the 12 Beers of Christmas thing was based on 12 established recipes, though I might be wrong with that. Have you confirmed that you're supposed to design your own recipe and not brew an existing recipe? Either way, you could look at previous 12 Beers threads and consult with people who have done the Honey Ginger IPA before.

I agree - worlds apart

Not knowing the 12 beers of Christmas context however, my feedback would be the same if he's asking for constructive criticism - the amount of ginger in this recipe, in my opinion, would not work well with the hops - the honey would however

In full disclosure, i'm not a fan of ginger in beer

Best of luck with the exchange

 

[FatDragon]

Here's what I see copied from one of the 12 Beers of Christmas threads:

8. HONEY GINGER IPA - Ginger was a popular ingredient in British beers prior to 1850, and here we're
pairing it with a dab of honey. Start with an IPA, and brew and ferment as normal. Once transferred
to the secondary, add 2 pounds of honey, plus 2 ounces of candied ginger, coarsely chopped. This is a
higher-quality ginger than the stuff in the produce section, less pungent and less earthy. I would use
British East Kent Goldings hops exclusively. Gravity: 1.065 (15.5*P). Color: pale amber.

Not sure how true to the recipe/intention the expectations are, but this should serve as a starting point if you haven't seen it. If you have, it might be a good reference point for other commenters on this thread.

Any reason for going with fresh ginger over the candied suggested in the recipe?

 

[IslandLizard]

@dawn_kiebawls - I thought the 12 Beers of Christmas thing was based on 12 established recipes

plus 2 ounces of candied ginger, coarsely chopped. This is a
higher-quality ginger than the stuff in the produce section, less pungent and less earthy.

Yeah, that's a whole different kind of ginger. He could make it himself if so inclined if he can find those young ginger shoots, or just order a jar of the candied version, which is most proper to stick closely to the given recipe.

 

[Gravity]

Yeah, that's a whole different kind of ginger. He could make it himself if so inclined if he can find those young ginger shoots, or just order a jar of the candied version, which is most proper to stick closely to the given recipe.

Any well stocked grocery store carries candied ginger in the "ethnic" aisle OR guaranteed at any asian grocery store; you may have to ask and look around

 

[troglodytes]

I do a saison every summer that at this point I'm going to call perfected (for my tastes, but then again I love ginger). I use a quarter pound of grated fresh ginger along with the peels of 5 lemons soaked in gin as a "dry hop" While the flavor is only over powering when its fresh fresh fresh, it ages and blends into something fantastic in about a month. I also use about 4 oz of whirlpool/dry hop of Sorachi Ace. So I do know that you can use a bit of ginger with a decent kick of hop flavor/aroma and have it not be off-putting. However, the saison yeast has a lot of character and kind of brings everything together. If this were brewed as an IPA with a clean yeast, there is no place for that ginger to hide. I'd be very wary of using double the ginger I usually use, I don't think 3/4# of honey malt can offset that flavor.

Also, my Sorachi Ace as late addition has always given my that lemon zest aroma/flavor (not dill as some have experienced) and between the peppery yeast, black pepper addition, lemon and ginger, all flavors complement each other. I've be worried about Huell Melon and Calypso being, either wasted by being completely over shadowed, or clashing in flavor. I've never used Tahoma, but based on the flavor descriptors, I would think about focusing on that hop (or with an earthy noble hop like EKG if you want) to compliment the ginger addition.

 

[dawn_kiebawls]

First time brewers should always try to make a "normal" beer first to get a feel for that style of beer first - like an IPA before trying to hit a home-run with speciality beer - just an opinion though

As others have pointed out, I'm not a first time brewer. This is just my first recipe design for a specific swap.

@dawn_kiebawls - I thought the 12 Beers of Christmas thing was based on 12 established recipes, though I might be wrong with that. Have you confirmed that you're supposed to design your own recipe and not brew an existing recipe? Either way, you could look at previous 12 Beers threads and consult with people who have done the Honey Ginger IPA before.

The guidelines for the exchange are to follow the 'recipe' from Randy Moshers 'Radical Brewing', which simply states to 'start with an IPA recipe' so he is just outlining to add honey and ginger. We discussed in the new 12BoC thread that we could use a little creativity this year so I just figured a Honey Ginger NEIPA would qualify, since it still an IPA. I'll chime in on the active exchange thread and see, for one, if that would be allowed, and if I should stick to the EKG exclusive note in the recipe guidelines.

I do a saison every summer that at this point I'm going to call perfected (for my tastes, but then again I love ginger). I use a quarter pound of grated fresh ginger along with the peels of 5 lemons soaked in gin as a "dry hop" While the flavor is only over powering when its fresh fresh fresh, it ages and blends into something fantastic in about a month. I also use about 4 oz of whirlpool/dry hop of Sorachi Ace. So I do know that you can use a bit of ginger with a decent kick of hop flavor/aroma and have it not be off-putting. However, the saison yeast has a lot of character and kind of brings everything together. If this were brewed as an IPA with a clean yeast, there is no place for that ginger to hide. I'd be very wary of using double the ginger I usually use, I don't think 3/4# of honey malt can offset that flavor.

Also, my Sorachi Ace as late addition has always given my that lemon zest aroma/flavor (not dill as some have experienced) and between the peppery yeast, black pepper addition, lemon and ginger, all flavors complement each other. I've be worried about Huell Melon and Calypso being, either wasted by being completely over shadowed, or clashing in flavor. I've never used Tahoma, but based on the flavor descriptors, I would think about focusing on that hop (or with an earthy noble hop like EKG if you want) to compliment the ginger addition.

I'm glad to hear your results using 1/4lb of ginger with good results since it sounds like we love ginger equally. I was concerned with using a clean ale yeast as well, so I'll likely start with less ginger for the first batch to see how prominent it is since as you mentioned there is nowhere for it to hide.

As for the hops, you may be right. I'll go back to the drawing board. I thought about some nobles, but in my opinion/experience they have always yielded unsatisfying IPAs for my taste. Maybe I'll do a split batch with the tropical/fruit bombs and one with the Tahoma/EKG and see which one works the best and go from there. Thanks for the help!

Is there any way I could convince you to share your ginger saison recipe? It sounds wonderful and that is one area I haven't devoted much time to tinkering yet!