Plate cooler sanitation

[Philmac]

I have had a bad run- lost 2 batches in a row and i have not lost one in a long time and never back-to-back! So i was thinking about what the issue could be and i've narrowed it down to either
a scrape in the inside of my fermenter.
Or the cleaning of my plate cooler- i immerse my plate cooler in sanitiser for a good while before rinsing it out with water- would that be sufficient to clean the plate cooler or is this where my issue is occuring?

Thanks!

 

[schematix]

I have had a bad run- lost 2 batches in a row and i have not lost one in a long time and never back-to-back! So i was thinking about what the issue could be and i've narrowed it down to either
a scrape in the inside of my fermenter.
Or the cleaning of my plate cooler- i immerse my plate cooler in sanitiser for a good while before rinsing it out with water- would that be sufficient to clean the plate cooler or is this where my issue is occuring?

Thanks!

Plate chillers clog up and hold gunk easily. You need heat. Try recirculating the hot HLT through it if you can. Or get an IC and don’t worry about it.

 

[IslandLizard]

You certainly need to "backwash" it to remove any gunk buildup inside.
Attach a hose from your garden spigot to the side that had wort in it. Make sure the spigot has unrestricted pressure. Then blow it out, back and forth each way (reversing the flow), a few times until no more flakes are coming out.

After that you can either, or both:

• Shake all the water out and bake in a 450-500F oven for a few hours to burn all the leftovers. Then flush again.
• Recirculate hot PBW, possibly reinforced with some lye, drain opener, just be careful and use face and eye protection.

Next time, do anything to prevent hops from going through your plate chiller. Bag all your hops (use roomy, fine mesh hop bags), use a hop spider, or hop basket.

The hot and cold break are fine enough to pass through the narrow crevices between the plates, but still need to get backwashed out of course after each use. Sanitize during each brew by recirculating boiling wort through it 10' before flameout.

Do not keep filled or submersed in Starsan for extended times, as the acid may attack the copper brazing and cause leaks over time.

 

[IslandLizard]

Infections can come from many places. If you suspect a scratched plastic bucket/fermentor, why not buy and use a new one?

Also clean, and take apart your kettle valve periodically, there can be wort build up behind the ball, providing a place for bugs to hide out. Also clean and brush threaded connections anywhere.

 

[schematix]

• Recirculate hot PBW, possibly reinforced with some lye, drain opener, just be careful and use face and eye protection.

Lye attacks the copper braze used in most plate chillers.

I have recirculated 180F PBW through my plate chiller many, many, many times... even recirculating boiling water through it between that. And yet it is still blowing out chunks of hops. It's pretty much uncleanable IMO.

 

[IslandLizard]

Lye attacks the copper braze used in most plate chillers.

I have recirculated 180F PBW through my plate chiller many, many, many times... even recirculating boiling water through it between that. And yet it is still blowing out chunks of hops. It's pretty much uncleanable IMO.

I did not realize copper being attacked by lye. Luckily haven't sprung a leak yet.

Baking in the oven periodically, has helped keeping mine clean for years. Maybe even better during self cleaning cycles at 650F, to help turn the pulp into ash.

Last year, before I started bagging everything, I encountered a major plug up due to operator error (me).
The kitchen faucet could not dislodge it. Then I realized the pressure in those faucet systems is being highly reduced. So I took the problem outside. The pressure from the outside spigot, 10' from the 1" supply line, was indeed much, much higher. It still took baking and backwashing, reversing the flow repeatedly, for the fountain to reach 4' when finally all had cleared out. I had been eying up the fire hydrant on the corner already...

 

[augiedoggy]

You can always take measures to keep the hops out of the plate chiller in the first place... Its honestly the best way to prevent issues with it. Ive made many many beers using larger hop spiders and I know people say it inhibits the hop efficiency in beer but I dont see it. I use 2 300 mesh spider/ baskets for hoppy beers and one for the malty beers where less hops are used.. ZERO issues with hops in my plate chiller

 

[Philmac]

Cleaned it out with boiling water and then warm water and detergent for a good bit last night- there was not *that* much gunk in it... Will be sure to get it proper sanitised next brew... Not even sure it it is the cause of my problems but i think it's prime suspect..!

 

[schematix]

What i find interesting about my plate clogger is that every time i do a PBW or boiling water recirc through it, thinking i finally have it all out, it still blows out more chunks.

No joke i've run boiling water through it more than a dozen times, plus half a dozen hot PBW cycles, without putting wort through it again and it still has stuff coming out of it.

And this is a chiller that was PBW back flushed and water back flushed every brew day when I used it.

 

[IslandLizard]

What i find interesting about my plate clogger is that every time i do a PBW or boiling water recirc through it, thinking i finally have it all out, it still blows out more chunks.

No joke i've run boiling water through it more than a dozen times, plus half a dozen hot PBW cycles, without putting wort through it again and it still has stuff coming out of it.

And this is a chiller that was PBW back flushed and water back flushed every brew day when I used it.

Plate chillers' biggest asset is also its main problem. All passages in a plate chiller are parallel.* The wort/water/cleaner follows the path of least resistance. When passages (partially) clog up, the wort will go around them or through remaining open ones. Therefore it's very difficult to create enough flow and pressure to push clogs out. Hence some of the procedures are needed as I described above.

* There are a few exceptions.
Some (homebrew) plate chiller (e.g., The Therminator) allegedly have sets of plates connected in series, but it doesn't alleviate the issue of liquids bypassing clogs.
Only commercial size plate chillers are serviceable inside, IOW, they can be taken apart for periodic cleaning or when necessary. Commercial breweries store a lye solution in them when not in use.

 

[IslandLizard]

Cleaned it out with boiling water and then warm water and detergent for a good bit last night- there was not *that* much gunk in it... Will be sure to get it proper sanitised next brew... Not even sure it it is the cause of my problems but i think it's prime suspect..!

Not sure if gunk buildup inside the plate chiller is indeed the cause of the infections, but you need to follow the procedures I outlined before to assess whether there's gunk build up inside. For example, you need that high pressure/high volume from your outdoor spigot to have a chance at blowing it out. The incineration (baking) process is also part of that process.

 

[schematix]

I've looked for confirmation of the internal design of the blichmann clogginator but can't seem to find anything. My suspicion is that it's internal passages are arranged in a "Z" configuration. Meaning you have a stage of plates in parallel, then some in series, followed by another set in parallel.

You can tell it's not all series plates because you'll see alternating water and wort streams when you first blow it out.

The path of least resistance is really the problem. If one gets even somewhat clogged you no longer have flow through that area to clean it.

I contacted blichmann about baking it and they said not to. I don't know why though. I don't know what kind of time/temp would be required to clean it without risking damage to the brazing. The sticker is obviously going to get roasted....

Thoughts?

 

[IslandLizard]

I contacted blichmann about baking it and they said not to. I don't know why though. I don't know what kind of time/temp would be required to clean it without risking damage to the brazing. The sticker is obviously going to get roasted....

I have a smallish, 30 plate DudaDiesel plate chiller, about 3/4 the height of a 40-plate Therminator, and a little shorter and narrower. It's been baked at least 40 times over the years, usually around 450F (usually together with pizza or bread) and had near boiling PBW/lye recirculated for several hours many a time.

One of my brew friends has a larger chiller, twice the width and a bit longer than mine. Not a DudaDiesel from what I've seen. He routinely brews 15 gallon batches and has never had any clogs from what he's said. He recirculates and whirlpools, uses a simple side pickup, no screens, no baskets, no spiders or bags, even on NEIPAs. The extra width provides more passages around any potential clogs, or perhaps the passages are a tad wider? He got that on eBay a good year ago. I haven't found the one he has, anywhere.

 

[augiedoggy]

duda b23 20 or 30 plate chiller here (cant remember for sure which) Blichmann uses a unique convoluted twisted pathway inside thier so ive read which seems to help them plug up easier... despite the good job they usually do I dont think the engineering team did enough testing when they designed that product for real world application but Ive seen so many plugged therminator threads here and seen my friends therminator plug to a trickle..